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Post by Deleted on Jul 10, 2013 19:56:53 GMT
hi guys anyone know when its next on please can not be 6 all ready thanks Next episode is next Tuesday at 9pm. Not sure why there was a break this week though
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Post by smiler52 on Jul 10, 2013 19:57:36 GMT
hi guys anyone know when its next on please can not be 6 all ready thanks Next episode is next Tuesday at 9pm. Not sure why there was a break this week though thanks mate
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Post by snoggle on Jul 16, 2013 22:49:24 GMT
So tonight's episode based at VCS can be summed up as
open doors, bleary eyes, off your head, crowds, crowds, drunk, coaches, crowds, coaches, crowds, drugs, drink, vomit, coaches, crowds, coaches, crowds, drink, drink, drink, drunk, vomit, letch, vomit, drunk, puke, call the police, close the doors.
I knows that's a bit unfair but I had forgotten quite what a microcosm of life VCS is. Years and years ago I used to visit VCS fairly regularly but it looks completely overloaded these days. One of my first jobs involved selling coach tickets in a travel centre but not in London. I can sympathise with those poor souls working in the ticket office - sometimes a nice job, other times completely thankless.
I was left wondering what on earth TfL will do when the inevitable happens and the coach station can no longer function. There are no obvious locations left to create a much bigger but still reasonably well located coach station. The opportunity at Kings Cross has been lost and I can't think of any other site that has the space that TfL could somehow safeguard or else secure within another development.
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Post by Jack on Jul 16, 2013 23:29:31 GMT
Hate to say it, but I found this episode just as boring as the first one. There was no real "action" so to speak.
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Post by 6HP502C on Jul 16, 2013 23:58:44 GMT
Re: the previous episode, when I started with Abellio, I was given a prepay Oyster Card and told to go and learn 2 routes. On my first day, I was thrown in at the deep end on a 3, with the roadside controller at Oval asking if I could drive quickly as the service was in a bit of a state. I was like "I've never even driven a double decker bus before!" I had to contend with turns on my first day. To be fair, I did say I knew a few of the routes, like the 3 and 35 but there was no notion of a mentor or anything like that for any period of time.
Controllers do have a job to do and are under pressure too. Drivers b*tch about them for the wrong reasons. Personally I had issues with some of the controllers because I felt they prioritised mileage over more important things, such as H&S and the law at times. I called them up various times with the expectation of having the bus subbed, seen to or towed, but told to continue in service instead. For example, when I took a 12 plate ED out on the N35, the brakes failed, resulting in me overshooting a couple of stops. I eventually stopped driving it when it took the handbrake to halt the bus after flooring the brake just to get it to slow down. The controller told me to keep driving and finish the shift. The Y reg Trident I took out on the N3, there were sparks and embers coming out of the exhaust early on, with the red STOP light coming on. I complained about this and was told to keep driving. By the end of the shift, the suspension had caved in in the Bromley area. I reported this and was told to drive the bus back to the garage, despite the bus banging against the road every few metres, causing damage to the surface. I think the only time I lost mileage due to a defect was with a ramp fault on one of the 35's EDs, which prevented the bus from moving. When I did get it going, dropping down to 3mph would force a stop and lengthy trial and error to get it going again, so the light run back to the garage was excruciating! Especially when the bus sat down right over the junction at Borough High Street.
Also had issues with controllers telling to me drive a bus that could have taken me over my hours, despite various timely warnings. Had other problems, such as failed electrics/headlights at night and malfunctioning windscreen wipers in the rain (esp. on the Vs) which I reported to the controllers, only for them to instruct me to keep driving to prevent lost mileage. In some cases it's down to the driver to know what's what law wise, park up and refuse to continue if necessary. With some controllers, so long as the bus can move, they expect the driver to keep going, regardless of the defects that have been reported. They shouldn't treat drivers like mere expendables - any defect or circumstance which could put the driver's licence at risk should be nipped in the bud immediately, not encouraged to save mileage. I was particularly interested in the scenes with the new Stagecoach driver. I also recall going to West Ham, but I wanted to drive one of the Euro 2 ZF Tridents. I got to take 17363, which was great but I would have preferred one of the 17409-434 batch.
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Post by snoggle on Jul 17, 2013 7:34:30 GMT
Well those issues you've mentioned about Abellio and being told to keep driving unsafe vehicles are an utter disgrace. If they are typical of how Abellio maintain their vehicles it's a wonder someone hasn't been injured or worse. I know it is easy to write stuff on a discussion group when it doesn't affect work or your wages but I would have reported Abellio for those infringements. Buses without functioning brakes or flames coming out of the exhaust - Sheesh! That's symptomatic of the absolute dregs of deregulated cowboy operators. Sorry it that upsets any Abellio fans here but the public's and employee's safety must come first.
