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Post by mondraker275 on Sept 6, 2016 15:47:40 GMT
There probably will be a hidden time flexibility. I know there definitely is one on the bike hire, as twice I used the bike for 31 and 32 minutes respectively and did not get charged. I beg to differ. At the end of trips I always print out a journey record. One time I was 47 seconds over and was charged the £2. I have several others examples of being a minute or so over and still being charged. Do you have any documentation saying that there is a "buffer"? I printed the journeys out as well, and they said 31 minutes and 32 minutes. These were the only two times I knew I was close to the limit, and I printed the journeys and found out I was not charged later. Obviously, if there was a buffer, TfL wont tell anyone, but I am quite sure there is one. It stops any annoying hassle TfL might get about someone complaining about seconds, delays, couldnt get the bike in the stand etc.
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Post by londonbusboy on Sept 7, 2016 20:57:11 GMT
so will TfL finally be modernising the ticket machines used on buses?
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Post by snoggle on Sept 8, 2016 9:48:59 GMT
so will TfL finally be modernising the ticket machines used on buses? Why would they need to? The logic to calculate the Hopper "cap" is in the card (or back room system for contactless users) not the ETM. The old Project Nimbus that would have replaced the ETMs was cancelled about 3-4 years ago. I've not seen anything in TfL paperwork that indicates TfL are planning ETM replacement any time soon even though I know the machines are knackered. Their immediate priority is on unbundling I-Bus so they can replace the system in modules and get out of the supplier lock in they currently have. They are also replacing their IT systems that manage bus schedules and which link in to a range of other systems like I-Bus and the calculation system for contract payments.
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Post by londonbusboy on Sept 8, 2016 18:01:56 GMT
so will TfL finally be modernising the ticket machines used on buses? Why would they need to? The logic to calculate the Hopper "cap" is in the card (or back room system for contactless users) not the ETM. The old Project Nimbus that would have replaced the ETMs was cancelled about 3-4 years ago. I've not seen anything in TfL paperwork that indicates TfL are planning ETM replacement any time soon even though I know the machines are knackered. Their immediate priority is on unbundling I-Bus so they can replace the system in modules and get out of the supplier lock in they currently have. They are also replacing their IT systems that manage bus schedules and which link in to a range of other systems like I-Bus and the calculation system for contract payments. thanks i got the impression that they were when reading your other reply
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Post by snoggle on Sept 14, 2016 9:17:06 GMT
So has anyone successfully impersonated a frog or a rabbit and "hopped" and saved their second bus fare?
Any feedback from the drivers on the forum about whether people are already moaning about connecting buses being late and not getting a free second fare?
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2016 10:37:47 GMT
TfL introduced a 'one more journey' a while back so bus users could make a single trip or connection on payg with an insufficient balance (ie touching on would put the value at a negative balance.)
So if one makes a journey which starts on an insufficient balance does the hopper ticket still apply? I would personally think so but I'm thinking about how the system is wired when starting a connecting journey on the red.
EDIT: Just double checked, and no you can't. I can imagine that being an issue which could result in a headache for drivers and longer dwell times to be honest, maybe TfL could revisit that in due course. I don't see the value in telling someone to go away and top up within an hour so they can have their hopper fare, it's going to be a pain for the customer as well, "ain't nobody got time for that" springs to mind.
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PaulH
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Post by PaulH on Sept 14, 2016 11:00:45 GMT
So has anyone successfully impersonated a frog or a rabbit and "hopped" and saved their second bus fare? Any feedback from the drivers on the forum about whether people are already moaning about connecting buses being late and not getting a free second fare? Looking at my Oyster Journey History I have only been charged for the first element of yesterday's two journeys. There is a blue 'i' against the 'free' part which says 'You have not been charged for this journey as it is viewed as a continuation of your previous journey'. Attachment Deleted
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Post by westhamgeezer on Sept 14, 2016 16:31:38 GMT
TfL introduced a 'one more journey' a while back so bus users could make a single trip or connection on payg with an insufficient balance (ie touching on would put the value at a negative balance.) So if one makes a journey which starts on an insufficient balance does the hopper ticket still apply? I would personally think so but I'm thinking about how the system is wired when starting a connecting journey on the red. EDIT: Just double checked, and no you can't. I can imagine that being an issue which could result in a headache for drivers and longer dwell times to be honest, maybe TfL could revisit that in due course. I don't see the value in telling someone to go away and top up within an hour so they can have their hopper fare, it's going to be a pain for the customer as well, "ain't nobody got time for that" springs to mind. A friend of mine just got an emergency oyster ticket, topped up then got on another bus within the hour. Wants to know if second journey is still free? I'd assume so but not 100% sure So has anyone successfully impersonated a frog or a rabbit and "hopped" and saved their second bus fare? Any feedback from the drivers on the forum about whether people are already moaning about connecting buses being late and not getting a free second fare? Looking at my Oyster Journey History I have only been charged for the first element of yesterday's two journeys. There is a blue 'i' against the 'free' part which says 'You have not been charged for this journey as it is viewed as a continuation of your previous journey'. View Attachment
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2016 16:55:40 GMT
westhamgeezer his hopper ticket should apply according to TfL website, he had sufficient funds to start the connection within the hour, that element is key. EDIT: and if he got on a two or three door boarding vehicle, he needed to present the card to the driver's reader to get the emergency ticket (ie not a stand-alone reader) which is also key, but since you said he got the emergency ticket I see no problem.
