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Post by snoggle on Mar 30, 2017 8:38:30 GMT
From the loadings I saw on Tuesday morning, the am trips on the 113 are very busy, by the time they reach Finchley Rd very few seats left. Likewise, the 82 between N Finchley was interesting, as many alight at Golders Green, giving some capacity for the next main stop near the Sainsbury's. But by the time they reach Finchley Road, again there are very few seats left. I reckon it will be quite tight from next week, the journeys for those wanting to catch the bus will be that bit more uncomfortable, with much less prospect of getting a seat. This issue in itself could become a self fulfilling prophecy causing even more people to ditch travelling on the buses. Well if it does go "tits up" next week there is a huge queue of people waiting to tell TfL "I told you so". The biggest risk is around TT's ability to run the 13 properly as it's new territory for them whereas I imagine Metroline won't have much of an issue running a more frequent 113 service.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 30, 2017 9:10:32 GMT
From the loadings I saw on Tuesday morning, the am trips on the 113 are very busy, by the time they reach Finchley Rd very few seats left. Likewise, the 82 between N Finchley was interesting, as many alight at Golders Green, giving some capacity for the next main stop near the Sainsbury's. But by the time they reach Finchley Road, again there are very few seats left. I reckon it will be quite tight from next week, the journeys for those wanting to catch the bus will be that bit more uncomfortable, with much less prospect of getting a seat. This issue in itself could become a self fulfilling prophecy causing even more people to ditch travelling on the buses. Well if it does go "tits up" next week there is a huge queue of people waiting to tell TfL "I told you so". The biggest risk is around TT's ability to run the 13 properly as it's new territory for them whereas I imagine Metroline won't have much of an issue running a more frequent 113 service. Indeed. Then you'll get people getting what they thought was a 13 at Golders Green Bus Stn, ringing the bell at West Hampstead because they think they've caught the wrong bus to Oxford Street. Only to find out later they were on the right bus after all. And how many people will be asking route 13 drivers at Hyde Park Corner "excuse me why aren't you going to Regent Street ?"
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Post by sid on Mar 30, 2017 11:57:17 GMT
Some drivers who were formerly 139 have transferred to EW for the 113 and it looks like the first few TEH's have gained EW codes and have began transferring. Cricklewood lose both the 139 and 168?
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Post by thewintersoldier on Mar 30, 2017 11:59:38 GMT
Some drivers who were formerly 139 have transferred to EW for the 113 and it looks like the first few TEH's have gained EW codes and have began transferring. Cricklewood lose both the 139 and 168? I believe it goes to HT
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Post by sid on Mar 30, 2017 12:02:30 GMT
Well if it does go "tits up" next week there is a huge queue of people waiting to tell TfL "I told you so". The biggest risk is around TT's ability to run the 13 properly as it's new territory for them whereas I imagine Metroline won't have much of an issue running a more frequent 113 service. Indeed. Then you'll get people getting what they thought was a 13 at Golders Green Bus Stn, ringing the bell at West Hampstead because they think they've caught the wrong bus to Oxford Street. Only to find out later they were on the right bus after all. And how many people will be asking route 13 drivers at Hyde Park Corner "excuse me why aren't you going to Regent Street ?" Surely it would have been more logical to leave the North Finchley to Victoria service as the 82? I remember when the 77A was renumbered 87 for no apparent reason as far as passengers were concerned. "Do you go to................."? "Yes I go the same way as the 77A did". "So why has the number changed"? **Exasperated look from driver!
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Post by vjaska on Mar 30, 2017 12:38:20 GMT
Indeed. Then you'll get people getting what they thought was a 13 at Golders Green Bus Stn, ringing the bell at West Hampstead because they think they've caught the wrong bus to Oxford Street. Only to find out later they were on the right bus after all. And how many people will be asking route 13 drivers at Hyde Park Corner "excuse me why aren't you going to Regent Street ?" Surely it would have been more logical to leave the North Finchley to Victoria service as the 82? I was thinking the same leaving the number 13 to be used on a future new route. The reason why the number 13 was kept is because TfL tried to fool Finchley Road residents due to the 'save the 13' petition as originally, the number 82 was to remain in place. However, passengers weren't silly and noticed this so I don't see what it's achieved.
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Post by redbus on Mar 30, 2017 14:40:07 GMT
Surely it would have been more logical to leave the North Finchley to Victoria service as the 82? I was thinking the same leaving the number 13 to be used on a future new route. The reason why the number 13 was kept is because TfL tried to fool Finchley Road residents due to the 'save the 13' petition as originally, the number 82 was to remain in place. However, passengers weren't silly and noticed this so I don't see what it's achieved. Apparently some politicians convinced TfL that people still wanted a bus number 13 down the Finchley Road, even if it went to different destinations. This is their response. Personally if there had to be some cuts and there could only be two routes, I would have extended the 13 up to Finchley, so it ran Finchley - Aldwych, and extended the 113 to Victoria. this would have made a lot more people happy, but probably TfL did not wish to spend money on this.
