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Post by sid on Feb 22, 2018 12:39:07 GMT
None the less four bus routes are excessive, by comparison the busier Gypsy Hill station is served by just one route. And to worsen the situation its ran with 8.9 metre buses due to restrictions that are often full to the brim Indeed the 322 has always been busy when I've used it, one extreme to the other between Anerley and Gypsy Hill as far as bus are concerned. |
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Post by galwhv69 on Feb 22, 2018 12:41:01 GMT
And to worsen the situation its ran with 8.9 metre buses due to restrictions that are often full to the brim Yes but shoving four routes down Gipsy Hill would be an example of overbussing unlike Anerley Hill & Anerley Road where the four routes that run between Crystal Palace & Anerley are there for a good reason. What should of happened at the last contract is upgraded it to 9.6m/9.7m dual door buses with a slight frequency increase rather than speccing the same inadequate length as the previous buses operated. Or maybe adding just one more 8.9 metre route that will run at a similar frequency to the 322 but coming halfway between 2 322 buses maybe between Elmers End And Clapham Park |
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Post by sid on Feb 22, 2018 12:53:31 GMT
Yes but shoving four routes down Gipsy Hill would be an example of overbussing unlike Anerley Hill & Anerley Road where the four routes that run between Crystal Palace & Anerley are there for a good reason. What should of happened at the last contract is upgraded it to 9.6m/9.7m dual door buses with a slight frequency increase rather than speccing the same inadequate length as the previous buses operated. Or maybe adding just one more 8.9 metre route that will run at a similar frequency to the 322 but coming halfway between 2 322 buses maybe between Elmers End And Clapham Park I think the 322 could justify 6 or even 8bph, the savings from curtailing the 249 and 432 at Crystal Palace could fund it. The 3 and 227 stand on the parade so I don't see why other buses can't. |
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Post by galwhv69 on Feb 22, 2018 13:09:34 GMT
Or maybe adding just one more 8.9 metre route that will run at a similar frequency to the 322 but coming halfway between 2 322 buses maybe between Elmers End And Clapham Park I think the 322 could justify 6 or even 8bph, the savings from curtailing the 249 and 432 at Crystal Palace could fund it. The 3 and 227 stand on the parade so I don't see why other buses can't. That could work well imo |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 22, 2018 23:46:53 GMT
Anerley Road outside Tescos is a very busy bus stop for the 249 & 432.
Anerley Station itself must be as busy as Gipsy Hill??
From what I've seen on an almost daily basis for long time now, the level of service along Anerley Road is justified.
I do think that it needs a direct service down to Elmers End.
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Post by vjaska on Feb 23, 2018 1:22:04 GMT
Anerley Road outside Tescos is a very busy bus stop for the 249 & 432. Anerley Station itself must be as busy as Gipsy Hill?? From what I've seen on an almost daily basis for long time now, the level of service along Anerley Road is justified. I do think that it needs a direct service down to Elmers End. Indeed with the 432 being in a slightly better position than the 249 to achieve the direct link to Elmers End & Birkbeck. |
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Post by sid on Feb 23, 2018 6:51:55 GMT
Anerley Road outside Tescos is a very busy bus stop for the 249 & 432. Anerley Station itself must be as busy as Gipsy Hill?? From what I've seen on an almost daily basis for long time now, the level of service along Anerley Road is justified. I do think that it needs a direct service down to Elmers End. Quite honestly I think two routes would be more than adequate although I agree about a link to Elmers End so three routes going three separate ways at Anerley crossroads would be ideal. Gipsy Hill is much busier than Anerley. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2018 8:15:45 GMT
Anerley Road outside Tescos is a very busy bus stop for the 249 & 432. Anerley Station itself must be as busy as Gipsy Hill?? From what I've seen on an almost daily basis for long time now, the level of service along Anerley Road is justified. I do think that it needs a direct service down to Elmers End. Quite honestly I think two routes would be more than adequate although I agree about a link to Elmers End so three routes going three separate ways at Anerley crossroads would be ideal. Gipsy Hill is much busier than Anerley. If the 249/432 were scrapped along Anerley Road , users of Crystal Palace Station who use these routes (boarding on Anerley Rd) would have an unpleasant uphill walk to the bus station. I don’t see any routes being cut along Anerley Road at all, and as I’ve mentioned before, there is a very big residential development almost complete behind William Booth Rd which will push up travel between there and Crystal Palace and at Anerley Station. |
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Post by sid on Feb 23, 2018 8:27:15 GMT
