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Post by greenboy on May 11, 2021 10:21:54 GMT
I saw however my point being is rather than withdrawing the 320 on that section, you might as well keep it and have addition of the extended 199 to help support the two. As I said before after regular use of both routes they do get quite packed between Catford and Bromley common so even replacing one with the other isn’t going to help. Also a lot of people I know who live around the biggin hill and keston area prefer the direct link into Catford rather than changing so there is a positive in why the 320 goes to Bromley. Your experience is obviously far more recent than mine - as I said, I haven’t regularly used that corridor in nearly 8 years! I find it surprising however, that people in Biggin Hill and Keston are using the service through to Catford. The 320s I see in Bromley are rarely carrying many people across town. Is demand genuinely high enough to warrant 3 high frequency services along Bromley Road? I certainly don't think three routes could be justified between Bromley and Catford and from what I see the 208 is a lot busier than the 320 probably because most people want to go to Lewisham and in the other direction there is the awkward routing of 320s leaving Catford. There have also been complaints from Biggin Hill users about the service being less reliable since it was extended to Catford and the dreaded Biggin Hill Airport curtailment.
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Post by Dillon95 on May 11, 2021 11:02:34 GMT
*So extend the 199 from Bellingham to Bromley North Station.
*Cut the Catford to Bromley section of the 320, and extend it from Bromley Town Centre to Plaistow Green. So Plaistow Green to Biggin Hill Valley. Are double deckers still needed outside of school chucking out times?
*Cut the Beckenham Junction Station to Bromley South Station section of the 162. Have it run from Bromley South Station to Eltham Station. Use the old 126 Simpson’s Road stand.
*Extend the 269 from Bromley Town Centre to Beckenham Junction Station via the existing 162 route. The current Bexleyheath bound routing is appalling as it skips the Town Centre all together. It keeps Chislehurst’s direct link to Bromley South (over the long 61 route) and gives Sidcup much better access to Bromley as well as a new link with Beckenham. Runs from Beckenham Junction Station to Bexleyheath, Shopping Centre. This frees up stand space at Bromley North for the 199.
*Extend the 126 from Eltham to Woolwich, using double deckers permanently. This would be much better use of the 126 as as a Bromley & Grove Park connection to Woolwich would be very useful. It also would give Eltham High Street & Station a more direct service to Woolwich Town Centre and the new Crossrail station via the South Circular road rather than faffing about around Queen Elizabeth Hospital like the 161.
*Extend the 227 from Crystal Palace to Streatham.
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Post by vjaska on May 11, 2021 11:23:56 GMT
*So extend the 199 from Bellingham to Bromley North Station. *Cut the Catford to Bromley section of the 320, and extend it from Bromley Town Centre to Plaistow Green. So Plaistow Green to Biggin Hill Valley. Are double deckers still needed outside of school chucking out times? *Cut the Beckenham Junction Station to Bromley South Station section of the 162. Have it run from Bromley South Station to Eltham Station. Use the old 126 Simpson’s Road stand. *Extend the 269 from Bromley Town Centre to Beckenham Junction Station via the existing 162 route. The current Bexleyheath bound routing is appalling as it skips the Town Centre all together. It keeps Chislehurst’s direct link to Bromley South (over the long 61 route) and gives Sidcup much better access to Bromley as well as a new link with Beckenham. Runs from Beckenham Junction Station to Bexleyheath, Shopping Centre. This frees up stand space at Bromley North for the 199. *Extend the 126 from Eltham to Woolwich, using double deckers permanently. This would be much better use of the 126 as as a Bromley & Grove Park connection to Woolwich would be very useful. It also would give Eltham High Street & Station a more direct service to Woolwich Town Centre and the new Crossrail station via the South Circular road rather than faffing about around Queen Elizabeth Hospital like the 161. *Extend the 227 from Crystal Palace to Streatham. The one I can definitely provide local knowledge of is the 227 going to Streatham - it’s one I’ve asked for before. Currently, there are two stands available to use - one on Ambleside Avenue & one at Streatham Hill Station but in order to serve Streatham properly (the main shopping area is around Ambleside Avenue), Ambleside Avenue would only be served from the north as coming from the south misses the shopping area out which would mean running via Leigham Court Road and then running south from Streatham Hill which would serve the shopping area but miss the big Tesco. If you run via Streatham Common North Side, you serve both but no matter which way you go, the route will have serve the pinch point on Streatham High Road and around St Leonard’s Church which is regularly full of traffic which could be the biggest issue you face.
