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Post by cardinal on Jul 25, 2023 22:56:52 GMT
Don't get me wrong iv long felt that the london night bus network is too generous and standardised for the amount of demand there is inevitably going to be at night. Even in a 24h city 95% of people are asleep between 1am and 5am. This is what I was thinking. I have seen some suggestions for services based on some very casual observations. Even taking into account shift workers they are not likely to be in the middle of the night.
Yes it would be nice to have certain links but the practicality of some is just not justified.
I have to reach work in Central London for 6am so leave my home at 430am. I’m lucky as I live near Heathrow so day routes start early. So the argument about shift workers should take into account the travel time rather than the time their shifts start. Likewise people who work at Kingston Hospital who live in Sutton if they start work at 5am then clearly they’ll be using a night bus. These jobs are not high wages so will more likely use buses. Then you have people who finish late at night as well. Night buses are key to London and surrounding areas. Not everywhere needs them but it’s pretty obvious where they are needed. |
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Post by twobellstogo on Jul 26, 2023 10:38:20 GMT
I don’t get where a ‘lack of demand’ comes from, Bexleyheath and Dartford have a noticeable night scene. Both Bexleyheath and Dartford are pretty much dormant after midnight-ish, the latter especially. I just can’t see how a night service on the 96 is in any way viable. |
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Post by southlondon413 on Jul 26, 2023 11:09:27 GMT
This is what I was thinking. I have seen some suggestions for services based on some very casual observations. Even taking into account shift workers they are not likely to be in the middle of the night.
Yes it would be nice to have certain links but the practicality of some is just not justified.
I have to reach work in Central London for 6am so leave my home at 430am. I’m lucky as I live near Heathrow so day routes start early. So the argument about shift workers should take into account the travel time rather than the time their shifts start. Likewise people who work at Kingston Hospital who live in Sutton if they start work at 5am then clearly they’ll be using a night bus. These jobs are not high wages so will more likely use buses. Then you have people who finish late at night as well. Night buses are key to London and surrounding areas. Not everywhere needs them but it’s pretty obvious where they are needed. There aren’t many NHS shifts that start before 7am. Commonly nurses and health support workers start around 7am. Doctor shifts start around 8am. Night shifts finish between 8-9am. So the need for a night bus isn’t really essential. Hospital visiting hours typically end around 8pm and most facilities like canteens or coffee shops are closed overnight in hospitals. At Kingston for example the canteen opens at 7am and closes at 3pm so the staff there might need to get there for 6/6.30am to prep but they are likely the exception but again they wouldn’t necessarily need a night bus. Night buses only really serve drunks, the homeless and other vagrants who have nowhere else to go. |
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Post by wirewiper on Jul 26, 2023 11:14:53 GMT
I have to reach work in Central London for 6am so leave my home at 430am. I’m lucky as I live near Heathrow so day routes start early. So the argument about shift workers should take into account the travel time rather than the time their shifts start. Likewise people who work at Kingston Hospital who live in Sutton if they start work at 5am then clearly they’ll be using a night bus. These jobs are not high wages so will more likely use buses. Then you have people who finish late at night as well. Night buses are key to London and surrounding areas. Not everywhere needs them but it’s pretty obvious where they are needed. There aren’t many NHS shifts that start before 7am. Commonly nurses and health support workers start around 7am. Doctor shifts start around 8am. Night shifts finish between 8-9am. So the need for a night bus isn’t really essential. Hospital visiting hours typically end around 8pm and most facilities like canteens or coffee shops are closed overnight in hospitals. At Kingston for example the canteen opens at 7am and closes at 3pm so the staff there might need to get there for 6/6.30am to prep but they are likely the exception but again they wouldn’t necessarily need a night bus. Night buses only really serve drunks, the homeless and other vagrants who have nowhere else to go. I agree about the hospitals. There's a perception that hospitals need 24-hour services but they really don't. All they need are services that start early enough and finish late enough to cater for the shift changes. However 24-hour services can be useful to people who work in hospitality. |
