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Post by wirewiper on Sept 3, 2022 17:13:01 GMT
I imagine if Stagecoach did gain the 38 they would now take the opportunity to run it from HK much like when the route used bendy buses. Having said that I would be shocked if Arriva lost the route. I there's still a reasonable chance Arriva could lose the 38, it probably depends on how competitive the bids are. On previous retenders, the 38 would have been seen as a very safe retain due to the large PVR, with other operators unlikely to find space. But the 38 has since been reduced significantly, and could easily fit at LI, or even QB at the other end? One advantage Arriva do have though, it that they also currently run the rest of the routes in the same tranche (221/279/W3). But then the 279 or W3 could be lost to another operator if existing vehicles are available, particularly Metroline who could use the ex-91/271 hybrids. I also wonder if the 279 might become an LT route, if the 349 withdrawal goes ahead? Good point about the 38. I used to reckon it was unassailable due to its massive PVR, but the 25 once had a bigger PVR than the 38 does now and that did not stop it swapping between First and Stagecoach on a regular basis. Stagecoach for the 73, anyone? Or even Metroline, using King's Cross as a base?
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Post by JUNIOR26 on Sept 3, 2022 17:17:28 GMT
Been thinking about this a little more. Can see Arriva pushing for the 221 & W3 with hybrids. They won't want to pay for electrification just before they plan to redevelop WN Could also be playing with fire trying to force new electrics when you already have spare Hybrids flying around the company. While it's good for them to think about the competition, the "form" the competition has been in recent years alongside the competition's availability of buses. Operators probably will be more cautious in their bids now. But the other flip is that operators still will want work in order to make a profit. Metroline have a lot of space available, both HT and PB both have electricity supplies and chances are will be able to then put in cheaper electric bids than if Arriva was to, unless Arriva want to absorb the cost of temporarily electrifying WN themselves. PB have space for the 221, while HT have space for both the W3 and 279. I don't think Arriva would go for electrics on any of those routes if they could help it. This doesn't even take into account any spare vehicles Metroline may have following their own central London cuts, and if the central London changes go ahead the 214 could even move to SW to make some room at NP for further gains which could pose yet another risk to that tranche. This is all then reliant on the 4th route in that tranche, the 38. While a huge route, half its journeys terminate in the garage and the fact it will continue with existing should work in Arriva's favour. It will most likely play a vital part in any joint bid that will happen. Anything that will raise a cost in a joint bid could result in other routes also in the joint bid falling through. Last time with Stagecoach in 2018, should the 8 have not managed to subsidise the 205 bid then chances are the 205 would have been lost. If the W3 or 221 bids end up tipping a joint bid over to a point the 279 and 38 now have cheaper operators on single bids TfL will probably not even hesitate to award either routes to other operators. Stagecoach already had possession of LI weeks before the 38s tender return, and chances are they knew of it even before that so I'd be very surprised if the 38 doesn't have a bit coming in from LI too. Going south for the 417 and 157, both routes again have competition down there. N is yet to be electrified while BC, QB, AL, C etc all are. It will be very interesting to see what happens tender wise down there, especially with Abellio and Go Ahead having many recent tender successes, and getting a head start to electrics. 279 would be better run from PB rather than HT.
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Post by capitalomnibus on Sept 3, 2022 21:40:07 GMT
They do appear on the 102 And 329 as well I rode one on route 102 in June. I expect them to stay at AD and release some Ts to replace earlier or least stock (Ts or DWs) elsewhere. Very much doubt it, highly likely they would either transfer to another Arriva company or be sold.
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Post by capitalomnibus on Sept 3, 2022 21:49:49 GMT
Fair point, but if WN is going to close in the near future anyway so it can be redeveloped, Arriva could electrify another depot and run them out of there. That depot would then be available for future electric route conversions when the new WN opens. There was talk on here that SF was going to be electrified despite not being used for any routes at present so maybe when WN closes for it's rebuild, SF comes into play? Most of the work was done a while ago
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Post by LondonExplorer316 on Sept 16, 2022 6:11:47 GMT
I am confused are the Optare MetroDeckers 10.6m or 11.1m? Sorry to quote an old post, but they come in the 10.5 and 11.1m lengths
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Post by ilovelondonbuses on Sept 22, 2022 23:23:45 GMT
Update 23/09/2022
Updated the Arriva section with the order for route 307. The chosen vehicle type might interest some members here.