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Post by greenboy on May 11, 2021 11:50:08 GMT
*So extend the 199 from Bellingham to Bromley North Station. *Cut the Catford to Bromley section of the 320, and extend it from Bromley Town Centre to Plaistow Green. So Plaistow Green to Biggin Hill Valley. Are double deckers still needed outside of school chucking out times? *Cut the Beckenham Junction Station to Bromley South Station section of the 162. Have it run from Bromley South Station to Eltham Station. Use the old 126 Simpson’s Road stand. *Extend the 269 from Bromley Town Centre to Beckenham Junction Station via the existing 162 route. The current Bexleyheath bound routing is appalling as it skips the Town Centre all together. It keeps Chislehurst’s direct link to Bromley South (over the long 61 route) and gives Sidcup much better access to Bromley as well as a new link with Beckenham. Runs from Beckenham Junction Station to Bexleyheath, Shopping Centre. This frees up stand space at Bromley North for the 199. *Extend the 126 from Eltham to Woolwich, using double deckers permanently. This would be much better use of the 126 as as a Bromley & Grove Park connection to Woolwich would be very useful. It also would give Eltham High Street & Station a more direct service to Woolwich Town Centre and the new Crossrail station via the South Circular road rather than faffing about around Queen Elizabeth Hospital like the 161. *Extend the 227 from Crystal Palace to Streatham. Ideally I think the 199 should use the Ringers Road stand to better serve the town centre. I agree with the 162 and 269 ideas. I think it's going to have to be either the 126 or 161 between Eltham and Woolwich, I don't think both can be justified and whilst I think extending the 227 to Streatham is a good idea it would surely have to replace either the 249 or 417?
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Post by Dillon95 on May 11, 2021 12:37:02 GMT
*So extend the 199 from Bellingham to Bromley North Station. *Cut the Catford to Bromley section of the 320, and extend it from Bromley Town Centre to Plaistow Green. So Plaistow Green to Biggin Hill Valley. Are double deckers still needed outside of school chucking out times? *Cut the Beckenham Junction Station to Bromley South Station section of the 162. Have it run from Bromley South Station to Eltham Station. Use the old 126 Simpson’s Road stand. *Extend the 269 from Bromley Town Centre to Beckenham Junction Station via the existing 162 route. The current Bexleyheath bound routing is appalling as it skips the Town Centre all together. It keeps Chislehurst’s direct link to Bromley South (over the long 61 route) and gives Sidcup much better access to Bromley as well as a new link with Beckenham. Runs from Beckenham Junction Station to Bexleyheath, Shopping Centre. This frees up stand space at Bromley North for the 199. *Extend the 126 from Eltham to Woolwich, using double deckers permanently. This would be much better use of the 126 as as a Bromley & Grove Park connection to Woolwich would be very useful. It also would give Eltham High Street & Station a more direct service to Woolwich Town Centre and the new Crossrail station via the South Circular road rather than faffing about around Queen Elizabeth Hospital like the 161. *Extend the 227 from Crystal Palace to Streatham. Ideally I think the 199 should use the Ringers Road stand to better serve the town centre. I agree with the 162 and 269 ideas. I think it's going to have to be either the 126 or 161 between Eltham and Woolwich, I don't think both can be justified and whilst I think extending the 227 to Streatham is a good idea it would surely have to replace either the 249 or 417? It’s been said in the past that the Woolwich to North Greenwich section of the 161 should be cut. So extend the 126 from Eltham to Woolwich via QEH replacing the 161. Then extend the 161 from Chislehurst to Orpington Station replacing that section of the 61, this gives Orpington and Eltham a link finally. Use single deckers at every 20 minutes. Then have the 61 run from Orpington, Walnuts Centre to Bromley North. A stand for the 61 could easily be installed at Gravel Pit Way.
