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Post by southlondonbus on Apr 28, 2020 13:02:14 GMT
Would that be such a bad thing? Night buses are simply run as an essential service for a few people sunday to Thursday night. If those few decided to use a car or taxi it's hardly going to clog up the roads. By all means keep Friday and Saturday nights competitive but for routes carrying less then probably 10,000 people a year on routes like the 213 and 365 demonstrates how low demand is anyways.
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Post by vjaska on Apr 28, 2020 13:44:19 GMT
Would that be such a bad thing? Night buses are simply run as an essential service for a few people sunday to Thursday night. If those few decided to use a car or taxi it's hardly going to clog up the roads. By all means keep Friday and Saturday nights competitive but for routes carrying less then probably 10,000 people a year on routes like the 213 and 365 demonstrates how low demand is anyways. I think your missing where I’m coming from - the whole point of public transport is attract people to use it not make it difficult and turn them over to private hire options - my reply had nothing do with traffic whatsoever. I’m a little worried that you think it’s not a bad thing when you haven’t taken into account the poorest people who can not afford other options and who generally undertake night work. Why not just scrap those routes entirely then instead?
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Post by southlondonbus on Apr 28, 2020 14:29:28 GMT
Did I say scrap then? No I didnt. If there is a small demand then that demand can easily met with an hourly service. I'm sorry but is in no doubt. You find me somewhere else in the UK or even the world that provides the eqiviant between Romford and Orchard Village (Mard**e Estate) every 30 mins on a monday night I'd like to see.
If all 29,000 pay a single fare (not bus pass or freedom pass) then the total revenue comes to £43,500. That probably barely covers the cost of the N213 for a months or so.
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mw83
Cleaner
Posts: 30
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Post by mw83 on Apr 28, 2020 14:31:49 GMT
N365 should serve Hornchurch town centre at night or extended to Dagenham Asda or Rainham Tesco
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Post by LondonNorthern on Apr 28, 2020 15:21:14 GMT
The N365 is an odd route. You take an N15 to Romford which is easily an hour 30 mins, then an N365 possibly for up to 30 minutes to reach the southern end. To make this journey easier, I'd extend the N238 from Barking to Rainham Interchange via Vicarage Field Shopping Centre then Route 368 to Woodward Road, 62 to Becontree, Route 145 to Dagenham, The Ley, Route 103 to South Hornchurch, Cherry Tree Lane and Route 372 to Rainham Interchange.
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Post by greenboy on Apr 28, 2020 16:37:38 GMT
It's only a few minutes from Copt Guilders to Chessington so not much to be gained and there's the problem of stand arrangements. The whole night service between Kingston and Chessington could well be at risk in the current climate. What do you mean by current climate? I'd much rather they sliced it at Hook Parade , run to the roundabout and turn around. The way things are at the moment I think a few night routes are likely to go, or at least have a frequency reduction.
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Post by ronnie on Apr 28, 2020 16:39:57 GMT
I expect that a few routes can be merged together at night to cut costs. Especially the 24 hour routes can be extended into N equivalents and made longer - N238 (eastern end), N145 etc
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Post by Gellico on Apr 28, 2020 18:42:40 GMT
I do think with the low night bus loadings (less then 50k carried on the routes like the (N)213 and 365 plus many others like the 119, that maybe I know it sounds cruel to people that rely on them but maybe sunday to thursday night the standard night frequency should be every 60 mins now. That would be bake 4 journeys throughout the night if the day route is at 12 and the first around 5am. If not most night routes could cope with that now. Night buses probably carry 70% off the passengers on Friday and saturday night if not even more. I think the N343 should be withdrawn between London Bridge & TSQ and rerouted to Shoreditch via Routes 343 & 242 & 35 and N381 gets withdrawn between Waterloo Station and Whitehall Horse Guards and rerouted to Trafalgar Square via old route N343 That sounds a bit better Why what's the point? What does this achieve?
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Post by LondonNorthern on Apr 28, 2020 19:45:31 GMT
I think the N343 should be withdrawn between London Bridge & TSQ and rerouted to Shoreditch via Routes 343 & 242 & 35 and N381 gets withdrawn between Waterloo Station and Whitehall Horse Guards and rerouted to Trafalgar Square via old route N343 That sounds a bit better Why what's the point? What does this achieve? Well you serve a different area that no night buses current serve - think of the number of buses going to Trafalgar Square from Peckham & New Cross Gate currently (12, N136, N381 at Peckham, 453, N21, N53, N89, N136 at New Cross Gate) and could potentially boost night time usage post COVID Because Commercial Street definitely needs a night route due to the night patronage.