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Post by vjaska on Sept 23, 2022 1:14:01 GMT
Update 23/09/2022 Updated the Arriva section with the order for route 307. The chosen vehicle type might interest some members here. When did that get confirmed out of interest?
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Post by snowman on Sept 23, 2022 5:43:27 GMT
Update 23/09/2022 Updated the Arriva section with the order for route 307. The chosen vehicle type might interest some members here. When did that get confirmed out of interest? Don’t know when order was placed, but it is mentioned in the latest LOTs TLB magazine
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Post by LK65EBO on Sept 23, 2022 8:48:52 GMT
Update 23/09/2022 Updated the Arriva section with the order for route 307. The chosen vehicle type might interest some members here. Nice to see Wrightbus getting some more orders in London!
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Post by ADH45258 on Sept 23, 2022 8:57:13 GMT
Update 23/09/2022 Updated the Arriva section with the order for route 307. The chosen vehicle type might interest some members here. Nice to see Wrightbus getting some more orders in London! I wonder if Arriva might order these for the 64 as well? Also assuming they will be coded as EWs
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Post by YY13VKP on Sept 23, 2022 9:08:42 GMT
Nice to see Wrightbus getting some more orders in London! I wonder if Arriva might order these for the 64 as well? Also assuming they will be coded as EWs I can see the 64’s batch (and 612’s two electrics for that matter) being ADL’s, seeing as TH is an ADL garage, and TC have traditionally gone for ADL products when they’ve got new buses to order. They could have quite easily ordered HV’s for the 405’s but went for HT’s instead. Same could be said for the 60 back in 2013, suppose they could’ve ordered DW’s for it but T279-T287 came instead
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Post by southlondon413 on Sept 23, 2022 9:12:25 GMT
I wonder if Arriva might order these for the 64 as well? Also assuming they will be coded as EWs I can see the 64’s batch (and 612’s two electrics for that matter) being ADL’s, seeing as TH is an ADL garage, and TC have traditionally gone for ADL products when they’ve got new buses. They could have quite easily ordered HV’s for the 405’s but went for HT’s instead. Same could be said for the 60 back in 2013, suppose they could’ve ordered DW’s for it but T279-T287 came instead Perhaps it’ll be a return to the early 2000s when North and South had slightly different DD vehicle orders. Wright for the North, ADL for the south.
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Post by TB123 on Sept 23, 2022 9:13:47 GMT
I wonder if Arriva might order these for the 64 as well? Also assuming they will be coded as EWs I can see the 64’s batch (and 612’s two electrics for that matter) being ADL’s, seeing as TH is an ADL garage, and TC have traditionally gone for ADL products when they’ve got new buses to order. They could have quite easily ordered HV’s for the 405’s but went for HT’s instead. Same could be said for the 60 back in 2013, suppose they could’ve ordered DW’s for it but T279-T287 came instead They'd discontinued the B5LH/Gemini product by the time of the 405 order so HVs wouldn't have been an option. Whatever is ordered is a new type for either garage with little commonality on existing types so I don't expect that to be defining factor. Indeed what with the 64 being one of the highest mileage routes in London (in the top25) I expect the better range of the Electroliner will be closely considered.
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Post by SILENCED on Sept 23, 2022 10:33:13 GMT
Update 23/09/2022 Updated the Arriva section with the order for route 307. The chosen vehicle type might interest some members here. Got me all excited there, was hoping for some BZLs. At least it is a change from the E400EV. Let's hope they got in before that big First Group order.
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Post by SILENCED on Sept 23, 2022 10:49:47 GMT
I can see the 64’s batch (and 612’s two electrics for that matter) being ADL’s, seeing as TH is an ADL garage, and TC have traditionally gone for ADL products when they’ve got new buses. They could have quite easily ordered HV’s for the 405’s but went for HT’s instead. Same could be said for the 60 back in 2013, suppose they could’ve ordered DW’s for it but T279-T287 came instead Perhaps it’ll be a return to the early 2000s when North and South had slightly different DD vehicle orders. Wright for the North, ADL for the south. Those 134 DW DB250s!
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