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Post by LX09FBJ on Apr 11, 2013 11:18:12 GMT
Metroline (and indeed Go-Ahead) should give up some of their garages for sale, thus stopping them from growing so fast.
London United are not doing too badly, although loosing the K1 and K3 to Abellio (who no doubt will operate them from Fulwell)
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Post by LX09FBJ on Apr 11, 2013 11:21:56 GMT
The takeover of Centrewest by Metroline will take place by June 2013. I doubt they will be forced to sell of one of their garages or else the transaction will not be going through. Also it has to be said GAL tookover Rainham, Silvertown, Belvedere and Northumberland Park without being forced to sell so I don't see why Metroline would have to. Gal's take overs in east london made them enter a new area so not many issues like wise np and belvedere is a small garage and se london theres a few companies where as the first takeover takes out a lot of competition in north west london. I agree, Go-Ahead are growing in a diffrent area. Say if they took over Abellio or London United, then a few eyebrows might be raised. However, Metroline is monopolising the area, so unless the other established operators open up shop or new operators are formed, then the scene in that area will not be likely to change.
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Post by vjaska on Apr 11, 2013 12:21:33 GMT
I suspect why they've held onto DM is indeed to keep them a route open in the TfL market in the future once First Group becomes financially healthier. I can still see DM being operated as a low cost garage in the same way as Arriva's GY garage.
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Post by LX09FBJ on Apr 11, 2013 23:22:44 GMT
I suspect why they've held onto DM is indeed to keep them a route open in the TfL market in the future once First Group becomes financially healthier. I can still see DM being operated as a low cost garage in the same way as Arriva's GY garage. So it potentially isn't the end of First in London. I hope it's not, I like their buses, just not the fleet numbers or their lack or running numbers. By the way, which of the Romford/Barking etc. area routes are up for tender? The selling of the other London ops could give them some extra cash to bid on a few (particularly the smaller routes) and they can win them with existing stock (the DNs and DMLs will be spare from the losses in Romford, and are suitable for another tender round)
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Post by vjaska on Apr 11, 2013 23:26:33 GMT
I suspect why they've held onto DM is indeed to keep them a route open in the TfL market in the future once First Group becomes financially healthier. I can still see DM being operated as a low cost garage in the same way as Arriva's GY garage. So it potentially isn't the end of First in London. I hope it's not, I like their buses, just not the fleet numbers or their lack or running numbers. By the way, which of the Romford/Barking etc. area routes are up for tender? The selling of the other London ops could give them some extra cash to bid on a few (particularly the smaller routes) Apparently, First received no bids for DM so I expect First to hang onto it - well I hope they do anyway
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Post by rambo on Apr 12, 2013 1:55:59 GMT
My moneys on go ahead buying DM and moving SI and BE in there.
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Post by wh541 on Apr 12, 2013 6:55:33 GMT
So it potentially isn't the end of First in London. I hope it's not, I like their buses, just not the fleet numbers or their lack or running numbers. By the way, which of the Romford/Barking etc. area routes are up for tender? The selling of the other London ops could give them some extra cash to bid on a few (particularly the smaller routes) Apparently, First received no bids for DM so I expect First to hang onto it - well I hope they do anyway Is there a source for this? would they really make that public knowledge?
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Post by DT 11 on Apr 12, 2013 7:17:03 GMT
My moneys on go ahead buying DM and moving SI and BE in there. If Go Ahead buyout DM I can see either SI or BE remaining. IMO SI should remain as all the routes operated their are close. I would move most of Rainhams work there and move the 20 to NP.
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Post by wh541 on Apr 12, 2013 7:44:42 GMT
My moneys on go ahead buying DM and moving SI and BE in there. If Go Ahead buyout DM I can see either SI or BE remaining. IMO SI should remain as all the routes operated their are close. I would move most of Rainhams work there and move the 20 to NP. but two three posts up it states nobody wants DM? so I assume this means Go Ahead have looked and turned it down?
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Post by snowman on Apr 12, 2013 8:43:37 GMT
If Go Ahead buyout DM I can see either SI or BE remaining. IMO SI should remain as all the routes operated their are close. I would move most of Rainhams work there and move the 20 to NP. but two three posts up it states nobody wants DM? so I assume this means Go Ahead have looked and turned it down? I'm guessing it was offered at the same time as NP, they didn't buy it then, so cant see why they would now as nothing has changed apart from it has lost some routes. First could just run it down and not renew anything then just flog off the land.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2013 10:41:01 GMT
Why should a company be forced to give up business because they are growing too rapidly. This is not how it works in the Commercial World. It's either you grow or risk your business.
Would it be logical for someone to say 'Tesco should sell of a few stores because they are becoming too bid'. No because in business it's all about growth.
Metroline have bought a business who have expressed their desire to sell, operators have done this all the time throughout the years.
This talk about Metroline having a monopolistic dominance on the North West London market is rubbish. Are you forgetting EW & HD face competition from Garston who are not even based in London?! EW have also had LS takeover the 251 and 605 in the last year and a half.
HD still faces competition from BT, GR & SO.
In addition to this, WJ will still face competition from AS, PK and X. Anyone forgotten about that?
ON & PA is quite an obvious one along with G.
However routes do not always run from garages nearby their line of route so its quite possible for another operator to come and destroy the balance.
Route 142, 258 & 340 are all examples of routes that run past Metroline garages but have never been awarded to the company.