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Post by cardinal on Jul 26, 2023 11:35:01 GMT
I have to reach work in Central London for 6am so leave my home at 430am. I’m lucky as I live near Heathrow so day routes start early. So the argument about shift workers should take into account the travel time rather than the time their shifts start. Likewise people who work at Kingston Hospital who live in Sutton if they start work at 5am then clearly they’ll be using a night bus. These jobs are not high wages so will more likely use buses. Then you have people who finish late at night as well. Night buses are key to London and surrounding areas. Not everywhere needs them but it’s pretty obvious where they are needed. There aren’t many NHS shifts that start before 7am. Commonly nurses and health support workers start around 7am. Doctor shifts start around 8am. Night shifts finish between 8-9am. So the need for a night bus isn’t really essential. Hospital visiting hours typically end around 8pm and most facilities like canteens or coffee shops are closed overnight in hospitals. At Kingston for example the canteen opens at 7am and closes at 3pm so the staff there might need to get there for 6/6.30am to prep but they are likely the exception but again they wouldn’t necessarily need a night bus. Night buses only really serve drunks, the homeless and other vagrants who have nowhere else to go. What a stupid thing to say. You clearly have no knowledge at all and are just either being stupid on purpose or just stupid. There are too many errors or plain stupidity above to go through one by one. |
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Post by southlondon413 on Jul 26, 2023 11:36:30 GMT
There aren’t many NHS shifts that start before 7am. Commonly nurses and health support workers start around 7am. Doctor shifts start around 8am. Night shifts finish between 8-9am. So the need for a night bus isn’t really essential. Hospital visiting hours typically end around 8pm and most facilities like canteens or coffee shops are closed overnight in hospitals. At Kingston for example the canteen opens at 7am and closes at 3pm so the staff there might need to get there for 6/6.30am to prep but they are likely the exception but again they wouldn’t necessarily need a night bus. Night buses only really serve drunks, the homeless and other vagrants who have nowhere else to go. What a stupid thing to say. You clearly have no knowledge at all and are just either being stupid on purpose or just stupid. There are too many errors or plain stupidity above to go through one by one. |
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Post by cardinal on Jul 26, 2023 11:41:44 GMT
You have said night bus passengers (me) are homeless , drunks or vagrants So you should apologise not send links about shift times at Kingston Hospital . |
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Post by southlondon413 on Jul 26, 2023 11:41:55 GMT
There aren’t many NHS shifts that start before 7am. Commonly nurses and health support workers start around 7am. Doctor shifts start around 8am. Night shifts finish between 8-9am. So the need for a night bus isn’t really essential. Hospital visiting hours typically end around 8pm and most facilities like canteens or coffee shops are closed overnight in hospitals. At Kingston for example the canteen opens at 7am and closes at 3pm so the staff there might need to get there for 6/6.30am to prep but they are likely the exception but again they wouldn’t necessarily need a night bus. Night buses only really serve drunks, the homeless and other vagrants who have nowhere else to go. I agree about the hospitals. There's a perception that hospitals need 24-hour services but they really don't. All they need are services that start early enough and finish late enough to cater for the shift changes. However 24-hour services can be useful to people who work in hospitality. They can but if you work for a good hospitality company like an events company you can normally get a cab home after a certain time billed directly to the company. A friend of mine who owns an events company always builds it into the quote. If you have 5 staff staying after midnight in the quote to clean up then the client gets billed a set fee for cab costs home. |
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Post by cardinal on Jul 26, 2023 11:42:32 GMT
Would you like to see my shift pattern ? And hundreds of others who work with me You utter fool |
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Post by LK65EBO on Jul 26, 2023 11:47:29 GMT
I've always thought a night version of the 117 would be useful.
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Post by northlondon83 on Jul 26, 2023 11:58:20 GMT
This is what I was thinking. I have seen some suggestions for services based on some very casual observations. Even taking into account shift workers they are not likely to be in the middle of the night.
