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Post by COBO on Sept 28, 2022 15:18:34 GMT
I wonder if the C3 was withdrawn would the ex C3 OMEs move to the 28.
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Post by LD71YLO (BE37054) on Sept 28, 2022 16:22:09 GMT
I wonder if the C3 was withdrawn would the ex C3 OMEs move to the 28. Likely. It makes sense as the 9 current add on 10 from the C3 and one off the 23 post Aldwych neatly completes the allocation. Regarding the 13 regs, I think they will move to the 295 to start with, then move to the 414 as it will neatly fit to the full allocation post-changes. The ADHs would then move to complete the E3 allocation and support the E1 at AV. Remainder could move to routes 266 or 258 to increase hybrid allocations there, seeing off some ADEs. Alternatively some older unreliable native ADHs could be withdrawn.
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Post by WH241 on Sept 28, 2022 16:44:46 GMT
I wonder if the C3 was withdrawn would the ex C3 OMEs move to the 28. Likely. It makes sense as the 9 current add on 10 from the C3 and one off the 23 post Aldwych neatly completes the allocation. Regarding the 13 regs, I think they will move to the 295 to start with, then move to the 414 as it will neatly fit to the full allocation post-changes. The ADHs would then move to complete the E3 allocation and support the E1 at AV. Remainder could move to routes 266 or 258 to increase hybrid allocations there, seeing off some ADEs. Alternatively some older unreliable native ADHs could be withdrawn. I would assumed the electrics are on the 28 temporarily and will move to the 295 to start the new tender if the new electrics are late.
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Post by LD71YLO (BE37054) on Sept 28, 2022 16:47:58 GMT
Likely. It makes sense as the 9 current add on 10 from the C3 and one off the 23 post Aldwych neatly completes the allocation. Regarding the 13 regs, I think they will move to the 295 to start with, then move to the 414 as it will neatly fit to the full allocation post-changes. The ADHs would then move to complete the E3 allocation and support the E1 at AV. Remainder could move to routes 266 or 258 to increase hybrid allocations there, seeing off some ADEs. Alternatively some older unreliable native ADHs could be withdrawn. I would assumed the electrics are on the 28 temporarily and will move to the 295 to start the new tender if the new electrics are late. Also very possible: was my original prediction
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Post by ADH45258 on Sept 28, 2022 17:03:42 GMT
I wonder if the C3 was withdrawn would the ex C3 OMEs move to the 28. Likely. It makes sense as the 9 current add on 10 from the C3 and one off the 23 post Aldwych neatly completes the allocation. Regarding the 13 regs, I think they will move to the 295 to start with, then move to the 414 as it will neatly fit to the full allocation post-changes. The ADHs would then move to complete the E3 allocation and support the E1 at AV. Remainder could move to routes 266 or 258 to increase hybrid allocations there, seeing off some ADEs. Alternatively some older unreliable native ADHs could be withdrawn. All of this seems very plausible. I do wonder though why the 28 was chosen for the OMEs, maybe as it passes the garage so easy to substitute etc if low on charge? Or perhaps RATP have some alternative plans for some of the 13reg VHs, particularly as the 2 at TV haven't been in service recently? If the above reshuffle were to happen, it might have made more sense to send the OMEs directly to the 414 instead. This could have allowed around 9 of the 12reg ADHs to be released now, which could have gone to V to withdraw some of the older and unreliable ADHs on the E3.
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Post by LD71YLO (BE37054) on Sept 28, 2022 17:19:44 GMT
Likely. It makes sense as the 9 current add on 10 from the C3 and one off the 23 post Aldwych neatly completes the allocation. Regarding the 13 regs, I think they will move to the 295 to start with, then move to the 414 as it will neatly fit to the full allocation post-changes. The ADHs would then move to complete the E3 allocation and support the E1 at AV. Remainder could move to routes 266 or 258 to increase hybrid allocations there, seeing off some ADEs. Alternatively some older unreliable native ADHs could be withdrawn. All of this seems very plausible. I do wonder though why the 28 was chosen for the OMEs, maybe as it passes the garage so easy to substitute etc if low on charge? Or perhaps RATP have some alternative plans for some of the 13reg VHs, particularly as the 2 at TV haven't been in service recently? If the above reshuffle were to happen, it might have made more sense to send the OMEs directly to the 414 instead. This could have allowed around 9 of the 12reg ADHs to be released now, which could have gone to V to withdraw some of the older and unreliable ADHs on the E3. Planning for future allocations?
