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Post by redexpress on Aug 3, 2020 10:34:57 GMT
214: Withdrawn between Kentish Town and Highgate Village, rerouted to Archway. Enables conversion to d/d. 234: Withdrawn between Muswell Hill Broadway and Highgate Woods. Also rerouted direct via Colney Hatch Lane. Provides quicker links between Barnet and Muswell Hill. Ideally I'd also like to route it directly via High Road in Barnet and miss out New Barnet but I don't know what would replace it (rerouting either the 34 or 263 doesn't solve the problem because it just swaps the longer-journey issue on to a different route). 334: NEW ROUTE - Friern Barnet, via 234 route to Highgate Woods, North Hill, 214 route to Camden Town. New s/d route to allow the conversion of route 214 and possibly also 234 to d/d. 234 already runs direct via High Road in Barnet - are you perhaps thinking of the 326?
I like the 334 idea. However I'm not sure whether Archway is the best terminus for the 214, given that Archway and Tufnell Park already have quicker links to King's Cross. Perhaps it could just be cut back to Parliament Hill.
Stand space in Camden would be an issue with the 334, although that could be solved by extending the 31 to Mornington Crescent.
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Post by wirewiper on Aug 3, 2020 10:57:12 GMT
214: Withdrawn between Kentish Town and Highgate Village, rerouted to Archway. Enables conversion to d/d. 234: Withdrawn between Muswell Hill Broadway and Highgate Woods. Also rerouted direct via Colney Hatch Lane. Provides quicker links between Barnet and Muswell Hill. Ideally I'd also like to route it directly via High Road in Barnet and miss out New Barnet but I don't know what would replace it (rerouting either the 34 or 263 doesn't solve the problem because it just swaps the longer-journey issue on to a different route). 334: NEW ROUTE - Friern Barnet, via 234 route to Highgate Woods, North Hill, 214 route to Camden Town. New s/d route to allow the conversion of route 214 and possibly also 234 to d/d. 234 already runs direct via High Road in Barnet - are you perhaps thinking of the 326?
I like the 334 idea. However I'm not sure whether Archway is the best terminus for the 214, given that Archway and Tufnell Park already have quicker links to King's Cross. Perhaps it could just be cut back to Parliament Hill.
Stand space in Camden would be an issue with the 334, although that could be solved by extending the 31 to Mornington Crescent.
234 problem solved - thank you! Although I realise now that stand space at Muswell Hill Broadway could be an issue. I wanted to keep the 214 in Kentish Town rather than cutting back to Camden Town, I also wanted to avoid over-bussing the stand at Parliament Hill Fields so thought Archway would make a suitable alternative terminus. Also with a double-deck 214 helping out between Camden Town and Archway and the 234 running via Colney Hatch Lane there could be a case for a small frequency reduction on the 134. 334 could terminate at Mornington Crescent.
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Post by greg on Aug 3, 2020 11:49:56 GMT
234 already runs direct via High Road in Barnet - are you perhaps thinking of the 326?
I like the 334 idea. However I'm not sure whether Archway is the best terminus for the 214, given that Archway and Tufnell Park already have quicker links to King's Cross. Perhaps it could just be cut back to Parliament Hill.
Stand space in Camden would be an issue with the 334, although that could be solved by extending the 31 to Mornington Crescent.
234 problem solved - thank you! Although I realise now that stand space at Muswell Hill Broadway could be an issue. I wanted to keep the 214 in Kentish Town rather than cutting back to Camden Town, I also wanted to avoid over-bussing the stand at Parliament Hill Fields so thought Archway would make a suitable alternative terminus. Also with a double-deck 214 helping out between Camden Town and Archway and the 234 running via Colney Hatch Lane there could be a case for a small frequency reduction on the 134. 334 could terminate at Mornington Crescent. I like the idea of the 31 at Mornington Crescent, a lot. Think your 334 could terminate at Kentish Town Station, I don’t really see the need of it as far as Camden as most Highgate residents are elderly and just use buses for local high streets. They would just have to put a stand somewhere. The 214, what you could do, is swap the 214/C11 routings at Parliament Hill, with the 214 going to Archway via the C11 and diverting the C11 to Highgate Village. Another thing for the 334, is to have it run to Chalk Farm Morrisons, and follow the 393. Running down Kentish Town Road, Kentish Town West, Chalk Farm Road to Morrisons. There is no stand space at the moment due to the Gas Station being redeveloped however. If not that, then divert the 334 via the 393 at Kentish Town to Holloway Road and then to Holloway, Nags Head. Highgate-Holloway route seems good also.