I've grown up around First London and as much people like to blag, they are not the greatest operation, its hit and miss with them as with many big companies.
In the past Metroline's maintenance has been bad as with again all operators. I remember seeing a Stagecoach Trident with a split wheel on the 277 but hey I guess we all choose what we want to see.
They've made the effort to open up a VOSA approved maintenance Centre which, First, London Sovereign, London United and TFL use (heritage vehicles) so its not all bad.
I saw a comment on here about SELs being poor or something along those lines. Can someone expand?
I find it more worrying that Go Ahead are moving into new areas constantly rather than focusing on on area at the time and developing it over time. I'd rather the approach Metroline have taken, which is is to take over in an area they already have knowledge of.
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Post by wh541 on Apr 12, 2013 10:52:51 GMT
Why should a company be forced to give up business because they are growing too rapidly. This is not how it works in the Commercial World. It's either you grow or risk your business. Would it be logical for someone to say 'Tesco should sell of a few stores because they are becoming too bid'. No because in business it's all about growth. Metroline have bought a business who have expressed their desire to sell, operators have done this all the time throughout the years. This talk about Metroline having a monopolistic dominance on the North West London market is rubbish. Are you forgetting EW & HD face competition from Garston who are not even based in London?! EW have also had LS takeover the 251 and 605 in the last year and a half. HD still faces competition from BT, GR & SO. In addition to this, WJ will still face competition from AS, PK and X. Anyone forgotten about that? ON & PA is quite an obvious one along with G. However routes do not always run from garages nearby their line of route so its quite possible for another operator to come and destroy the balance. Route 142, 258 & 340 are all examples of routes that run past Metroline garages but have never been awarded to the company. I've grown up around First London and as much people like to blag, they are not the greatest operation, its hit and miss with them as with many big companies. In the past Metroline's maintenance has been bad as with again all operators. I remember seeing a Stagecoach Trident with a split wheel on the 277 but hey I guess we all choose what we want to see. They've made the effort to open up a VOSA approved maintenance Centre which, First, London Sovereign, London United and TFL use (heritage vehicles) so its not all bad. I saw a comment on here about SELs being poor or something along those lines. Can someone expand? I find it more worrying that Go Ahead are moving into new areas constantly rather than focusing on on area at the time and developing it over time. I'd rather the approach Metroline have taken, which is is to take over in an area they already have knowledge of. Wow I take it you are very pro Metroline ;D ;D did you get paid to write that.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2013 10:57:16 GMT
Why should a company be forced to give up business because they are growing too rapidly. This is not how it works in the Commercial World. It's either you grow or risk your business. Would it be logical for someone to say 'Tesco should sell of a few stores because they are becoming too bid'. No because in business it's all about growth. Metroline have bought a business who have expressed their desire to sell, operators have done this all the time throughout the years. This talk about Metroline having a monopolistic dominance on the North West London market is rubbish. Are you forgetting EW & HD face competition from Garston who are not even based in London?! EW have also had LS takeover the 251 and 605 in the last year and a half. HD still faces competition from BT, GR & SO. In addition to this, WJ will still face competition from AS, PK and X. Anyone forgotten about that? ON & PA is quite an obvious one along with G. However routes do not always run from garages nearby their line of route so its quite possible for another operator to come and destroy the balance. Route 142, 258 & 340 are all examples of routes that run past Metroline garages but have never been awarded to the company. I've grown up around First London and as much people like to blag, they are not the greatest operation, its hit and miss with them as with many big companies. In the past Metroline's maintenance has been bad as with again all operators. I remember seeing a Stagecoach Trident with a split wheel on the 277 but hey I guess we all choose what we want to see. They've made the effort to open up a VOSA approved maintenance Centre which, First, London Sovereign, London United and TFL use (heritage vehicles) so its not all bad. I saw a comment on here about SELs being poor or something along those lines. Can someone expand? I find it more worrying that Go Ahead are moving into new areas constantly rather than focusing on on area at the time and developing it over time. I'd rather the approach Metroline have taken, which is is to take over in an area they already have knowledge of. It is called Competition law - that is why Lloyds Banking Group are in the process of selling 600 barnches to Co-op Bank - the government decreed LBG was anti-competitive I believe Del-gro Comfort obtained their stake in Scottish CityLink after the competition authorities made National Express sell it due to them winning the ScotRail contract
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Post by wh541 on Apr 12, 2013 11:11:55 GMT
If Go Ahead buyout DM I can see either SI or BE remaining. IMO SI should remain as all the routes operated their are close. I would move most of Rainhams work there and move the 20 to NP. I wonder if Dagenham is too far out to be useful to Go-Ahead. After all, their Rainham base is supposed to still have some room - and it's only a few miles away from Dagenham. Meanwhile, the full Silvertown garage is in the area Go-Ahead are probably more interested in finding a new garage - and is about 8 miles away from Dagenham. My guess is Go-Ahead had a keen eye on Upton Park when that was closed. I would say it was perfect for Arriva to replace DX when I go past on the A13 the garage looks fairly basic and very tight and hard to get into (Have to do a double run?) But again sure they have looked ;D
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Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2013 11:19:03 GMT
I saw a comment on here about SELs being poor or something along those lines. Can someone expand? Wow I am surprised to read that! It probably comes from you. You wagged war on the class about a year ago, with many posts saying how terrible the vehicles were, how unreliable they were, and Metroline wanted to dispose of them at the 1st available opportunity. Is this no longer the case?
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