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Post by southlondonbus on May 11, 2021 12:39:05 GMT
*So extend the 199 from Bellingham to Bromley North Station. *Cut the Catford to Bromley section of the 320, and extend it from Bromley Town Centre to Plaistow Green. So Plaistow Green to Biggin Hill Valley. Are double deckers still needed outside of school chucking out times? *Cut the Beckenham Junction Station to Bromley South Station section of the 162. Have it run from Bromley South Station to Eltham Station. Use the old 126 Simpson’s Road stand. *Extend the 269 from Bromley Town Centre to Beckenham Junction Station via the existing 162 route. The current Bexleyheath bound routing is appalling as it skips the Town Centre all together. It keeps Chislehurst’s direct link to Bromley South (over the long 61 route) and gives Sidcup much better access to Bromley as well as a new link with Beckenham. Runs from Beckenham Junction Station to Bexleyheath, Shopping Centre. This frees up stand space at Bromley North for the 199. *Extend the 126 from Eltham to Woolwich, using double deckers permanently. This would be much better use of the 126 as as a Bromley & Grove Park connection to Woolwich would be very useful. It also would give Eltham High Street & Station a more direct service to Woolwich Town Centre and the new Crossrail station via the South Circular road rather than faffing about around Queen Elizabeth Hospital like the 161. *Extend the 227 from Crystal Palace to Streatham. The one I can definitely provide local knowledge of is the 227 going to Streatham - it’s one I’ve asked for before. Currently, there are two stands available to use - one on Ambleside Avenue & one at Streatham Hill Station but in order to serve Streatham properly (the main shopping area is around Ambleside Avenue), Ambleside Avenue would only be served from the north as coming from the south misses the shopping area out which would mean running via Leigham Court Road and then running south from Streatham Hill which would serve the shopping area but miss the big Tesco. If you run via Streatham Common North Side, you serve both but no matter which way you go, the route will have serve the pinch point on Streatham High Road and around St Leonard’s Church which is regularly full of traffic which could be the biggest issue you face. Might even be able to fit another route onto the Streatham Station stand or better still extend the 60 up to Ambledside Ave stand to serve a little bit more of Streatham.
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Post by greenboy on May 11, 2021 12:44:06 GMT
Ideally I think the 199 should use the Ringers Road stand to better serve the town centre. I agree with the 162 and 269 ideas. I think it's going to have to be either the 126 or 161 between Eltham and Woolwich, I don't think both can be justified and whilst I think extending the 227 to Streatham is a good idea it would surely have to replace either the 249 or 417? It’s been said in the past that the Woolwich to North Greenwich section of the 161 should be cut. So extend the 126 from Eltham to Woolwich via QEH replacing the 161. Then extend the 161 from Chislehurst to Orpington Station replacing that section of the 61, this gives Orpington and Eltham a link finally. Use single deckers at every 20 minutes. Then have the 61 run from Orpington, Walnuts Centre to Bromley North. A stand for the 61 could easily be installed at Gravel Pit Way. Yes a Orpington to Eltham link would be useful and better than the 61 and 161 both terminating at Chislehurst. The 61 could go to Ramsden Estate replacing the R9 as someone suggested on here previously?
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Post by DT 11 on May 11, 2021 13:20:53 GMT
In regards to the 320 I don’t see any reason why the Catford to Bromley Section should be cut when what we need is a route to support both the 208 and 320. As someone who is local and has used the route many of time to shop in bromley, get to college in the common and to get to a friend in biggin hill for gatherings (before rona) The Catford section has proved quite useful and has helped the 208 a lot. The route itself is starting to get heavy loads and could do with a route that also supports it especially during the peak where it can be impossible to get on with all the school loads and college loads. It’s a nice thought just not realistic 🤣 As has been pointed out, the idea is to replace the 320 with the 199. It’s been a long time since I regularly drove the 208 and obviously travel patterns may have changed but I think there’s more benefit to the 199 providing the support to the 208 rather than the 320 If the 199 was extended to Bromley Common, Crown Lane the problem would be solved as this would assist all the College students. What I find annoying about the 208 & 320 you end up waiting longer then both turn up at once hence the double road of passengers! There would be no need for 3 routes from Catford to Bromley. I’ve seen the 208 fill up from the first stop at Lewisham many times! If the 320 wasn’t so long already I would suggest extending it to Lewisham Station. However there are more than enough buses between Lewisham and Catford via A21. There are plans to move the South Circular in future so I wouldn’t be surprised if the 320 is removed from the area. 199 is a sensible replacement.