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Post by M1104 on Jul 17, 2013 10:02:21 GMT
If I was instructed to continue driving after reporting something as serious as faulty brakes, I simply would have said something along the lines of,
"I'm not sure if you heard me but my brakes are faulty and is compromising the safety of myself, my passengers, pedestrians and other road users.... not to mention possible further damage to the bus"
If I am still instructed to continue I would try a different form of persuasion...
"Okay but I will only continue if I can have your name and badge number so that if anything happens I can say that I was instructed to continue despite me reporting faulty brakes. I'm not refusing to follow instructions, I just want to cover myself in case of any possible incidents."
If you keep to that reasoning (obviously bluffing) they will most likely change their instruction and tell you to stay put and wait for an engineer.
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Post by 6HP502C on Jul 17, 2013 10:44:30 GMT
There was something of an "every man for himself" culture at times - even if the driver was instructed to continue, ultimately it is down to them if they move the bus when it is unsafe or unlawful to do so. A controller should not try to make the driver feel bad or as if they'll get into trouble if they do not comply with questionable orders. This was by no means universal - some controllers would insist buses with serious defects were not moved.
On the other side of the coin, I've heard the way management at a regional operator (not Abellio) spoke about their drivers - a can't live with them, can't live without them mantra was in place. They said that drivers moan about everything and anything - so sometimes I wonder if complaints alone were taken in all seriousness at the first report.
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Post by M1104 on Jul 17, 2013 11:08:31 GMT
There was something of an "every man for himself" culture at times - even if the driver was instructed to continue, ultimately it is down to them if they move the bus when it is unsafe or unlawful to do so. A controller should not try to make the driver feel bad or as if they'll get into trouble if they do not comply with questionable orders. This was by no means universal - some controllers would insist buses with serious defects were not moved. On the other side of the coin, I've heard the way management at a regional operator (not Abellio) spoke about their drivers - a can't live with them, can't live without them mantra was in place. They said that drivers moan about everything and anything - so sometimes I wonder if complaints alone were taken in all seriousness at the first report. I must admit that in my time I have known drivers to exaggerate (or panic) when calling in defects. There was one driver who was practically screaming over the radio that the bus was smoking and on fire, when in actual fact the engine had overheated and there was a good amount of steam resulting from evaporated water. It took a good minute and a half to assure him of that fact as he was a relatively new driver. So yes, some drivers may tend to moan, whether out of panic or to get an easy life for the moment. Nevertheless all calls should be taken seriously, even if a particular driver does tend to "cry wolf".
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Post by 6HP502C on Jul 17, 2013 11:16:21 GMT
Indeed! The garages I've worked at give you the best part of a week to route learn all their routes, especially if they plan to put you on standby rota for a while. When i joined Merton garage for example they would put drivers on standby for six months before rota upgrade in stages to the 155/355....then 152/163/164 (170 Sundays only)....then 219/270 (22 Sundays only)....then 44/77....then the 280, that rota then having an average waiting time of twelve years to get on. Sorry to keep asking questions but why the stepped approach to different route rotas and why is the 280 the "Gold Medal" rota? Surely the bus companies just stick drivers where they want them or do union agreements and "keeping the troops happy" mean that having some rigidity in who drives what makes things easier to manage (e.g route managers have a stable group of drivers under their command)? From what I have seen, a lot of drivers will do anything to avoid going anywhere near Central London. It is stressful, especially if you do the job full time and have no love for it.
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Post by daveb0789 on Jul 17, 2013 12:18:01 GMT
There seems to be a lack of respect for bus drivers from controllers - 'the bus isn't an extension of your di**?' How dare he say that ? I'd want the controllers name and be reporting him on the spot. Disgusting !
