|
Post by southlondonbus on Apr 24, 2019 10:32:08 GMT
Atleast East Sheen does have the 337 to East Putney for the district line as some compromise if the 33 remains at Hammersmith bridge. I walked it the other day and really unless your very elderly or disabled it probably is the better option then the 72 via Chiswick Bridge.
|
|
|
Post by george on Apr 24, 2019 10:34:09 GMT
Atleast East Sheen does have the 337 to East Putney for the district line as some compromise if the 33 remains at Hammersmith bridge. I walked it the other day and really unless your very elderly or disabled it probably is the better option then the 72 via Chiswick Bridge. Yeah the walk isn't too bad at a fast pace you could do it in ten minutes.
|
|
|
Post by george on Apr 24, 2019 21:34:52 GMT
so now the TfL website shows the stops the 72 serves on the diversion route. Hopefully the stops on the diversion will show up on LVF maybe LVF_Admin cold shed some more light on whether this would be possible.
|
|
|
Post by snowman on Apr 25, 2019 8:21:24 GMT
Parliamentary wriiten answer on Hammersmith Bridge closure Looks like Government is saying its H+F Borough and they have had no discussions on it Link
|
|
|
Post by rj131 on Apr 26, 2019 6:32:36 GMT
Don’t know if this has been discussed yet but the northbound destinations of the 209, 33 and 485 routes has changed to ‘Hammersmith Bridge’ rather than Castlenau. And even more weirdly the 419’s destination is now ‘Northbound’! Is the terminus still Castlenau and just worded more poshly to include the word ‘Hammersmith’ or are they actually terminating somewhere else now?
|
|
|
Post by southlondonbus on Apr 26, 2019 6:54:06 GMT
Parliamentary wriiten answer on Hammersmith Bridge closure Looks like Government is saying its H+F Borough and they have had no discussions on it Link So it could easily be the early 2020s at the earliest till the Bridge reopens.
|
|
|
Post by SILENCED on Apr 26, 2019 8:11:11 GMT
Parliamentary wriiten answer on Hammersmith Bridge closure Looks like Government is saying its H+F Borough and they have had no discussions on it Link So it could easily be the early 2020s at the earliest till the Bridge reopens. Quite honestly I think and then some. H+F will be looking for some contribution from TfL or Central Government and cant see any forthcoming in the current climate. I think it will only be when H+F finally realise the have to bite the bullet and cough up the cash we will see any progress on this ... and cant see it being any time soon ... and as with anything that requires repair and does not get it ... the price to fix it will only go up as it deteriorates further. Even when the works start, if done properly, will probably take a good while to complete.
|
|
|
Post by snowman on Apr 26, 2019 8:11:15 GMT
Don’t know if this has been discussed yet but the northbound destinations of the 209, 33 and 485 routes has changed to ‘Hammersmith Bridge’ rather than Castlenau. And even more weirdly the 419’s destination is now ‘Northbound’! Is the terminus still Castlenau and just worded more poshly to include the word ‘Hammersmith’ or are they actually terminating somewhere else now? I think there is a fortnightly update on Thursday nights of I-bus data Presumably as it is long term bridge closure, destinations have been updated Not sure Hammersmith Bridge is a good choice though, as buses stop two or three hundred meters south of the bridge, so is bit misleading. Actual termini is near the Castlenau / Lonsdale road Junction
|
|
|
Post by george on Apr 26, 2019 8:27:27 GMT
Don’t know if this has been discussed yet but the northbound destinations of the 209, 33 and 485 routes has changed to ‘Hammersmith Bridge’ rather than Castlenau. And even more weirdly the 419’s destination is now ‘Northbound’! Is the terminus still Castlenau and just worded more poshly to include the word ‘Hammersmith’ or are they actually terminating somewhere else now? I think there is a fortnightly update on Thursday nights of I-bus data Presumably as it is long term bridge closure, destinations have been updated Not sure Hammersmith Bridge is a good choice though, as buses stop two or three hundred meters south of the bridge, so is bit misleading. Actual termini is near the Castlenau / Lonsdale road Junction Passengers are dropped off by the bridge. The buses then go empty to the stands.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Apr 26, 2019 8:28:28 GMT
419 I understand is going to terminate at Barnes Pond soon. So continuing from Lonsdale Road down Castlenau to the Red Lion then to the former 283 stand.
|
|
|
Post by snoggle on Apr 26, 2019 10:26:24 GMT
So it could easily be the early 2020s at the earliest till the Bridge reopens. Quite honestly I think and then some. H+F will be looking for some contribution from TfL or Central Government and cant see any forthcoming in the current climate. I think it will only be when H+F finally realise the have to bite the bullet and cough up the cash we will see any progress on this ... and cant see it being any time soon ... and as with anything that requires repair and does not get it ... the price to fix it will only go up as it deteriorates further. Even when the works start, if done properly, will probably take a good while to complete. I suspect that what we may see is a policy change that says they won't bother repairing the bridge unless TfL coughs up. H&F will play back the Mayor's own "Healthy Streets" policy at him and say "the air quality is vastly better now than it was, people are walking and cycling across the bridge without issue and the traffic has readjusted to reflect the bridge's closure. You have also changed the bus network to cope. Therefore we see no reason to put ourselves in financial jeopardy by trying to find £30+m to repair the bridge. We will leave it as it is for pedestrian and cycle access only." "If you want traffic access and buses to run on the bridge then you must fund the repairs Mr Mayor." I think it's been very clear for a long time that H&F Council, regardless of political control, are fed up with TfL's antics and ever shifting budget coupled with the flouting by bus operators of the weight restriction and TfL being lackadaisical about enforcing it until H&F forced their hand. They're never going to fork out for the repairs - they haven't got the money. I've read enough of their council papers in the past to see that capital funding is almost non existent for highways. We obviously have the Mayoral and Assembly elections next year. London borough elections are not until 2022. The Mayor has to decide if he wants the bridge issue to be used against him in what is a pretty marginal part of London politically. He probably would not want to lose votes in the H&F area nor in neighbouring Wandsworth (affected by displaced traffic).
