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Post by sid on Oct 23, 2018 21:12:32 GMT
Stops being needlessly closed off is the main issue, another example: www.flickr.com/photos/154741497@N03/25186778637/in/album-72157690392822912/We don't consult the council putting temporary stops out. Certainly accessible issues play a big part today, resources the amount of stops closures and work with less people maybe plays a part also. Certainly temporary stops are sited if safe to do so. Trouble is with parking and street furniture it can be quite restricted. quote author=" capitalomnibus" source="/post/461402/thread" timestamp="1540241277"] I agree that something has changed. My suspicion is that it comes down to staffing levels. Perhaps TfL simply don't have the level of staff to assess each bus stop closure and work out where they can put a dolly stop. I suspect they might just do this for what they determine are important or easy stops. Another possibility is that the rules have changed as to where dolly stops can be sited. Its down to the council a lot, they have to be notified of where dolly stops are put down. They refuse a lot of times where they could be located so then the local Network Traffic Controller has no choice but to have the stop closed with no alternative. [/quote] |
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Post by londonbusboy on Oct 23, 2018 22:40:39 GMT
I dont like the white hoods which say planned closure read bus stop. In our garage we had a NOE which said closed off peak Monday - Saturday which is very vague. I asked an ibus controller who looked it up and it said the same thing. He told me to see what the bus stop notice says in terms of times.
Penge Sainsburys currently has a white hood yet our NOE says the stop should be closed all the time. Why is it so hard to give us the same information which is advertised at the bus stop.
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Post by Frenzie on Oct 24, 2018 0:10:34 GMT
I just need a bit of clarification:
Is the RATP WH streetdeck HEV or Microhybrid?
Are the GAL WSDs HEV or Micro-hybrid
What are the differences between HEV and Micro-hybrid?
I’ve heard various conflicting things from bus enthusiasts so I do hope I can ascertain what’s going on soon! Thanks
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Post by M1104 on Oct 24, 2018 11:48:30 GMT
I just need a bit of clarification: Is the RATP WH streetdeck HEV or Microhybrid? Are the GAL WSDs HEV or Micro-hybrid What are the differences between HEV and Micro-hybrid? I’ve heard various conflicting things from bus enthusiasts so I do hope I can ascertain what’s going on soon! Thanks HEVs - electric motor directly assists in turning the wheels Micro hybrid - diesel engine alone turns the wheels, electric motor has more minor functions in comparison to HEVs WH - hybrid WSD - micro hybrid |
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Post by Frenzie on Oct 24, 2018 12:18:34 GMT
I just need a bit of clarification: Is the RATP WH streetdeck HEV or Microhybrid? Are the GAL WSDs HEV or Micro-hybrid What are the differences between HEV and Micro-hybrid? I’ve heard various conflicting things from bus enthusiasts so I do hope I can ascertain what’s going on soon! Thanks HEVs - electric motor directly assists in turning the wheels Micro hybrid - diesel engine alone turns the wheels, electric motor has more minor functions in comparison to HEVs WH - hybrid WSD - micro hybrid Ahh thanks! |
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Post by M1104 on Oct 24, 2018 12:48:43 GMT
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Post by beaver14uk on Oct 24, 2018 19:22:26 GMT
Why does the operator not follow up bearing in mind they are speaking to us on a daily basis. I dont like the white hoods which say planned closure read bus stop. In our garage we had a NOE which said closed off peak Monday - Saturday which is very vague. I asked an ibus controller who looked it up and it said the same thing. He told me to see what the bus stop notice says in terms of times. Penge Sainsburys currently has a white hood yet our NOE says the stop should be closed all the time. Why is it so hard to give us the same information which is advertised at the bus stop. |
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Post by rambo on Oct 24, 2018 20:32:04 GMT
Trouble is, sometimes temporary stops are stuck in stupid places! Having to walk 400 yards because a stop is closed is not the end of the world. Well it's not good news for somebody who disabled or in poor health. Which is always the standard line that is dished out. How did they get to the stop? beamed there by the starship enterprise? What happens when they get off the bus, beamed by magic to where ever they are going? |
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Post by sid on Oct 24, 2018 20:45:26 GMT
Well it's not good news for somebody who disabled or in poor health. Which is always the standard line that is dished out. How did they get to the stop? beamed there by the starship enterprise? What happens when they get off the bus, beamed by magic to where ever they are going? Uber must be rubbing their hands with glee at that sort of attitude! |
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Post by londonbusboy on Oct 24, 2018 22:10:46 GMT
Why does the operator not follow up bearing in mind they are speaking to us on a daily basis. I dont like the white hoods which say planned closure read bus stop. In our garage we had a NOE which said closed off peak Monday - Saturday which is very vague. I asked an ibus controller who looked it up and it said the same thing. He told me to see what the bus stop notice says in terms of times. Penge Sainsburys currently has a white hood yet our NOE says the stop should be closed all the time. Why is it so hard to give us the same information which is advertised at the bus stop. No idea |
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Post by redbus on Oct 24, 2018 22:43:33 GMT
Well it's not good news for somebody who disabled or in poor health. Which is always the standard line that is dished out. How did they get to the stop? beamed there by the starship enterprise? What happens when they get off the bus, beamed by magic to where ever they are going? Whichever way you look at it some will have no problem walking 400m to the next stop, whilst others will. Remember it is an extra 400m which could more than double your walking distance. There are unfortunately lots people who are les mobile that need to be catered for. I am not saying people can't walk to the next stop, it is often the time and inconvenience as much as the distance.