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Post by vjaska on May 11, 2021 13:26:20 GMT
*So extend the 199 from Bellingham to Bromley North Station. *Cut the Catford to Bromley section of the 320, and extend it from Bromley Town Centre to Plaistow Green. So Plaistow Green to Biggin Hill Valley. Are double deckers still needed outside of school chucking out times? *Cut the Beckenham Junction Station to Bromley South Station section of the 162. Have it run from Bromley South Station to Eltham Station. Use the old 126 Simpson’s Road stand. *Extend the 269 from Bromley Town Centre to Beckenham Junction Station via the existing 162 route. The current Bexleyheath bound routing is appalling as it skips the Town Centre all together. It keeps Chislehurst’s direct link to Bromley South (over the long 61 route) and gives Sidcup much better access to Bromley as well as a new link with Beckenham. Runs from Beckenham Junction Station to Bexleyheath, Shopping Centre. This frees up stand space at Bromley North for the 199. *Extend the 126 from Eltham to Woolwich, using double deckers permanently. This would be much better use of the 126 as as a Bromley & Grove Park connection to Woolwich would be very useful. It also would give Eltham High Street & Station a more direct service to Woolwich Town Centre and the new Crossrail station via the South Circular road rather than faffing about around Queen Elizabeth Hospital like the 161. *Extend the 227 from Crystal Palace to Streatham. Ideally I think the 199 should use the Ringers Road stand to better serve the town centre. I agree with the 162 and 269 ideas. I think it's going to have to be either the 126 or 161 between Eltham and Woolwich, I don't think both can be justified and whilst I think extending the 227 to Streatham is a good idea it would surely have to replace either the 249 or 417? An extended 227 could not replace the 249 or 417 - it either extends alongside one of them or doesn't happen at all as the current links provided by the 249 & 417 are very important to Lambeth residents.
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Post by vjaska on May 11, 2021 13:31:20 GMT
The one I can definitely provide local knowledge of is the 227 going to Streatham - it’s one I’ve asked for before. Currently, there are two stands available to use - one on Ambleside Avenue & one at Streatham Hill Station but in order to serve Streatham properly (the main shopping area is around Ambleside Avenue), Ambleside Avenue would only be served from the north as coming from the south misses the shopping area out which would mean running via Leigham Court Road and then running south from Streatham Hill which would serve the shopping area but miss the big Tesco. If you run via Streatham Common North Side, you serve both but no matter which way you go, the route will have serve the pinch point on Streatham High Road and around St Leonard’s Church which is regularly full of traffic which could be the biggest issue you face. Might even be able to fit another route onto the Streatham Station stand or better still extend the 60 up to Ambledside Ave stand to serve a little bit more of Streatham. Extending the 60 to Ambleside Avenue brings no benefit as it still won't be serving the shopping area so it would be fighting the traffic at St Leonard's Church for no added benefit. The next available place to stand after the shopping area is Streatham Hill Station & BN You could probably fit a small PVR route in at Streatham Station but doubt anything bigger than that can go in there especially after the 60's increase as the 60, 133 & 159 have multiple buses standing there
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Post by vjaska on May 11, 2021 13:34:53 GMT
It’s been said in the past that the Woolwich to North Greenwich section of the 161 should be cut. So extend the 126 from Eltham to Woolwich via QEH replacing the 161. Then extend the 161 from Chislehurst to Orpington Station replacing that section of the 61, this gives Orpington and Eltham a link finally. Use single deckers at every 20 minutes. Then have the 61 run from Orpington, Walnuts Centre to Bromley North. A stand for the 61 could easily be installed at Gravel Pit Way. Yes a Orpington to Eltham link would be useful and better than the 61 and 161 both terminating at Chislehurst. The 61 could go to Ramsden Estate replacing the R9 as someone suggested on here previously? I'm not sure Ramsden Estate residents would appreciate losing the high frequency & resilient R9 to a route that comes from a further distance that may hit traffic hot spots elsewhere. The R9 is the type of route you see commonly in other UK cities - a small route with a loop at one end serving a particular community, very useful these type of routes are.