Quite honestly I think two routes would be more than adequate although I agree about a link to Elmers End so three routes going three separate ways at Anerley crossroads would be ideal. Gipsy Hill is much busier than Anerley. If the 249/432 were scrapped along Anerley Road , users of Crystal Palace Station who use these routes (boarding on Anerley Rd) would have an unpleasant uphill walk to the bus station. I don’t see any routes being cut along Anerley Road at all, and as I’ve mentioned before, there is a very big residential development almost complete behind William Booth Rd which will push up travel between there and Crystal Palace and at Anerley Station. They would take a 157 or 358 up the hill and change as used to happen, the 249 and 432 were only extended to Anerley because there wasn't enough stand space at Crystal Palace bus station not to cater for any passenger demand, originally it was going to be the 3 and 322. I just don't see where this alleged demand for four routes, five if you include the 410 which is very busy, comes from? The 157 and 358 carry reasonable loads but the 249 and 432 a handful of passengers at most, some are completely empty. By comparison the parallel Crystal Palace to Penge via CPR route has only the 227 which seems perfectly adequate. Ideally there would be an escalator link between the railway station and bus station, I think that was seriously suggested some time ago? Alternatively maybe a stand for the 249 and 432 could be accommodated in Ledrington Road which would be even better for the station. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2018 9:35:50 GMT
If the 249/432 were scrapped along Anerley Road , users of Crystal Palace Station who use these routes (boarding on Anerley Rd) would have an unpleasant uphill walk to the bus station. I don’t see any routes being cut along Anerley Road at all, and as I’ve mentioned before, there is a very big residential development almost complete behind William Booth Rd which will push up travel between there and Crystal Palace and at Anerley Station. They would take a 157 or 358 up the hill and change as used to happen, the 249 and 432 were only extended to Anerley because there wasn't enough stand space at Crystal Palace bus station not to cater for any passenger demand, originally it was going to be the 3 and 322. I just don't see where this alleged demand for four routes, five if you include the 410 which is very busy, comes from? The 157 and 358 carry reasonable loads but the 249 and 432 a handful of passengers at most, some are completely empty. By comparison the parallel Crystal Palace to Penge via CPR route has only the 227 which seems perfectly adequate. Ideally there would be an escalator link between the railway station and bus station, I think that was seriously suggested some time ago? Alternatively maybe a stand for the 249 and 432 could be accommodated in Ledrington Road which would be even better for the station. I work in Anerley and see the buses daily so there is no alleged about it from my point of view. Your point about stand space may be correct, but they were extended years ago and have developed a natural demand now, it’s not the picture you paint at all I’m afraid, of empty buses going up and down the road to an overflow stand of Crystal Palace. The first stops on Anerley Station Road always have people waiting, not just from the station, but from the high density poorer households on The Groves Estate. We won’t agree about this one Sid I’m afraid ! |
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Post by sid on Feb 23, 2018 9:42:45 GMT
They would take a 157 or 358 up the hill and change as used to happen, the 249 and 432 were only extended to Anerley because there wasn't enough stand space at Crystal Palace bus station not to cater for any passenger demand, originally it was going to be the 3 and 322. I just don't see where this alleged demand for four routes, five if you include the 410 which is very busy, comes from? The 157 and 358 carry reasonable loads but the 249 and 432 a handful of passengers at most, some are completely empty. By comparison the parallel Crystal Palace to Penge via CPR route has only the 227 which seems perfectly adequate. Ideally there would be an escalator link between the railway station and bus station, I think that was seriously suggested some time ago? Alternatively maybe a stand for the 249 and 432 could be accommodated in Ledrington Road which would be even better for the station. I work in Anerley and see the buses daily so there is no alleged about it from my point of view. Your point about stand space may be correct, but they were extended years ago and have developed a natural demand now, it’s not the picture you paint at all I’m afraid, of empty buses going up and down the road to an overflow stand of Crystal Palace. The first stops on Anerley Station Road always have people waiting, not just from the station, but from the high density poorer households on The Groves Estate. We won’t agree about this one Sid I’m afraid ! I have family in the area and visit regularly but we're not going to agree so best left at that. |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 23, 2018 12:32:46 GMT