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Post by abc on Sept 15, 2016 17:24:44 GMT
What happens if you do not get the emergency ticket? (Assuming no ticket inspector boards)
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2016 4:51:35 GMT
What happens if you do not get the emergency ticket? (Assuming no ticket inspector boards) Nothing I guess according to your question. It could be a revenue thing for when an inspector boards... which I don't see the point in because AFAIA (someone with better knowledge please correct as necessary) the card reader revenue uses already tells them the balance and if the card was touched on the current bus. Looking at TfL's website it seems that the emergency fare slip is just a reminder to top up.
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Post by mondraker275 on Sept 17, 2016 9:21:31 GMT
What happens if you do not get the emergency ticket? (Assuming no ticket inspector boards) Nothing I guess according to your question. It could be a revenue thing for when an inspector boards... which I don't see the point in because AFAIA (someone with better knowledge please correct as necessary) the card reader revenue uses already tells them the balance and if the card was touched on the current bus. Looking at TfL's website it seems that the emergency fare slip is just a reminder to top up. To confirm Its not an 'emergency ticket' but just clarification that you have a negative balance. This ticket was proposed as when cashless was going to be introduced there were questions as to how passengers would know if they had used their 'extra' journey. Oyster cards generally do not work with a negative balance. Unless the system has changed the only times you can use them with a negative balance is with bus season tickets , even then I believe there is a limit to how much in the negative you can be. For example, if you have -10p, then you can upload a new bus season ticket. The same does not apply to travelcards, as there is a chance you increase your negative balance. I have used the hopper, and I think if it is going to really useful, or groundbreaking like its being made out to be, it needs to increase to 2 hours with the unlimited changes. Otherwise, its just a small help. Every little helps though. TfL estimates that 30 millions journeys will benefit (or would have benefited it was used in the last year), thats not many. I read somewhere that 30000 free journeys were used by 8:30 AM, yes AM on Monday (the first day). However, those like me critical of every stat I see, after some thinking remembered, that when I was out and about, that Monday was Eid, and I saw a lot of people around 7-8 am going to the mosques and coming back, therefore those figures seem inflated in my opinion.
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Post by snoggle on Sept 17, 2016 10:01:39 GMT
I have used the hopper, and I think if it is going to really useful, or groundbreaking like its being made out to be, it needs to increase to 2 hours with the unlimited changes. Otherwise, its just a small help. Every little helps though. TfL estimates that 30 millions journeys will benefit (or would have benefited it was used in the last year), thats not many. I read somewhere that 30000 free journeys were used by 8:30 AM, yes AM on Monday (the first day). However, those like me critical of every stat I see, after some thinking remembered, that when I was out and about, that Monday was Eid, and I saw a lot of people around 7-8 am going to the mosques and coming back, therefore those figures seem inflated in my opinion. The Mayor tweeted this. Apparently the millionth trip was on a 436 bus. Even allowing for an initial peak while people try out the system I think the 30 million jny estimate in a year is something of an under estimate. Now either the revenue impact is going to be dreadful or a lot of people are making new trips which is likely to be a good thing. Obviously it's very early days and you can't draw any real conclusions for a while yet.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Sept 17, 2016 13:18:06 GMT
Nothing I guess according to your question. It could be a revenue thing for when an inspector boards... which I don't see the point in because AFAIA (someone with better knowledge please correct as necessary) the card reader revenue uses already tells them the balance and if the card was touched on the current bus. Looking at TfL's website it seems that the emergency fare slip is just a reminder to top up. To confirm Its not an 'emergency ticket' but just clarification that you have a negative balance. This ticket was proposed as when cashless was going to be introduced there were questions as to how passengers would know if they had used their 'extra' journey. Oyster cards generally do not work with a negative balance. Unless the system has changed the only times you can use them with a negative balance is with bus season tickets , even then I believe there is a limit to how much in the negative you can be. For example, if you have -10p, then you can upload a new bus season ticket. The same does not apply to travelcards, as there is a chance you increase your negative balance. I have used the hopper, and I think if it is going to really useful, or groundbreaking like its being made out to be, it needs to increase to 2 hours with the unlimited changes. Otherwise, its just a small help. Every little helps though. TfL estimates that 30 millions journeys will benefit (or would have benefited it was used in the last year), thats not many. I read somewhere that 30000 free journeys were used by 8:30 AM, yes AM on Monday (the first day). However, those like me critical of every stat I see, after some thinking remembered, that when I was out and about, that Monday was Eid, and I saw a lot of people around 7-8 am going to the mosques and coming back, therefore those figures seem inflated in my opinion. 'Emergency fare advice slip' then (splitting hairs lol). There was no suggestion you could start the travel on a negative balance either (I did pose the question but found the answer myself), although I think TfL should at least look at remodelling the system so that customers can transfer (ie board the first bus with insufficient credit) on the negative balance rather than having to top up in between for the hopper fare. It's an inconvenience because not every bus interchange is at a tube/rail station or top up outlet and not everyone can top up online either. Source: TfL
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Post by twobellstogo on Sept 18, 2016 13:02:38 GMT
Any feedback from the drivers on the forum about whether people are already moaning about connecting buses being late and not getting a free second fare? Not a driver, but have already seen two passengers complain to the driver about being recharged, allegedly, within the hour, on route 89 in both cases.
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