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Post by TB123 on Oct 8, 2024 11:00:54 GMT
Be interesting to how this affects other operators now in regards to being able to order Wright's within a reasonable delivery timescale. Particularly Arriva and Metroline I'm thinking. Stagecoach as we know have already taken the plunge with the E400EV for the SL3 and I can see that an the BZL continuing as the chosen models. They have set up an additional production line purely for the Go-Ahead orders so I suspect not as much of a difference as one might expect |
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Post by Alexis on Oct 8, 2024 11:02:51 GMT
Be interesting to how this affects other operators now in regards to being able to order Wright's within a reasonable delivery timescale. Particularly Arriva and Metroline I'm thinking. Stagecoach as we know have already taken the plunge with the E400EV for the SL3 and I can see that an the BZL continuing as the chosen models. According to the Go Ahead employee notice, they will have a dedicated production line at the factory with 500 new jobs created at Wrightbus, so I don't think it will have an effect. |
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Post by wirewiper on Oct 8, 2024 11:03:37 GMT
Be interesting to how this affects other operators now in regards to being able to order Wright's within a reasonable delivery timescale. Particularly Arriva and Metroline I'm thinking. Stagecoach as we know have already taken the plunge with the E400EV for the SL3 and I can see that an the BZL continuing as the chosen models. Wrightbus may be able to invest in increasing manufacturing capacity on the back of the Go-Ahead order. EDIT: two posts above have confirmed a new production line and 500 additional jobs. Wrightbus will also phase out production of diesel-fuel vehicles at some point and switch the capacity to zero-emission vehicles - maybe this order has just brought that moment closer. |
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Post by southlondon413 on Oct 8, 2024 11:07:17 GMT
Be interesting to how this affects other operators now in regards to being able to order Wright's within a reasonable delivery timescale. Particularly Arriva and Metroline I'm thinking. Stagecoach as we know have already taken the plunge with the E400EV for the SL3 and I can see that an the BZL continuing as the chosen models. Wrightbus may be able to invest in increasing manufacturing capacity on the back of the Go-Ahead order. EDIT: two posts above have confirmed a new production line and 500 additional jobs. Wrightbus will also phase out production of diesel-fuel vehicles at some point and switch the capacity to zero-emission vehicles - maybe this order has just brought that moment closer. According to another forum Wrigbht have purchased an old cigarette factory to expand into. Not sure how accurate that is though. Although it may be worth Wright establishing a facility in England in the long term to facilitate further growth. |
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Post by southlondonbus on Oct 8, 2024 11:17:01 GMT
Be interesting to how this affects other operators now in regards to being able to order Wright's within a reasonable delivery timescale. Particularly Arriva and Metroline I'm thinking. Stagecoach as we know have already taken the plunge with the E400EV for the SL3 and I can see that an the BZL continuing as the chosen models. They have set up an additional production line purely for the Go-Ahead orders so I suspect not as much of a difference as one might expect That's good to know. I'm very happy with today's news. Definitely will add some variety to Go Ahead. |
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Post by vjaska on Oct 8, 2024 11:57:13 GMT
Yes I think the year 2 and 3 order is based on predicted fleet replacement requirements. Obviously it can be tweaked, depending on actual contract wins and losses as they become known. The balance can be configured for non-London operations and of course there may be future ZEBRA awards in the offing. Existing diesels and hybrids can be cascaded to non-London fleets if they still have some life in them, or sold on to SME operators. That "all zero-emission in London by end 2030" target is now looking more achievable - certainly in Go-Ahead's case. It's all well and good having the buses, but the infrastructure is severely lacking. Metroline still have WDEs which were delivered last year and haven't been in passenger service In all fairness, Go-Ahead have been the best operator at getting electrification set up at garages quickly and efficiently and a large portion of their garages are already online so adding additional routes shouldn’t be too problematic. SW, the 151 & 358 are really the only major hurdles they’ve faced. No idea what Metroline are doing but they seem rather slow others like Arriva, Transport UK & Stagecoach, almost similar to the 235 😂 |
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Post by lj61nwc on Oct 8, 2024 12:21:34 GMT
It's all well and good having the buses, but the infrastructure is severely lacking. Metroline still have WDEs which were delivered last year and haven't been in passenger service In all fairness, Go-Ahead have been the best operator at getting electrification set up at garages quickly and efficiently and a large portion of their garages are already online so adding additional routes shouldn’t be too problematic. SW, the 151 & 358 are really the only major hurdles they’ve faced. No idea what Metroline are doing but they seem rather slow others like Arriva, Transport UK & Stagecoach, almost similar to the 235 😂 That's true, GAL do seem to have the best deployment plan with Arriva and TUK up there as well. You've forgotten about RR, MG and PM which have been having issues implementing/upgrading their charging infrastructure for quite a time as well. (I don't blame you as these garages haven't really been mentioned much) |
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Post by southlondon413 on Oct 8, 2024 12:25:38 GMT