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Post by aaron1 on May 11, 2021 13:45:24 GMT
I have to say that Brent is bad for night buses like we only got 5 route that is N16 N18 N83 N98 and N266
Here how we can get more
N52 Victoria to Mill Hill Broadway via day 52 and 302 N112 North Finchley to Osterley Tesco via day 112 65 and H91 N187 Swiss Cottage to South Harrow via day 187 and 487 N245 Alperton Sainsburys to Barnet Church via day 245 460 and 263 N295 or N316 from White City to Wembley Park via day 316 332 and 206
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Post by Dillon95 on May 11, 2021 14:11:01 GMT
Yes a Orpington to Eltham link would be useful and better than the 61 and 161 both terminating at Chislehurst. The 61 could go to Ramsden Estate replacing the R9 as someone suggested on here previously? I'm not sure Ramsden Estate residents would appreciate losing the high frequency & resilient R9 to a route that comes from a further distance that may hit traffic hot spots elsewhere. The R9 is the type of route you see commonly in other UK cities - a small route with a loop at one end serving a particular community, very useful these type of routes are. Agreed the R9 is perfect as it is. Maybe the 61 could terminate at Ramsden Estate in place of the 353. Ramsden residents would make a use of a direct Bromley service much more than Hayes, Addington Village & Forestdale that’s for sure. That could terminate at the Walnuts.
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Post by CircleLineofLife on May 11, 2021 15:00:55 GMT
I have to say that Brent is bad for night buses like we only got 5 route that is N16 N18 N83 N98 and N266 Here how we can get more N52 Victoria to Mill Hill Broadway via day 52 and 302 N112 North Finchley to Osterley Tesco via day 112 65 and H91 N187 Swiss Cottage to South Harrow via day 187 and 487 N245 Alperton Sainsburys to Barnet Church via day 245 460 and 263 N295 or N316 from White City to Wembley Park via day 316 332 and 206 What about all the 24hr routes, such as the 6, 36, 52, 189, 220, 297, N28 and N31 N52 i dont think they as N98 covers till kingsbury green and when the 114 (24hr weekends, hopefully they establsih it as a proper night route) would come back this can provide this link, but I would like to see this change you proposed, as it gives mill hill a night route and a link to central. N112 yeah this would be a nice route to have, maybe it could be a hybrid between N112 and N232 N187 like the idea as it gives central Middlesex a night route N245, id rather just have a 260 24hrs, if there is a night bus west of golders green or extend 102 from golders green to willesden, create new links in NW. I agree with wembley needing another night route or 2, maybe the 92 could be the candidate, then following the 332, and 316 to ladbroke grove, so ealing hopital to ladbroke grove, then the 295 could just stay as it is until old oak developments potentially come into fruition Yeah if anything, the most criminal thing, is that in the night to get from golders green to willesden or cricklewood, you have to get a 13, to central then get a 6, 52 or 98 or 16, 189 (for cricklewood). Or take 83/183 to kingsbury green then N98, despite 10 mins drive from one another, tbf with the waiting times you could probably walk it b4 public transports gets you there. A night route is needed for this section. I have also propsed the changing of the N266 northern terminus from brent cross to golders green, during nights, as brent cross is closed, and between the N16 and 189 they cover pretty much all the stops that the 266 covers at night apart from the tilling road, if i am not mistaken correct me if i am wrong. However, as there are probably some workers, who like this link, the next best alternative would be to either extend 102 or make 260 24hrs.
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Post by vjaska on May 11, 2021 15:07:16 GMT
I have to say that Brent is bad for night buses like we only got 5 route that is N16 N18 N83 N98 and N266 Here how we can get more N52 Victoria to Mill Hill Broadway via day 52 and 302 N112 North Finchley to Osterley Tesco via day 112 65 and H91 N187 Swiss Cottage to South Harrow via day 187 and 487 N245 Alperton Sainsburys to Barnet Church via day 245 460 and 263 N295 or N316 from White City to Wembley Park via day 316 332 and 206 You have more than 5 - you have the 6, 36, 52, 114, 183, 189, 220 & 297 which maybe 24 hour routes (and the 114 & 183 are temporarily suspended until the night tube resumes operation) but they still run at night so you have 13 (11 if not including the two weekend suspended ones).
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