|
|
|
Post by SILENCED on Apr 26, 2019 10:46:16 GMT
Quite honestly I think and then some. H+F will be looking for some contribution from TfL or Central Government and cant see any forthcoming in the current climate. I think it will only be when H+F finally realise the have to bite the bullet and cough up the cash we will see any progress on this ... and cant see it being any time soon ... and as with anything that requires repair and does not get it ... the price to fix it will only go up as it deteriorates further. Even when the works start, if done properly, will probably take a good while to complete. I suspect that what we may see is a policy change that says they won't bother repairing the bridge unless TfL coughs up. H&F will play back the Mayor's own "Healthy Streets" policy at him and say "the air quality is vastly better now than it was, people are walking and cycling across the bridge without issue and the traffic has readjusted to reflect the bridge's closure. You have also changed the bus network to cope. Therefore we see no reason to put ourselves in financial jeopardy by trying to find £30+m to repair the bridge. We will leave it as it is for pedestrian and cycle access only." "If you want traffic access and buses to run on the bridge then you must fund the repairs Mr Mayor." I think it's been very clear for a long time that H&F Council, regardless of political control, are fed up with TfL's antics and ever shifting budget coupled with the flouting by bus operators of the weight restriction and TfL being lackadaisical about enforcing it until H&F forced their hand. They're never going to fork out for the repairs - they haven't got the money. I've read enough of their council papers in the past to see that capital funding is almost non existent for highways. We obviously have the Mayoral and Assembly elections next year. London borough elections are not until 2022. The Mayor has to decide if he wants the bridge issue to be used against him in what is a pretty marginal part of London politically. He probably would not want to lose votes in the H&F area nor in neighbouring Wandsworth (affected by displaced traffic). As it is a listed building ... could an enforcement noticed be served on the council ... but by whom ... it would normally be the council serving them. Maybe the Mayor can use the same straight bat technique of the DfT to plant it back squarely at the feet of H&F
|
|
|
Post by snoggle on Apr 26, 2019 11:02:46 GMT
As it is a listed building ... could an enforcement noticed be served on the council ... but by whom ... it would normally be the council serving them. Maybe the Mayor can use the same straight bat technique of the DfT to plant it back squarely at the feet of H&F Provided they can demonstrate it won't fall down as a result of cycle and pedestrian use then do they really need to do anything apart from minor repairs / ongoing monitoring? The problem for the Mayor is that presently H&F is a Labour council so in theory "friendly". Deliberately "annoying" your political friends is a bizarre way to do political business.
|
|
|
Post by redbus on Apr 26, 2019 11:13:21 GMT
As it is a listed building ... could an enforcement noticed be served on the council ... but by whom ... it would normally be the council serving them. Maybe the Mayor can use the same straight bat technique of the DfT to plant it back squarely at the feet of H&F Provided they can demonstrate it won't fall down as a result of cycle and pedestrian use then do they really need to do anything apart from minor repairs / ongoing monitoring? The problem for the Mayor is that presently H&F is a Labour council so in theory "friendly". Deliberately "annoying" your political friends is a bizarre way to do political business. I think where we go now will depend to some extent on the locals and whether they want the bridge to re-open to traffic. If they create enough fuss, make it an election issue, something will be done but it won't happen short term, you'll be looking medium term at best. We saw what local pressure could do re Oxford Street pedestrianisation, so I am firm believer that with enough fuss there will be repairs. For me the question is whether there would be enough local pressure to force something to be done, and for that we will have to wait and see.
The local council may also choose to do a cheaper repair if they have to foot the whole bill. An obvious thought is to strengthen it sufficiently to allow a low weight limit to just allow cars and small vans across, but no more. That would mean no buses and how TfL would feel about that! You want buses across, TfL, then you have to pay for it!!!
EDIT - I looked at the DfT answer about Hammersmith to Zac Goldsmith and I always find the wording interesting, for as much as what is omitted as said. It says ministers haven't had discussions with H&F council on the matter. The matter being the prioritisation of repairs, not the funding. It also says ministers, so that does not prohibit civil servants in the department having had discussions, or am I wrong?!!
|
|
|
Post by southlondonbus on Apr 27, 2019 17:07:26 GMT
I was in Barnes yday and today and nothing is really carrying that much there at the moment. The 72s I saw running through Mortlake towards Chiswick bridge never had more then 5 or 6 on board. No doubt people have found it quicker to walk from Castlenau to Hammersmith. Without the Hammersmith connection the 209 has little purpose again with people switching to the train from Mortlake or Barnes or opting to walk to Hammersmith from the whole length of Castlenau to Hammersmith probably from as far down as the Red Lion.
Must be a bit of a worry/all Christmas' at once for TFL. It could be costly running lightly used services or a perfect opportunity for a major rationalisation.
|
|