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Post by wirewiper on Aug 3, 2020 12:04:31 GMT
234 already runs direct via High Road in Barnet - are you perhaps thinking of the 326?
I like the 334 idea. However I'm not sure whether Archway is the best terminus for the 214, given that Archway and Tufnell Park already have quicker links to King's Cross. Perhaps it could just be cut back to Parliament Hill.
Stand space in Camden would be an issue with the 334, although that could be solved by extending the 31 to Mornington Crescent.
234 problem solved - thank you! Although I realise now that stand space at Muswell Hill Broadway could be an issue. I wanted to keep the 214 in Kentish Town rather than cutting back to Camden Town, I also wanted to avoid over-bussing the stand at Parliament Hill Fields so thought Archway would make a suitable alternative terminus. Also with a double-deck 214 helping out between Camden Town and Archway and the 234 running via Colney Hatch Lane there could be a case for a small frequency reduction on the 134. 334 could terminate at Mornington Crescent. I've also realised that removing the 214 from Highgate Village would enable the 271 to take over its stand. This would enable the existing stand at South Grove to be closed (it isn't suitable for disabled users, plus all buses towards Archway Station would then serve the same stop in Highgate Hill).
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Post by northlondonbuses on Aug 3, 2020 12:04:32 GMT
214: Withdrawn between Kentish Town and Highgate Village, rerouted to Archway. Enables conversion to d/d. 234: Withdrawn between Muswell Hill Broadway and Highgate Woods. Also rerouted direct via Colney Hatch Lane. Provides quicker links between Barnet and Muswell Hill. Ideally I'd also like to route it directly via High Road in Barnet and miss out New Barnet but I don't know what would replace it (rerouting either the 34 or 263 doesn't solve the problem because it just swaps the longer-journey issue on to a different route). 334: NEW ROUTE - Friern Barnet, via 234 route to Highgate Woods, North Hill, 214 route to Camden Town. New s/d route to allow the conversion of route 214 and possibly also 234 to d/d. I think the new 214 is a good Idea as it can relieve the 134/43/271 when the Northern line is down as if you see Archway at 8:20 in the morning when the Northern line is down is horrendous and all the bus routes that go central london especially (390/134/43) are packed to the brim and there are still many more people waiting at the bus stop to get on so I think its a good Idea.
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Post by redexpress on Aug 3, 2020 21:02:02 GMT
234 already runs direct via High Road in Barnet - are you perhaps thinking of the 326?
I like the 334 idea. However I'm not sure whether Archway is the best terminus for the 214, given that Archway and Tufnell Park already have quicker links to King's Cross. Perhaps it could just be cut back to Parliament Hill.
Stand space in Camden would be an issue with the 334, although that could be solved by extending the 31 to Mornington Crescent.
234 problem solved - thank you! Although I realise now that stand space at Muswell Hill Broadway could be an issue. I wanted to keep the 214 in Kentish Town rather than cutting back to Camden Town, I also wanted to avoid over-bussing the stand at Parliament Hill Fields so thought Archway would make a suitable alternative terminus. Also with a double-deck 214 helping out between Camden Town and Archway and the 234 running via Colney Hatch Lane there could be a case for a small frequency reduction on the 134. 334 could terminate at Mornington Crescent. Yes, an extra route between Camden and Archway, at the expense of a reduction on the 134, is not a bad idea.
Stand space at Muswell Hill is certainly an issue. Could perhaps run it down to the Alexandra Park stand, although that's a bit of a middle-of-nowhere terminus just for the sake of finding space - a bit like Manor Circus in Richmond.
I did think of the 334 for Mornington Crescent, but I think the 31 would provide a local link between the southern end of Camden High Street and Adelaide Road / Swiss Cottage, whereas the 334 would be shadowing the 134.