Further if you miss a bus because you had to walk to the next stop, you won't be best pleased, particularly a low frequency 30 minute service. You may not know the bus stop was closed before you set out.
Providing a dolly stop I think is just basic customer service, and buses need to have good customer service if they are to attract and keep passengers.
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Post by SILENCED on Oct 25, 2018 0:10:22 GMT
Which is always the standard line that is dished out. How did they get to the stop? beamed there by the starship enterprise? What happens when they get off the bus, beamed by magic to where ever they are going? Whichever way you look at it some will have no problem walking 400m to the next stop, whilst others will. Remember it is an extra 400m which could more than double your walking distance. There are unfortunately lots people who are les mobile that need to be catered for. I am not saying people can't walk to the next stop, it is often the time and inconvenience as much as the distance.
Further if you miss a bus because you had to walk to the next stop, you won't be best pleased, particularly a low frequency 30 minute service. You may not know the bus stop was closed before you set out.
Providing a dolly stop I think is just basic customer service, and buses need to have good customer service if they are to attract and keep passengers.
Redbus ... I hear what you say ... but TfL expect you to travel up to 400m to your nearest bus stop. If you are capable of going 400m ... how many can not go 800m? Remember I have used max distances? |
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Post by snoggle on Oct 25, 2018 9:49:41 GMT
Whichever way you look at it some will have no problem walking 400m to the next stop, whilst others will. Remember it is an extra 400m which could more than double your walking distance. There are unfortunately lots people who are les mobile that need to be catered for. I am not saying people can't walk to the next stop, it is often the time and inconvenience as much as the distance.
Further if you miss a bus because you had to walk to the next stop, you won't be best pleased, particularly a low frequency 30 minute service. You may not know the bus stop was closed before you set out.
Providing a dolly stop I think is just basic customer service, and buses need to have good customer service if they are to attract and keep passengers.
Redbus ... I hear what you say ... but TfL expect you to travel up to 400m to your nearest bus stop. If you are capable of going 400m ... how many can not go 800m? Remember I have used max distances? As Mr Redbus said some will be capable but others will not. I regularly see older people locally who clearly struggle to walk long distances without real discomfort. They will take a bus one stop and then wait at that stop for a connecting bus to, I assume, their destination. The fact it may take them 20 mins of agonising steps to reach the first bus stop is no excuse to double the distance they have to walk. I've only ever had to use the buses and tube with really knackered limbs twice and it is like an obstacle course especially on crutches. I would not like to have to endure that every day to get anywhere. The other point here is that you can get badly caught out if you wander up the road and suddenly spy the dreaded yellow "hat" on the stop. If I've only left a couple of mins to get to the stop there is not a cat in hell's chance of me getting to the preceding or subsequent stop in that time without missing the bus. On some occasions that would throw my entire itinerary out because I'm aiming for a particular train connection. And it's no good telling me to check online before I set out because TfL are so dreadfully inconsistent in how they enter stop closures into their online systems. If it was done 100% reliably, as it should be, then fine but it never has been and I'm firmly of the belief that the processes and resources involved in getting info about stop closures from the originator of the work to a person at Palestra who updates the online info are wholly inadequate for the task. It isn't an easy thing to do given the lax attitude that many utility companies have to roadworks and the emergency nature of some roadworks but even so. That it hasn't been fixed in 10 years of I-Bus operation tells you something about customer facing priorities at TfL. The same applies to positioning of dolly stops even recognising that the need for accessibility has made life tougher for the area controllers in trying to find alternative stopping positions. I can still remember the claptrap of the 123 being diverted away from the old T Hale bus station for "health and safety" reasons and the inconvenience and confusion that caused for months. Oh and the ongoing "unsafe" conditions caused by people running from the rail / tube stn exits to the 192 stop which was not made any better by removing the 123. Totally upside down logic by whoever was the local area controller at the time. |
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Post by ronnie on Oct 25, 2018 10:31:08 GMT