Also why are Metroline drivers moving to Edgware for the 113? Instead why could there not be a W allocation on the 113 along with an EW one? Wouldn't that have been easier / more convenient?
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Post by thewintersoldier on Mar 30, 2017 14:44:15 GMT
I was thinking the same leaving the number 13 to be used on a future new route. The reason why the number 13 was kept is because TfL tried to fool Finchley Road residents due to the 'save the 13' petition as originally, the number 82 was to remain in place. However, passengers weren't silly and noticed this so I don't see what it's achieved. Apparently some politicians convinced TfL that people still wanted a bus number 13 down the Finchley Road, even if it went to different destinations. This is their response. Personally if there had to be some cuts and there could only be two routes, I would have extended the 13 up to Finchley, so it ran Finchley - Aldwych, and extended the 113 to Victoria. this would have made a lot more people happy, but probably TfL did not wish to spend money on this.
Also why are Metroline drivers moving to Edgware for the 113? Instead why could there not be a W allocation on the 113 along with an EW one? Wouldn't that have been easier / more convenient?
I think that was the original plan to give W a part allocation. I think since they extended EW it would have just been easier to house it under one roof.
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Post by redbus on Mar 30, 2017 21:21:45 GMT
Depending on the new timetables, we could see some odd sights in early hours of Sat morning. The last Sovereign 13 leaves Aldwych at 0045. The current timetable of the 139 shows a departure from Waterloo at 0034 which I think is a night bus working, which will of course mean will also be Sovereign operated from Friday night. It's possible, that both Sovereign buses on these two journeys will arrive at Golders Green at the same time , or thereabouts ? Then we may see a night version of the "new" 13 running from Victoria close to the last departure of an 82 (0045) This obviously depends on the new schedules, none of which are currently available. Indeed you are right. There's a special schedule for bus 13 on the 31 March, with crosslinks to the night 139.
s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/bus.data.tfl.gov.uk/schedules/Schedule_13-sFr.pdf
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Post by redbus on Mar 30, 2017 21:34:56 GMT
From the loadings I saw on Tuesday morning, the am trips on the 113 are very busy, by the time they reach Finchley Rd very few seats left. Likewise, the 82 between N Finchley was interesting, as many alight at Golders Green, giving some capacity for the next main stop near the Sainsbury's. But by the time they reach Finchley Road, again there are very few seats left. I reckon it will be quite tight from next week, the journeys for those wanting to catch the bus will be that bit more uncomfortable, with much less prospect of getting a seat. This issue in itself could become a self fulfilling prophecy causing even more people to ditch travelling on the buses. The Finchley Road corridor seems to have inconsistent loadings for no apparent reason, particularly during the day. Initially I think all will be fine with school holidays and Easter coming up. The flashpoints will I suspect come later. One interesting day to watch is Sunday, for at various times on some (but far from all) Sundays, the existing combined service of 13, 82, 113 struggles to cope. The service reductions could easily result in people being left at bus stops.
I hope it will all work out well, but if I have to make predictions I'll go for a further 20% reduction in passengers as a result of these changes and the proposed CS11 works. That will leave plenty of space on the buses, albeit for the wrong reasons.
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Post by Whitherminter on Mar 30, 2017 23:53:51 GMT
I'd say if there was a time to re-introduce route branding, the 13's "diversion" would have been ideal.
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Post by snowman on Mar 31, 2017 6:04:47 GMT
Last day of the 82 today (the route number) as it gets replaced by 13 with Evosetis
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Post by Deleted on Mar 31, 2017 9:28:41 GMT
Last ever buses on London Bus Route N13 were :
VH7 VH45157 VH45159 VH45160 ( last bus back to BT ) VH45161 VHR45205
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Post by M1104 on Mar 31, 2017 9:53:44 GMT
Last day of the 82 today (the route number) as it gets replaced by 13 with Evosetis Will be interesting to know where the 'next incarnation' of the 82 will pop up in future. Perhaps in time it will replace or overlap another route that ends with 2.
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Post by snoggle on Mar 31, 2017 9:56:18 GMT
The Finchley Road corridor seems to have inconsistent loadings for no apparent reason, particularly during the day. Initially I think all will be fine with school holidays and Easter coming up. The flashpoints will I suspect come later. One interesting day to watch is Sunday, for at various times on some (but far from all) Sundays, the existing combined service of 13, 82, 113 struggles to cope. The service reductions could easily result in people being left at bus stops.
I hope it will all work out well, but if I have to make predictions I'll go for a further 20% reduction in passengers as a result of these changes and the proposed CS11 works. That will leave plenty of space on the buses, albeit for the wrong reasons. Interesting observation. I don't travel on the F Rd corridor very often but I have certainly noticed the inconsistency you cite. When I cleared off the 82 route I got a 460 back out of North Finchley. It was a Sunday. We were full to bursting before the bus even reached the A406 junction at Henly's Corner. I expected the bus to be half empty the whole way. Again I've seen 82s and 113s full heading south at Finchley Rd station and people didn't all pour off the bus to catch the tube either. I agree there's an interesting little challenge coming for TfL as to whether their theories work in practice.
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