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Post by southlondonbus on Sept 28, 2022 18:11:16 GMT
All of this seems very plausible. I do wonder though why the 28 was chosen for the OMEs, maybe as it passes the garage so easy to substitute etc if low on charge? Or perhaps RATP have some alternative plans for some of the 13reg VHs, particularly as the 2 at TV haven't been in service recently? If the above reshuffle were to happen, it might have made more sense to send the OMEs directly to the 414 instead. This could have allowed around 9 of the 12reg ADHs to be released now, which could have gone to V to withdraw some of the older and unreliable ADHs on the E3. Planning for future allocations? Probably makes sense for an Operator to plan for every eventuality rather than being sadled with aload of unallocated buses down the line.
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Post by i3lu on Sept 28, 2022 18:26:31 GMT
Likely. It makes sense as the 9 current add on 10 from the C3 and one off the 23 post Aldwych neatly completes the allocation. Regarding the 13 regs, I think they will move to the 295 to start with, then move to the 414 as it will neatly fit to the full allocation post-changes. The ADHs would then move to complete the E3 allocation and support the E1 at AV. Remainder could move to routes 266 or 258 to increase hybrid allocations there, seeing off some ADEs. Alternatively some older unreliable native ADHs could be withdrawn. All of this seems very plausible. I do wonder though why the 28 was chosen for the OMEs, maybe as it passes the garage so easy to substitute etc if low on charge? Or perhaps RATP have some alternative plans for some of the 13reg VHs, particularly as the 2 at TV haven't been in service recently? If the above reshuffle were to happen, it might have made more sense to send the OMEs directly to the 414 instead. This could have allowed around 9 of the 12reg ADHs to be released now, which could have gone to V to withdraw some of the older and unreliable ADHs on the E3. VDWs should be the first ones to leave. As I said the 13reg ones available could go back to BT for the 340 + 3/4 other VHs (ex TT ones as well) to form the TVR.
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Post by rif153 on Sept 28, 2022 18:29:09 GMT
Likely. It makes sense as the 9 current add on 10 from the C3 and one off the 23 post Aldwych neatly completes the allocation. Regarding the 13 regs, I think they will move to the 295 to start with, then move to the 414 as it will neatly fit to the full allocation post-changes. The ADHs would then move to complete the E3 allocation and support the E1 at AV. Remainder could move to routes 266 or 258 to increase hybrid allocations there, seeing off some ADEs. Alternatively some older unreliable native ADHs could be withdrawn. All of this seems very plausible. I do wonder though why the 28 was chosen for the OMEs, maybe as it passes the garage so easy to substitute etc if low on charge? Or perhaps RATP have some alternative plans for some of the 13reg VHs, particularly as the 2 at TV haven't been in service recently? If the above reshuffle were to happen, it might have made more sense to send the OMEs directly to the 414 instead. This could have allowed around 9 of the 12reg ADHs to be released now, which could have gone to V to withdraw some of the older and unreliable ADHs on the E3. I hope the 12-reg ADHs end up on the E3 just because it'll be a beautiful callback to the days I fondly remember of First London Enviro 400s on the route
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Post by DE20106 on Sept 28, 2022 18:58:26 GMT
All of this seems very plausible. I do wonder though why the 28 was chosen for the OMEs, maybe as it passes the garage so easy to substitute etc if low on charge? Or perhaps RATP have some alternative plans for some of the 13reg VHs, particularly as the 2 at TV haven't been in service recently? If the above reshuffle were to happen, it might have made more sense to send the OMEs directly to the 414 instead. This could have allowed around 9 of the 12reg ADHs to be released now, which could have gone to V to withdraw some of the older and unreliable ADHs on the E3. I hope the 12-reg ADHs end up on the E3 just because it'll be a beautiful callback to the days I fondly remember of First London Enviro 400s on the route I don’t think they’ll be allowed to be a full allocation will they as the E3 is a hybrid contract?