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Post by greg on Aug 5, 2020 11:30:16 GMT
changes to routes 12, 24, 27 and 176:
12: withdrawn between Regent Street and Oxford Circus, extended to Camden Town via route 24 from Trafalgar Square
27: extended from Chalk Farm Morrisons to Hampstead Heath via route 24, to serve this missed area (the cutback on route 27 to Hammersmith means it can work, and the 12 wont become too long so keep it as far as Camden Town)
176: rerouted from Trafalgar Square to Oxford Circus via route 12 and withdrawn between Leicester Square and Tottenham Court Road. (a new support to the 139, and does not duplicate the 88 and 453 as far as the 12 did, but meets the 453 at E&C and the proposed 12 at Dulwich and inbetween E&C and Camberwell)
24: rerouted from Tottenham Court Road to S’t Paul’s (King Edward Street) via route 8 and withdrawn between Tottenham Court Road (Primark) and Hampstead Heath (bringing existing 25 links back, supporting the 8 and bringing newer links to Westminster/Victoria)
also:
i also do think 24 has more potential, for a route that is not as long and could be extended south (Battersea) or East (Liverpool Street) but then I think, is it really needed?
the new 12 will be considerably longer, but would work as a perfect route, more than the 24 does nowadays.
all and all though, this is a whole lot of ££ and would never happen but is more of something that would be of great change and restore some bus links, and bringing new ones.
or: keep the 24 and 27 the same
reroute the 12 from Trafalgar Square to King Edward Street (S’t Paul’s) via Leicester Square, Tottenham Court Road and then via route 8.
reroute the 176 from Trafalgar Square to Oxford Circus via route 12.
its much simpler but i prefer ^^^^ idea 1 as the whole reason I came up with these is to change the 24, as it just could do with a change, and with like people getting on the 24 decreasing in many years even before Covid
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Post by vjaska on Aug 5, 2020 11:44:14 GMT
changes to routes 12, 24, 27 and 176: 12: withdrawn between Regent Street and Oxford Circus, extended to Camden Town via route 24 from Trafalgar Square 27: extended from Chalk Farm Morrisons to Hampstead Heath via route 24, to serve this missed area (the cutback on route 27 to Hammersmith means it can work, and the 12 wont become too long so keep it as far as Camden Town) 176: rerouted from Trafalgar Square to Oxford Circus via route 12 and withdrawn between Leicester Square and Tottenham Court Road. (a new support to the 139, and does not duplicate the 88 and 453 as far as the 12 did, but meets the 453 at E&C and the proposed 12 at Dulwich and inbetween E&C and Camberwell) 24: rerouted from Tottenham Court Road to S’t Paul’s (King Edward Street) via route 8 and withdrawn between Tottenham Court Road (Primark) and Hampstead Heath (bringing existing 25 links back, supporting the 8 and bringing newer links to Westminster/Victoria) also: i also do think 24 has more potential, for a route that is not as long and could be extended south (Battersea) or East (Liverpool Street) but then I think, is it really needed? the new 12 will be considerably longer, but would work as a perfect route, more than the 24 does nowadays. all and all though, this is a whole lot of ££ and would never happen but is more of something that would be of great change and restore some bus links, and bringing new ones. or: keep the 24 and 27 the same reroute the 12 from Trafalgar Square to King Edward Street (S’t Paul’s) via Leicester Square, Tottenham Court Road and then via route 8. reroute the 176 from Trafalgar Square to Oxford Circus via route 12. its much simpler but i prefer ^^^^ idea 1 as the whole reason I came up with these is to change the 24, as it just could do with a change, and with like people getting on the 24 decreasing in many years even before Covid The 24 has stayed in its current form near enough since its creation so I'd of thought that tells me its works. I'd prefer the 8 returning to Victoria or Oxford Circus myself over meddling with the 24 and making it a Pimlico to St Paul's route.
