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Post by towerman on Jan 15, 2016 16:55:25 GMT
I think the 25 would benifit from running in overlapping sections say Ilford-Aldgate & Stratford-Oxford Circus with end to end running evenings & Sundays.
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Post by kmkcheng on Jan 15, 2016 18:00:17 GMT
I remember growing up the 226 operated in 2 sections
Golders Green - Alperton & Park Royal - Burnt Oak
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Post by Deleted on Jan 15, 2016 18:04:52 GMT
I think the 25 would benifit from running in overlapping sections say Ilford-Aldgate & Stratford-Oxford Circus with end to end running evenings & Sundays. Yep definetly but of course under different numbers as the passengers would get very confused as it's a non speaking English area where they recoignise buses through the veichle types also I see this happening with Crossrail hence only got a 3 year new contract, I'd also would like to see a Stratord link with Elephant & Castle. Speaking of overlapping sections of course there's known now but on group of routes that link over each other are the 16,32,316,332 up to the point where they practically duplicate each other for long strands of the route.
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Post by vjaska on Jan 15, 2016 18:21:27 GMT
Indeed though the 137 wasn't run in overlapping sections before the 417 was introduced as the 137A was simply renumbered 417 whereas the 2 & 36 both operated with overlapping sections before the Brixton to Crystal Palace & Paddington to Lewisham sections were renumbered 432 & 436 respectively. The 109 used to run in overlapping sections until it was cut back to Brixton - the overlapping sections were Purley to Brixton & Croydon to Trafalgar Square. I'm pretty certain that the 137 did used to run in overlapping sections when it ran north of Oxford Circus to Archway. I don't believe all the buses ran Crystal Palace to Archway. The top bit was hived off into the 135 which was then faffed around with years and years until LRT seemed to settle on the 88 doing the Oxo to Camden bit and the 134 picking up the Warren St - Archway traffic. What is quite telling is how many pretty long bits of routes with multiple services in inner North London have been whittled down to 1 or 2 routes these days. Examples are the 135 going, the 27 to Archway going, the 221 lost south of Turnpike Lane, the 17 lost north of Archway. Well before my time lol - once the 137A was introduced, overlapping sections ended on the 137 as both routes ran from Oxford Circus but the 137A continued beyond Telford Avenue to Palace.
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Post by T.R. on Jan 16, 2016 12:22:53 GMT
Was 53 and/or 260 ever run in overlapping sections?
I suppose "routes split in two" don't necessarily count? (6/26, 14/91*, 22/242*, 112/232, 141/172*, 171/341 etc)
* pairs no longer meet
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Post by snoggle on Jan 16, 2016 12:45:43 GMT
Was 53 and/or 260 ever run in overlapping sections? I suppose "routes split in two" don't necessarily count? (6/26, 14/91*, 22/242*, 112/232, 141/172*, 171/341 etc) * pairs no longer meet Looking at Darius Grigg's Flickr collection of old LT timetables the 53 had supplementary sectional working but to a common terminus at Plumstead. Some buses ran from Oxford Circus, others from Camden Town and others from Parliament Hill Fields. Therefore one destination going south but three going north! The 260 doesn't seem to have had overlaps during the 80s/90s. It did get a Saturdays only extra service from Willesden Junction to Golders Green alongside the North Finchley - Shepherds Bush service. I assume this is because there was a lot of demand through Willesden and Cricklewood on Saturdays which was the main shopping day back then.
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linus
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If it ain't broke, fix it till it is.
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Post by linus on Jan 16, 2016 13:34:38 GMT
The 16 used to run from Victoria to Sudbury Town Station and was progressively chopped up into 245, 316 and 332. Originally it used to run in two overlapping sections: Victoria - Cricklewood or Neasden; and Kilburn Park Station (which was off the main route!) - Sudbury. Early morning and weekends it ran through.
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Post by snoggle on Jan 16, 2016 18:16:45 GMT
I think the 25 would benifit from running in overlapping sections say Ilford-Aldgate & Stratford-Oxford Circus with end to end running evenings & Sundays. I don't. I think it could benefit from there being a complete ban on roadworks between Ilford and Oxford Circus. It might then have half a chance of running reliably. Being a route controller for any route through Aldgate or along the A11 must be one of the worst jobs in London's bus industry at the moment.
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Post by riverside on Jan 18, 2016 12:26:38 GMT
Before bendy buses were introduced, the 12 used to run between Notting Hill Gate - Peckham & Oxford Circus - Dulwich Library (I think) When thw world was in B&W, the 12 ran from Harlesden Willesden Junction to Dulwich the Plough, and Oxford Circus to TC garage. At one time it ran from 6(!) garages with a PVR of 120. Attached is a copy of a 1958 timetable from Ian Armstrong's bus route web page. View AttachmentOn a Sunday when the 49 took over the Shepherds Bush to Harlesden section the 12 ran all the way through from the garage at Wells Road in Shepherds Bush to South Croydon Garage. Ironically on that day of the week neither of those two garages operated on the route.