Redbus ... I hear what you say ... but TfL expect you to travel up to 400m to your nearest bus stop. If you are capable of going 400m ... how many can not go 800m? Remember I have used max distances? As Mr Redbus said some will be capable but others will not. I regularly see older people locally who clearly struggle to walk long distances without real discomfort. They will take a bus one stop and then wait at that stop for a connecting bus to, I assume, their destination. The fact it may take them 20 mins of agonising steps to reach the first bus stop is no excuse to double the distance they have to walk. I've only ever had to use the buses and tube with really knackered limbs twice and it is like an obstacle course especially on crutches. I would not like to have to endure that every day to get anywhere. The other point here is that you can get badly caught out if you wander up the road and suddenly spy the dreaded yellow "hat" on the stop. If I've only left a couple of mins to get to the stop there is not a cat in hell's chance of me getting to the preceding or subsequent stop in that time without missing the bus. On some occasions that would throw my entire itinerary out because I'm aiming for a particular train connection. And it's no good telling me to check online before I set out because TfL are so dreadfully inconsistent in how they enter stop closures into their online systems. If it was done 100% reliably, as it should be, then fine but it never has been and I'm firmly of the belief that the processes and resources involved in getting info about stop closures from the originator of the work to a person at Palestra who updates the online info are wholly inadequate for the task. It isn't an easy thing to do given the lax attitude that many utility companies have to roadworks and the emergency nature of some roadworks but even so. That it hasn't been fixed in 10 years of I-Bus operation tells you something about customer facing priorities at TfL. The same applies to positioning of dolly stops even recognising that the need for accessibility has made life tougher for the area controllers in trying to find alternative stopping positions. I can still remember the claptrap of the 123 being diverted away from the old T Hale bus station for "health and safety" reasons and the inconvenience and confusion that caused for months. Oh and the ongoing "unsafe" conditions caused by people running from the rail / tube stn exits to the 192 stop which was not made any better by removing the 123. Totally upside down logic by whoever was the local area controller at the time. And the fact that the weather at times might not be conducive to walking. We don't exactly have warm and sunny days throughout the year.... if its very windy, pouring like crazy - even able bodied people would struggle to walk a few metres, let alone 800m. And if you have small kids in tow, have lots of shopping etc to carry - even more difficult. Planning is always made from a slightly bearish / conservative case, not a blue sky scenario when everything is hunky dory or for supremely fit people capable of running 10k! |
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Post by SILENCED on Oct 25, 2018 11:02:45 GMT
As Mr Redbus said some will be capable but others will not. I regularly see older people locally who clearly struggle to walk long distances without real discomfort. They will take a bus one stop and then wait at that stop for a connecting bus to, I assume, their destination. The fact it may take them 20 mins of agonising steps to reach the first bus stop is no excuse to double the distance they have to walk. I've only ever had to use the buses and tube with really knackered limbs twice and it is like an obstacle course especially on crutches. I would not like to have to endure that every day to get anywhere. The other point here is that you can get badly caught out if you wander up the road and suddenly spy the dreaded yellow "hat" on the stop. If I've only left a couple of mins to get to the stop there is not a cat in hell's chance of me getting to the preceding or subsequent stop in that time without missing the bus. On some occasions that would throw my entire itinerary out because I'm aiming for a particular train connection. And it's no good telling me to check online before I set out because TfL are so dreadfully inconsistent in how they enter stop closures into their online systems. If it was done 100% reliably, as it should be, then fine but it never has been and I'm firmly of the belief that the processes and resources involved in getting info about stop closures from the originator of the work to a person at Palestra who updates the online info are wholly inadequate for the task. It isn't an easy thing to do given the lax attitude that many utility companies have to roadworks and the emergency nature of some roadworks but even so. That it hasn't been fixed in 10 years of I-Bus operation tells you something about customer facing priorities at TfL. The same applies to positioning of dolly stops even recognising that the need for accessibility has made life tougher for the area controllers in trying to find alternative stopping positions. I can still remember the claptrap of the 123 being diverted away from the old T Hale bus station for "health and safety" reasons and the inconvenience and confusion that caused for months. Oh and the ongoing "unsafe" conditions caused by people running from the rail / tube stn exits to the 192 stop which was not made any better by removing the 123. Totally upside down logic by whoever was the local area controller at the time. And the fact that the weather at times might not be conducive to walking. We don't exactly have warm and sunny days throughout the year.... if its very windy, pouring like crazy - even able bodied people would struggle to walk a few metres, let alone 800m. And if you have small kids in tow, have lots of shopping etc to carry - even more difficult. Planning is always made from a slightly bearish / conservative case, not a blue sky scenario when everything is hunky dory or for supremely fit people capable of running 10k! But reality is very few bus stops are anywhere near 400m apart from the next one. |
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I agree that something has changed. My suspicion is that it comes down to staffing levels. Perhaps TfL simply don't have the level of staff to assess each bus stop closure and work out where they can put a dolly stop. I suspect they might just do this for what they determine are important or easy stops. Another possibility is that the rules have changed as to where dolly stops can be sited.