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Post by LondonNorthern on Apr 28, 2020 19:53:49 GMT
What do you mean by current climate? I'd much rather they sliced it at Hook Parade , run to the roundabout and turn around. The way things are at the moment I think a few night routes are likely to go, or at least have a frequency reduction. The route gets patronage to Hook - I think that part should be kept (Hook - Kingston) however I don't think it would matter if the bit to Chessington was sliced because it clearly doesn't get enough use
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Post by southlondonbus on Apr 28, 2020 20:49:11 GMT
As if doesn't run as the 71 at night it's dosent matter how far south the N65 goes. I'd keep it to Chessington South thou.
I wonder if TFL will dig out a rumoured consultation on the night bus network from a few years ago that never came to fruition.
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Post by londonbuses2018 on Apr 28, 2020 21:47:52 GMT
Regarding Brent Cross West Station or just Brent Cross West
Route N189 would split from daytime 189 from Marble Arch to West Hendon Broadway, N189 would serve Claremont Road, Tilling Road, Staples Corner, Edgware Road, West Hendon Broadway them terminate at West Hendon Bus stands.
Route N102 would split from daytime 102 from Edmonton Green to Brent Cross West or West Hendon Broadway this would be routed via Cricklewood Lane.
Route N266 would also terminate at Brent Cross West or be extended towards Edgware linking Edgware to Willesden, Harlesden, Acton and Hammersmith.
Thats if plans go ahead with the Regeneration things are bound to change so this is just speculation. The Bus Stand at Perryfield Way is proposed to move to Wilberforce Road with Road layout changes including a two way on Station Road.
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Post by vjaska on Apr 28, 2020 21:53:26 GMT
Did I say scrap then? No I didnt. If there is a small demand then that demand can easily met with an hourly service. I'm sorry but is in no doubt. You find me somewhere else in the UK or even the world that provides the eqiviant between Romford and Orchard Village (Mard**e Estate) every 30 mins on a monday night I'd like to see. If all 29,000 pay a single fare (not bus pass or freedom pass) then the total revenue comes to £43,500. That probably barely covers the cost of the N213 for a months or so. I never said you said to scrap them - what I said was you may as well scrap those routes if you drop to an hour as there will be people who will vote with their feet and use private transport instead. People have a certain threshold when it comes to how long to wait - if they see a more attractive service elsewhere that turns quicker and is just as cheap such as Uber, then they'll vote with their feet and then you won't even have a N119 full stop for example.
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Post by busboy17 on Apr 29, 2020 2:14:44 GMT
Why what's the point? What does this achieve? Well you serve a different area that no night buses current serve - think of the number of buses going to Trafalgar Square from Peckham & New Cross Gate currently (12, N136, N381 at Peckham, 453, N21, N53, N89, N136 at New Cross Gate) and could potentially boost night time usage post COVID Because Commercial Street definitely needs a night route due to the night patronage. I think an N343 to Shoreditch sounds alright I’d say make the 381 24 hours from Whitehall to Peckham
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Post by enviroPB on Apr 29, 2020 6:31:52 GMT
As if doesn't run as the 71 at night it's dosent matter how far south the N65 goes. I'd keep it to Chessington South thou. I wonder if TFL will dig out a rumoured consultation on the night bus network from a few years ago that never came to fruition. What do you mean by rumoured consultation? There was a night bus consultation in conjunction with the Night Tube being borne. TfL under Boris' regime devised the savage cuts, Khan got into office to 'review changes in night bus usage' or something similar and then he carried out all the brutal cuts with no revision to the plans. The night bus network was a marvellous, frequent machine 5 years ago. It's a much tamer beast now but with that being said, there could be homogenised savings by simply merging a couple suburban night routes; 321 being scrapped with the N21 covering up to Foots Cray is the easiest example that comes to mind. Another forum member mentioned merging the 52 and 297 a couple weeks ago, that's another example of saving 2 buses off the combined PVR.
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