Yes it would be nice to have certain links but the practicality of some is just not justified.
I have to reach work in Central London for 6am so leave my home at 430am. I’m lucky as I live near Heathrow so day routes start early. So the argument about shift workers should take into account the travel time rather than the time their shifts start. Likewise people who work at Kingston Hospital who live in Sutton if they start work at 5am then clearly they’ll be using a night bus. These jobs are not high wages so will more likely use buses. Then you have people who finish late at night as well. Night buses are key to London and surrounding areas. Not everywhere needs them but it’s pretty obvious where they are needed. I agree and the night route network in NW London is poor. They should really reinstate the 114 and 183 night variants. Currently Ruislip, Northwood and Pinner have no night routes. I work nights like yourself and luckily I have the N207 where I live. However if I lived in the areas I mentioned I wouldn't be as fortunate. |
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Post by londonbuses on Jul 26, 2023 20:08:11 GMT
This will probably be an unpopular opinion on here, but similar to how every household is supposed to be within 400m of a bus route, I believe nearly every household should be within 1.6 km/1 mile of a 24 hour/night bus service - this is roughly a 20 minute walk which I would say is the furthest distance an able bodied person should have to walk to access a bus service without a car/taxi.
This is mostly already the case in Greater London, except for some massive gaps in the boroughs of Sutton (Carshalton, Wallington, Belmont, Carshalton Beeches, Hackbridge and Woodcote), and Hillingdon/Harrow (Ruislip, Ickenham, Pinner and Northwood) and a few other gaps such as Elmers End, Biggin Hill and Upminster.
Obviously this shouldn't be taken to the extremes of having 24 hour services down country lanes to serve small amounts of people, but every reasonably populated town should be served by some sort of night service.
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Post by tooting395 on Jul 26, 2023 21:24:13 GMT
Not true. Nhs proffesionals are bank staff and not representative of full time staff or permanently contracted staff. Doctors and Nurses have shifts that end at midnight or past midnight. Especially in A&E and other settings that use twilight shifts with extra staff to cover busy evening and early parts of nights. Many use the N264 that I personally know. |
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Jul 26, 2023 21:40:53 GMT
Not true. Nhs proffesionals are bank staff and not representative of full time staff or permanently contracted staff. Doctors and Nurses have shifts that end at midnight or past midnight. Especially in A&E and other settings that use twilight shifts with extra staff to cover busy evening and early parts of nights. Many use the N264 that I personally know. While you're right, shifts are not scheduled to finish at ridiculous hours. Whether they do is an entire different story though. Nobody realistically finishes a shift at 3am unless they've been doing overtime. The argument is whether night buses cater for these staff. I believe many hospitals do pay for private transport but many don't at all. Each Trust is a different case and needs to be viewed and judged according to local policies. |
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Post by tooting395 on Jul 26, 2023 22:10:20 GMT
Not true. Nhs proffesionals are bank staff and not representative of full time staff or permanently contracted staff. Doctors and Nurses have shifts that end at midnight or past midnight. Especially in A&E and other settings that use twilight shifts with extra staff to cover busy evening and early parts of nights. Many use the N264 that I personally know. While you're right, shifts are not scheduled to finish at ridiculous hours. Whether they do is an entire different story though. Nobody realistically finishes a shift at 3am unless they've been doing overtime. The argument is whether night buses cater for these staff. I believe many hospitals do pay for private transport but many don't at all. Each Trust is a different case and needs to be viewed and judged according to local policies. No, shifts are scheduled to finish at midnight and even after midnight. Google nhs twilight shifts. Additionally there will be staff who aren't required to be on site over night unless they are specifically called in (although usually the expectation is that they are able to drive and not rely on public transport). Most hospitals in London don't pay for private transport. Now I am not saying that this is a valid reason for night buses however the above comment that they aren't used by hospital or other shift working staff is just absurd. |
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