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Post by northlondonbuses on Aug 5, 2020 12:42:13 GMT
changes to routes 12, 24, 27 and 176: 12: withdrawn between Regent Street and Oxford Circus, extended to Camden Town via route 24 from Trafalgar Square 27: extended from Chalk Farm Morrisons to Hampstead Heath via route 24, to serve this missed area (the cutback on route 27 to Hammersmith means it can work, and the 12 wont become too long so keep it as far as Camden Town) 176: rerouted from Trafalgar Square to Oxford Circus via route 12 and withdrawn between Leicester Square and Tottenham Court Road. (a new support to the 139, and does not duplicate the 88 and 453 as far as the 12 did, but meets the 453 at E&C and the proposed 12 at Dulwich and inbetween E&C and Camberwell) 24: rerouted from Tottenham Court Road to S’t Paul’s (King Edward Street) via route 8 and withdrawn between Tottenham Court Road (Primark) and Hampstead Heath (bringing existing 25 links back, supporting the 8 and bringing newer links to Westminster/Victoria) also: i also do think 24 has more potential, for a route that is not as long and could be extended south (Battersea) or East (Liverpool Street) but then I think, is it really needed? the new 12 will be considerably longer, but would work as a perfect route, more than the 24 does nowadays. all and all though, this is a whole lot of ££ and would never happen but is more of something that would be of great change and restore some bus links, and bringing new ones. or: keep the 24 and 27 the same reroute the 12 from Trafalgar Square to King Edward Street (S’t Paul’s) via Leicester Square, Tottenham Court Road and then via route 8. reroute the 176 from Trafalgar Square to Oxford Circus via route 12. its much simpler but i prefer ^^^^ idea 1 as the whole reason I came up with these is to change the 24, as it just could do with a change, and with like people getting on the 24 decreasing in many years even before Covid The 24 has stayed in its current form near enough since its creation so I'd of thought that tells me its works. I'd prefer the 8 returning to Victoria or Oxford Circus myself over meddling with the 24 and making it a Pimlico to St Paul's route. sorry for nitpicking but I dont think theres any stand space at victoria
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Post by george on Aug 5, 2020 12:42:39 GMT
The 24 has stayed in its current form near enough since its creation so I'd of thought that tells me its works. I'd prefer the 8 returning to Victoria or Oxford Circus myself over meddling with the 24 and making it a Pimlico to St Paul's route. sorry for nitpicking but I dont think theres any stand space at victoria Ex C2 stand.
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Post by northlondonbuses on Aug 5, 2020 12:44:39 GMT
sorry for nitpicking but I dont think theres any stand space at victoria Ex C2 stand. oh yeah forgot about them stands thought they removed them after 3 yrs of no usage
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Post by george on Aug 5, 2020 13:19:48 GMT
oh yeah forgot about them stands thought they removed them after 3 yrs of no usage I'm pretty sure that stand can still be used.
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Post by greg on Aug 5, 2020 15:01:59 GMT
changes to routes 12, 24, 27 and 176: 12: withdrawn between Regent Street and Oxford Circus, extended to Camden Town via route 24 from Trafalgar Square 27: extended from Chalk Farm Morrisons to Hampstead Heath via route 24, to serve this missed area (the cutback on route 27 to Hammersmith means it can work, and the 12 wont become too long so keep it as far as Camden Town) 176: rerouted from Trafalgar Square to Oxford Circus via route 12 and withdrawn between Leicester Square and Tottenham Court Road. (a new support to the 139, and does not duplicate the 88 and 453 as far as the 12 did, but meets the 453 at E&C and the proposed 12 at Dulwich and inbetween E&C and Camberwell) 24: rerouted from Tottenham Court Road to S’t Paul’s (King Edward Street) via route 8 and withdrawn between Tottenham Court Road (Primark) and Hampstead Heath (bringing existing 25 links back, supporting the 8 and bringing newer links to Westminster/Victoria) also: i also do think 24 has more potential, for a route that is not as long and could be extended south (Battersea) or East (Liverpool Street) but then I think, is it really needed? the new 12 will be considerably longer, but would work as a perfect route, more than the 24 does nowadays. all and all though, this is a whole lot of ££ and would never happen but is more of something that would be of great change and restore some bus links, and bringing new ones. or: keep the 24 and 27 the same reroute the 12 from Trafalgar Square to King Edward Street (S’t Paul’s) via Leicester Square, Tottenham Court Road and then via route 8. reroute the 176 from Trafalgar Square to Oxford Circus via route 12. its much simpler but i prefer ^^^^ idea 1 as the whole reason I came up with these is to change the 24, as it just could do with a change, and with like people getting on the 24 decreasing in many years even before Covid The 24 has stayed in its current form near enough since its creation so I'd of thought that tells me its works. I'd prefer the 8 returning to Victoria or Oxford Circus myself over meddling with the 24 and making it a Pimlico to St Paul's route. i do agree with you, this is a bad way of explaining but the 24 could do with a little bit of spice to it. It hasn’t been changed in years and also the fact that every day I see the 24, it gets emptier, and this is before Covid. The route could do with some change now and I think the 12 and 27 replacing the northern side of the 24, would be a great idea and spicing up the 12 aswell massively, and making the 24 and 176 better aswell.