If the 249/432 were scrapped along Anerley Road , users of Crystal Palace Station who use these routes (boarding on Anerley Rd) would have an unpleasant uphill walk to the bus station. I don’t see any routes being cut along Anerley Road at all, and as I’ve mentioned before, there is a very big residential development almost complete behind William Booth Rd which will push up travel between there and Crystal Palace and at Anerley Station. They would take a 157 or 358 up the hill and change as used to happen, the 249 and 432 were only extended to Anerley because there wasn't enough stand space at Crystal Palace bus station not to cater for any passenger demand, originally it was going to be the 3 and 322. I just don't see where this alleged demand for four routes, five if you include the 410 which is very busy, comes from? The 157 and 358 carry reasonable loads but the 249 and 432 a handful of passengers at most, some are completely empty. By comparison the parallel Crystal Palace to Penge via CPR route has only the 227 which seems perfectly adequate. Ideally there would be an escalator link between the railway station and bus station, I think that was seriously suggested some time ago? Alternatively maybe a stand for the 249 and 432 could be accommodated in Ledrington Road which would be even better for the station. Top end of Ledrington Road has ben blocked off but that would be ideal for the station even if it was only a stand for midibus route 322, it could still do a double run to serve the bus station. |
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Post by sid on Feb 26, 2018 12:15:48 GMT
They would take a 157 or 358 up the hill and change as used to happen, the 249 and 432 were only extended to Anerley because there wasn't enough stand space at Crystal Palace bus station not to cater for any passenger demand, originally it was going to be the 3 and 322. I just don't see where this alleged demand for four routes, five if you include the 410 which is very busy, comes from? The 157 and 358 carry reasonable loads but the 249 and 432 a handful of passengers at most, some are completely empty. By comparison the parallel Crystal Palace to Penge via CPR route has only the 227 which seems perfectly adequate. Ideally there would be an escalator link between the railway station and bus station, I think that was seriously suggested some time ago? Alternatively maybe a stand for the 249 and 432 could be accommodated in Ledrington Road which would be even better for the station. Top end of Ledrington Road has ben blocked off but that would be ideal for the station even if it was only a stand for midibus route 322, it could still do a double run to serve the bus station. Yes I think the 322 would be ideal for a stand in Ledrington Road, there are low trees which would preclude double deckers. I know that the top end is blocked off but it's still accessible via the road into the park, could even have a stop at Canada Gate. On the subject of bus provision between Crystal Palace and Anerley, I was in the area at the weekend visiting family and the photos I took at about midday on Saturday tell their own story, loads of fresh air! www.flickr.com/photos/154741497@N03/albums/72157692138666301Needlessly running the 249 and 432 to Anerley means they get caught up in this congestion www.flickr.com/photos/154741497@N03/38685326130/in/dateposted-public/Congestion around the triangle was bad enough anyway resulting in a rather empty bus station although buses from the Sydenham direction were doing much better www.flickr.com/photos/154741497@N03/38685331340/in/dateposted-public/ |
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Post by Deleted on Feb 28, 2018 12:10:16 GMT
Top end of Ledrington Road has ben blocked off but that would be ideal for the station even if it was only a stand for midibus route 322, it could still do a double run to serve the bus station. Yes I think the 322 would be ideal for a stand in Ledrington Road, there are low trees which would preclude double deckers. I know that the top end is blocked off but it's still accessible via the road into the park, could even have a stop at Canada Gate. On the subject of bus provision between Crystal Palace and Anerley, I was in the area at the weekend visiting family and the photos I took at about midday on Saturday tell their own story, loads of fresh air! www.flickr.com/photos/154741497@N03/albums/72157692138666301Needlessly running the 249 and 432 to Anerley means they get caught up in this congestion www.flickr.com/photos/154741497@N03/38685326130/in/dateposted-public/Congestion around the triangle was bad enough anyway resulting in a rather empty bus station although buses from the Sydenham direction were doing much better www.flickr.com/photos/154741497@N03/38685331340/in/dateposted-public/Congestion like that is not uncommon on Anerley Hill. I agree that four routes is excessive, two would be adequate with room to spare. I would suggest rerouting the 358 direct via Birkbeck, the 194 covers the Penge and Beckenham bit, and extending the 176 to Anerley Station. |
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Post by vjaska on Feb 28, 2018 12:57:43 GMT
Congestion like that is not uncommon on Anerley Hill. I agree that four routes is excessive, two would be adequate with room to spare. I would suggest rerouting the 358 direct via Birkbeck, the 194 covers the Penge and Beckenham bit, and extending the 176 to Anerley Station. Most likely why there was traffic that day was down to Crystal Palace playing at home - generally, the one way system isn’t too hard to get around. The problem with this is you end up losing the link between Anerley & Beckenham Road which would have a knock on effect to the already very busy 237 & the 358 has been doing this link for many years so I don’t see why you need to change it. The 432 can provide the direct connection between Elmers End, Birkbeck & Crystal Palace leaving the 249 to continue to terminate at Anerley. The 157 & 358 come & go from different directions in any event so four routes is adequate. |
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