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Post by M1104 on Jan 18, 2016 13:02:42 GMT
When thw world was in B&W, the 12 ran from Harlesden Willesden Junction to Dulwich the Plough, and Oxford Circus to TC garage. At one time it ran from 6(!) garages with a PVR of 120. Attached is a copy of a 1958 timetable from Ian Armstrong's bus route web page. View AttachmentOn a Sunday when the 49 took over the Shepherds Bush to Harlesden section the 12 ran all the way through from the garage at Wells Road in Shepherds Bush to South Croydon Garage. Ironically on that day of the week neither of those two garages operated on the route. Just reminded me of a brief time when S ran a section of the 12 between East Acton and the West End (not sure whether it was Oxford Circus, Piccadilly Circus or Trafalgar Square). This was shortly before the 94 was introduced* and the 88's withdrawal between Oxford Circus and Acton Green. I remember seeing a Metrobus on a bush route which was incorrectly showing part of route 12 on the back, which I had then assumed was for Sunday operation (mainly maintain by Q on that day of the week). AFAIK none of the Metrobuses appeared on the 12, which would have been rare sights worthy of the camera. * - S basically maintaining that section but with a new number
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Post by bookd on Feb 6, 2016 10:23:47 GMT
In the past sectional running was much more common; a browse through a 1976 timetable shows that the 279 ran in three sections, which was unusual. These were Hammond Street - Manor House, Waltham Cross - Finsbury Park and Lower Edmonton - Smithfield.
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Post by thesquirrels on Feb 6, 2016 10:38:06 GMT
The 36 ran in sections into the 2000s, typically Lewisham - Paddington (later the 436) and New Cross Gate - Queens Park, though the evening (and Sunday?) service ran through. There were still short journeys to beef up capacity on the heavily trafficked NX-Victoria section at many times of day.
The 29 was another example, Trafalgar Square to Wood Green and Camden to Palmers Green, and was quite unusual in running in sections at all times, as did the 253.
Missed two pages of the thread where these routes are covered.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2016 11:06:32 GMT
On a Sunday when the 49 took over the Shepherds Bush to Harlesden section the 12 ran all the way through from the garage at Wells Road in Shepherds Bush to South Croydon Garage. Ironically on that day of the week neither of those two garages operated on the route. Just reminded me of a brief time when S ran a section of the 12 between East Acton and the West End (not sure whether it was Oxford Circus, Piccadilly Circus or Trafalgar Square). This was shortly before the 94 was introduced* and the 88's withdrawal between Oxford Circus and Acton Green. I remember seeing a Metrobus on a bush route which was incorrectly showing part of route 12 on the back, which I had then assumed was for Sunday operation (mainly maintain by Q on that day of the week). AFAIK none of the Metrobuses appeared on the 12, which would have been rare sights worthy of the camera. * - S basically maintaining that section but with a new number S used to run the Mon-Sat except evening service between Oxford Circus and East Acton DuCane Rd. I did see S Metrobuses occasionally out on this section. There is also a picture of a S Metrobus somewhere south if the river crew operated on a trip to Norwood Junction. I think then the 88 was cut in two before the western end being renumbered 94 . The 88 ran briefly to Turnham Green ! The 281 has scheduled two sectional operation on Rugby Days, Teddington to Hounslow and Tolworth to Twickenham.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 6, 2016 20:40:38 GMT
The 25, when crew operated in the 1970's used to run in two overlapping sections, Becontree Heath - Stratford and Ilford to Victoria.
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Post by riverside on Feb 6, 2016 20:48:28 GMT
Was 53 and/or 260 ever run in overlapping sections? I suppose "routes split in two" don't necessarily count? (6/26, 14/91*, 22/242*, 112/232, 141/172*, 171/341 etc) * pairs no longer meet Looking at Darius Grigg's Flickr collection of old LT timetables the 53 had supplementary sectional working but to a common terminus at Plumstead. Some buses ran from Oxford Circus, others from Camden Town and others from Parliament Hill Fields. Therefore one destination going south but three going north! The 260 doesn't seem to have had overlaps during the 80s/90s. It did get a Saturdays only extra service from Willesden Junction to Golders Green alongside the North Finchley - Shepherds Bush service. I assume this is because there was a lot of demand through Willesden and Cricklewood on Saturdays which was the main shopping day back then. From June 1970 till October 1978 the 260 was a very confusing route. It did not run in overlapping sections but none of the 3 garages that operated the route served it all. On Mondays to Fridays Stonebridge Park Garage operated the route between North Finchley and Harlesden(Willesden Junction) with a rush hour extension to Acton Vale(Bromyard Avenue). On Saturdays Willesden Garage took charge running between Harlesden and Golders Green. On Sundays it was the turn of Finchley Garage to run the route running between Willesden Garage and Barnet(Chesterfield Road). RMs were the allocation from each garage and there were three different intermediate blinds, one for each garage. As part of the second stage of Busplan this complex route was standardised to run from North Finchley to Hammersmith Broadway using RMs from Willesden garage, thus recreating the old 660 trolleybus route that had been withdrawn in January 1962. Such a complicated route pattern was obviously an attempt by LT to tailor routes to public demand within the constraints of limited budgetary resources. The result was interesting for enthusiasts but potentially confusing for passengers. TfL quite rightly would not sanction such a complicated route nowadays.
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