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Post by twobellstogo on Aug 5, 2020 16:43:04 GMT
changes to routes 12, 24, 27 and 176: 12: withdrawn between Regent Street and Oxford Circus, extended to Camden Town via route 24 from Trafalgar Square 27: extended from Chalk Farm Morrisons to Hampstead Heath via route 24, to serve this missed area (the cutback on route 27 to Hammersmith means it can work, and the 12 wont become too long so keep it as far as Camden Town) 176: rerouted from Trafalgar Square to Oxford Circus via route 12 and withdrawn between Leicester Square and Tottenham Court Road. (a new support to the 139, and does not duplicate the 88 and 453 as far as the 12 did, but meets the 453 at E&C and the proposed 12 at Dulwich and inbetween E&C and Camberwell) 24: rerouted from Tottenham Court Road to S’t Paul’s (King Edward Street) via route 8 and withdrawn between Tottenham Court Road (Primark) and Hampstead Heath (bringing existing 25 links back, supporting the 8 and bringing newer links to Westminster/Victoria) also: i also do think 24 has more potential, for a route that is not as long and could be extended south (Battersea) or East (Liverpool Street) but then I think, is it really needed? the new 12 will be considerably longer, but would work as a perfect route, more than the 24 does nowadays. all and all though, this is a whole lot of ££ and would never happen but is more of something that would be of great change and restore some bus links, and bringing new ones. or: keep the 24 and 27 the same reroute the 12 from Trafalgar Square to King Edward Street (S’t Paul’s) via Leicester Square, Tottenham Court Road and then via route 8. reroute the 176 from Trafalgar Square to Oxford Circus via route 12. its much simpler but i prefer ^^^^ idea 1 as the whole reason I came up with these is to change the 24, as it just could do with a change, and with like people getting on the 24 decreasing in many years even before Covid If you meddle with the 24 you get struck by lightning 😂 In all seriousness, I wouldn’t touch the 24, and your 12 extension looks like it might cause issues with length. The 176 might, if anything, benefit with being cut back at the Central London end. I think it might benefit with being withdrawn west of Aldwych, with the 172 replacing it to Tottenham Court Road. Not sufficiently knowledgeable about the 27 to comment, particularly at its northern end.
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Post by LondonNorthern on Aug 5, 2020 18:10:20 GMT
changes to routes 12, 24, 27 and 176: 12: withdrawn between Regent Street and Oxford Circus, extended to Camden Town via route 24 from Trafalgar Square 27: extended from Chalk Farm Morrisons to Hampstead Heath via route 24, to serve this missed area (the cutback on route 27 to Hammersmith means it can work, and the 12 wont become too long so keep it as far as Camden Town) 176: rerouted from Trafalgar Square to Oxford Circus via route 12 and withdrawn between Leicester Square and Tottenham Court Road. (a new support to the 139, and does not duplicate the 88 and 453 as far as the 12 did, but meets the 453 at E&C and the proposed 12 at Dulwich and inbetween E&C and Camberwell) 24: rerouted from Tottenham Court Road to S’t Paul’s (King Edward Street) via route 8 and withdrawn between Tottenham Court Road (Primark) and Hampstead Heath (bringing existing 25 links back, supporting the 8 and bringing newer links to Westminster/Victoria) also: i also do think 24 has more potential, for a route that is not as long and could be extended south (Battersea) or East (Liverpool Street) but then I think, is it really needed? the new 12 will be considerably longer, but would work as a perfect route, more than the 24 does nowadays. all and all though, this is a whole lot of ££ and would never happen but is more of something that would be of great change and restore some bus links, and bringing new ones. or: keep the 24 and 27 the same reroute the 12 from Trafalgar Square to King Edward Street (S’t Paul’s) via Leicester Square, Tottenham Court Road and then via route 8. reroute the 176 from Trafalgar Square to Oxford Circus via route 12. its much simpler but i prefer ^^^^ idea 1 as the whole reason I came up with these is to change the 24, as it just could do with a change, and with like people getting on the 24 decreasing in many years even before Covid If you meddle with the 24 you get struck by lightning 😂 In all seriousness, I wouldn’t touch the 24, and your 12 extension looks like it might cause issues with length. The 176 might, if anything, benefit with being cut back at the Central London end. I think it might benefit with being withdrawn west of Aldwych, with the 172 replacing it to Tottenham Court Road. Not sufficiently knowledgeable about the 27 to comment, particularly at its northern end. routes like the 176 I wouldn't like to see go because Aldwych doesn't have space nor does Waterloo and nor does Elephant. The 176 is a key trunk route, up there imo with the 53, 55, 171, 243 & 341. Routes like these serve massive communities and although may be unreliable they still provide very good purpose for the surrounding areas. I think central London needs more bus lanes
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