In all fairness, Go-Ahead have been the best operator at getting electrification set up at garages quickly and efficiently and a large portion of their garages are already online so adding additional routes shouldn’t be too problematic. SW, the 151 & 358 are really the only major hurdles they’ve faced. No idea what Metroline are doing but they seem rather slow others like Arriva, Transport UK & Stagecoach, almost similar to the 235 😂 That's true, GAL do seem to have the best deployment plan with Arriva and TUK up there as well. You've forgotten about RR, MG and PM which have been having issues implementing/upgrading their charging infrastructure for quite a time as well. (I don't blame you as these garages haven't really been mentioned much) The situation for MG seems fairly clear though, it would appear Go Ahead don’t want to invest money in a site that may not be available in 3 years. As mentioned many times they are still seeking long term planning permission to 2047 which would likely allow for EV upgrades. |
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Post by enviroPB on Oct 8, 2024 13:50:44 GMT
SL7 needs 4 spares and the PVR is being increases to 21 Unlikely it would be as many as 4. The SL4, for example, is 18 buses and only 2 spare vehicles. I'd expect it would be either 2 or 3 for a 21 PVR. I apologise if this sounds harsh & targeted, but why would you cite a Superloop route that even isn't running yet? Akin to driving, theory is much different from practice. Considering there are nine other SL routes to choose from, I'd have liked you to reference a currently operational SL route as a guide to spares. Again no offence Mr B, but this didn't really sway me. Especially considering electric routes generally have generous spares. |
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Post by TB123 on Oct 8, 2024 13:58:19 GMT
Unlikely it would be as many as 4. The SL4, for example, is 18 buses and only 2 spare vehicles. I'd expect it would be either 2 or 3 for a 21 PVR. I apologise if this sounds harsh & targeted, but why would you cite a Superloop route that even isn't running yet? Akin to driving, theory is much different from practice. Considering there are nine other SL routes to choose from, I'd have liked you to reference a currently operational SL route as a guide to spares. Again no offence Mr B, but this didn't really sway me. Especially considering electric routes generally have generous spares. The timetables and duty schedules will have been drafted, the former some time ago at the bid stage. They will also know about the usual branding diktats of it being a Superloop route, so the fact they have procured 18 vehicles + 2 spare (Around the usual 10% spare vehicle margin) explains a fair amount already. Frankly, the SL4 is the first example that came to mind and most relevant to GAL/SL7. Another example is the SL3, that is getting new EVs, has a PVR of 15 and has had 2 spares specified - again about the usual amount. |
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Post by lj61nwc on Oct 8, 2024 13:59:05 GMT
Unlikely it would be as many as 4. The SL4, for example, is 18 buses and only 2 spare vehicles. I'd expect it would be either 2 or 3 for a 21 PVR. I apologise if this sounds harsh & targeted, but why would you cite a Superloop route that even isn't running yet? Akin to driving, theory is much different from practice. Considering there are nine other SL routes to choose from, I'd have liked you to reference a currently operational SL route as a guide to spares. Again no offence Mr B, but this didn't really sway me. Especially considering electric routes generally have generous spares. perhaps the fact the SL7 currently has a TVR of 24 compared to a PVR of 20 is a good enough guide. Especially since TfL and GAL had to have signed off on getting all of the extra buses racked after the frequency increase which would've been quite an expense. |
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Post by southlondonbus on Oct 8, 2024 14:37:49 GMT
I wonder if with this many new buses on order Go Ahead are possibly going to follow on from the 360 and 444 and not retain the Ees on the 106/212/230/357 and go new again on their bids for those routes.
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Post by TB123 on Oct 8, 2024 14:47:13 GMT
I wonder if with this many new buses on order Go Ahead are possibly going to follow on from the 360 and 444 and not retain the Ees on the 106/212/230/357 and go new again on their bids for those routes. I'm not so sure. I think the E400EV, even in 2020, was quite a step up from 2016-era E200EVs. And the routes they are used on are not as intensive a duty cycle as some other routes are. Personally, i wouldn't be surprised if the 173/174 at Stagecoach, and maybe the 69, become the first BYD-E400EV routes to have their vehicles replaced with new models. |
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Post by vjaska on Oct 8, 2024 15:42:05 GMT
In all fairness, Go-Ahead have been the best operator at getting electrification set up at garages quickly and efficiently and a large portion of their garages are already online so adding additional routes shouldn’t be too problematic. SW, the 151 & 358 are really the only major hurdles they’ve faced. No idea what Metroline are doing but they seem rather slow others like Arriva, Transport UK & Stagecoach, almost similar to the 235 😂 That's true, GAL do seem to have the best deployment plan with Arriva and TUK up there as well. You've forgotten about RR, MG and PM which have been having issues implementing/upgrading their charging infrastructure for quite a time as well. (I don't blame you as these garages haven't really been mentioned much) I did forget about those in all fairness  |
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Post by YY13VKP on Oct 8, 2024 17:14:11 GMT
GAL currently have a TVR of around 2000, and if you take away all of their LTs (which will not deconvert before 2026), existing electrics, route losses, the BD11 order and all 9m routes (since Wright don't offer this option), that leaves a TVR of around 1000. If the figure of 800 buses for London is correct, then that actually isn't too far away from being a full fleet replacement in the next 3 years for GAL, which would go a long way to fully electrifying London for the 2030 target! They’ll still choose ADL for routes which use buses less than 9 metres, for the E100 I’d imagine. Now that they’ve ordered a first batch of E100EV’s and depending on how they find them I can almost certainly see them being ordered for routes such as the 434, R5 and R10 if they are retained. I don’t think Wright would develop a 9.0m Kite but it would be good if they did. Something that’s not a Streetlite electric would do nicely from them, whilst the Kite has technically become the “electric alternative “ of the Streetlite in terms of product offering. |
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