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Post by marlon101 on Jul 17, 2013 13:45:07 GMT
There seems to be a lack of respect for bus drivers from controllers - 'the bus isn't an extension of your di**?' How dare he say that ? I'd want the controllers name and be reporting him on the spot. Disgusting ! I know. I was thoroughly appalled to see him stop a driver driving in a fast and dangerous manner. Awful. Christine is a nice friendly women i remember chatting to her not long after being filmed for the program and she was hoping they would cut that bit out of her getting lost but this is television we are talking about Fairly sure I jumped on a 269 with her recently and she seemed rather pleasant, as are most on the 269! Must admit, ive never had any problems with radio room staff, they have a job to do as well. Can't say that I've ever much of a problem with the iBus controllers; like you say, they have a job to do as well. I find it's very much a case of working together rather than a 'them vs us' situation. That said, in my opinion, the female Arriva iBus controller in the latest episode had a bit of an attitude; I don't think I would be much inclined to put myself out too much to help her out. Speaking of the latest episode, it was strange to see so many people I know on TV from the iBus controllers to my fellow bus driving colleague Christine. There has been some conjecture on here concerning her 'being on her own.' I can 100% categorically confirm that she had a mentor with her for her first week on the road. How can I be so sure? Because I took over a 61 from her and her mentor Graham during her first week! I can't imagine that it's changed much in the four years or so since I was in that situation but once a driver has passed his or her test and done the type training and ticket training and been transferred to their garage they are generally given a week to ten days to learn that garage's routes. In Bromley's case that is learning the 61, 208, 227, 269, 314 and various iterations of the 638. Learning the school bus variations has to spread out over a few days because of some journies only doing one trip a day. You are generally given plenty of time to learn the routes since they don't want drivers getting lost! Once you and the garage staff are satisfied with your knowledge of the routes you are assigned a mentor. In my case my mentor and I shared driving duties for the first couple of days I was on the road before he let me get on with it for the rest of the week. The mentor has a very special job to do because they will help the new driver with particular routines a garage may have for signing on, signing off, for the morning run out and the evening run in. As far as I can gather, every garage has slightly different ways of doing things and the mentor is invaluable for helping you get things right. The mentor is also the one who assesses whether or not a new driver is capable of going out onto the road on their own. I have to say, I'm enjoying this programme; it's always fun seeing people and places you recognise on TV! Thanks for the clarification Paul! My assumption had been that given that this was her first time out, the mentor was taking a fairly hands off approach for the purposes of Television but I didn't doubt that she had a mentor. What I did find annoying was the retired bus drivers saying how they used to take liberties in 'the old days', one of the reasons londons buses were privatised, imo. Hardly. Privatisation and "reducing the state" has been the political mantra for 30 years regardless of political party. It's a broadly right wing agenda that has been absorbed by centre and centre left parties as well. There was always a chance that "state owned London Transport" could be in line for that particular treatment. I do not see that "people taking the pee" at work had anything to do with it. Let's face it - people of all ages, competencies and positions in all sorts of jobs p*ss about at work and don't always pull their weight. The cost and associated inefficiency is just lumped into the total cost of running things but is rarely so bad that it becomes visible. It is all down to management at the end of the day to keep things under control. IME there are some people, usually a very small minority, who are world experts at not doing the job they're paid for and are working the "rules" to their advantage. These people can seriously damage morale if they're allowed to get away with their antics. I still think you can draw a causal link. In the private sector, performance management is much stricter and things need to be much more efficient, therefore these sorts of practices cannot be allowed to continue. Under state control, people could get away with this making the company look inefficient therefore it was much easier/more likely to get privatised at the time it did as opposed to at a later date.
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Post by rambo on Jul 18, 2013 15:13:10 GMT
Well those issues you've mentioned about Abellio and being told to keep driving unsafe vehicles are an utter disgrace. If they are typical of how Abellio maintain their vehicles it's a wonder someone hasn't been injured or worse. I know it is easy to write stuff on a discussion group when it doesn't affect work or your wages but I would have reported Abellio for those infringements. Buses without functioning brakes or flames coming out of the exhaust - Sheesh! That's symptomatic of the absolute dregs of deregulated cowboy operators. Sorry it that upsets any Abellio fans here but the public's and employee's safety must come first. I blame the driver. All this crap about asking the controller for thier number is cobblers. Just imagine you report a bus with faulty brakes, the controller says to carry on and gives you thier badge number. 5 minutes later you run someone over and kill them. Do drivers REALLY think that the police will not prosecute the driver, just because he has a controllers badge number? I had a bus with brake warning lights going off on the dash and the audiable alarm bleeping in my ear, was told to carry on and the bus would be subbed the other end. My reply? " I am refusing to drive this bus on the grounds of saftey". Stayed where I was and had a sub bus brought to me.
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Post by lc1 on Jul 18, 2013 19:46:35 GMT
Obviously I'd last about 5 minutes at Abellieo then...
...the other week on the 89 4 trips, 4 different buses (No Air Con, Drivers Seat too high, Step adrift)
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Post by vjaska on Jul 18, 2013 19:52:05 GMT
These reports about Abellio do make them go down in how reputable they are - I'd dread to think one day if someone serious happens & loss of life is involved.
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