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Post by transportizm on Sept 28, 2022 19:19:36 GMT
I hope the 12-reg ADHs end up on the E3 just because it'll be a beautiful callback to the days I fondly remember of First London Enviro 400s on the route I don’t think they’ll be allowed to be a full allocation will they as the E3 is a hybrid contract? The 12-reg ADH's are hybrid
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Post by DE20106 on Sept 28, 2022 19:22:07 GMT
I don’t think they’ll be allowed to be a full allocation will they as the E3 is a hybrid contract? The 12-reg ADH's are hybrid Sorry read that as 12-reg ADEs 😂 totally forgot they inherited the 12-reg First/TT DNHs
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Post by ADH45258 on Sept 28, 2022 21:28:47 GMT
All of this seems very plausible. I do wonder though why the 28 was chosen for the OMEs, maybe as it passes the garage so easy to substitute etc if low on charge? Or perhaps RATP have some alternative plans for some of the 13reg VHs, particularly as the 2 at TV haven't been in service recently? If the above reshuffle were to happen, it might have made more sense to send the OMEs directly to the 414 instead. This could have allowed around 9 of the 12reg ADHs to be released now, which could have gone to V to withdraw some of the older and unreliable ADHs on the E3. VDWs should be the first ones to leave. As I said the 13reg ones available could go back to BT for the 340 + 3/4 other VHs (ex TT ones as well) to form the TVR. If the 639/670 continue to use G3 VHs in the long term, that releases 11x 13reg in total (with the 340 needing 10). It was also suggested that the 340 could use VMHs, to keep all of the type at one place. However, I'm not sure there's much advantage in this, as there's no guarantee the 13 will stay at BT in the long term. The fact that the 226's start date is being delayed to coincide with the 142 loss suggests that the 13 move to BT is more to do with drivers than cost or anything else. It allows the 142 drivers to move to the 13, and the current 13 drivers at X to the 226. But if BT were to win anything in the future, such as the 221, it seems likely the 13 might move back to X again.
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Post by JUNIOR26 on Sept 28, 2022 22:23:55 GMT
VDWs should be the first ones to leave. As I said the 13reg ones available could go back to BT for the 340 + 3/4 other VHs (ex TT ones as well) to form the TVR. If the 639/670 continue to use G3 VHs in the long term, that releases 11x 13reg in total (with the 340 needing 10). It was also suggested that the 340 could use VMHs, to keep all of the type at one place. However, I'm not sure there's much advantage in this, as there's no guarantee the 13 will stay at BT in the long term. The fact that the 226's start date is being delayed to coincide with the 142 loss suggests that the 13 move to BT is more to do with drivers than cost or anything else. It allows the 142 drivers to move to the 13, and the current 13 drivers at X to the 226. But if BT were to win anything in the future, such as the 221, it seems likely the 13 might move back to X again. 340 was awarded on a 7 year contract, so won't be using the 13reg VHS as they wouldn't be compliant for a 7 year contract when the contract starts. 340 should be using vehicles between 5-8 years old.
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Post by ADH45258 on Sept 29, 2022 13:02:36 GMT
If the 639/670 continue to use G3 VHs in the long term, that releases 11x 13reg in total (with the 340 needing 10). It was also suggested that the 340 could use VMHs, to keep all of the type at one place. However, I'm not sure there's much advantage in this, as there's no guarantee the 13 will stay at BT in the long term. The fact that the 226's start date is being delayed to coincide with the 142 loss suggests that the 13 move to BT is more to do with drivers than cost or anything else. It allows the 142 drivers to move to the 13, and the current 13 drivers at X to the 226. But if BT were to win anything in the future, such as the 221, it seems likely the 13 might move back to X again. 340 was awarded on a 7 year contract, so won't be using the 13reg VHS as they wouldn't be compliant for a 7 year contract when the contract starts. 340 should be using vehicles between 5-8 years old. Aware that might have been the case, was just pointing out that there would have been enough for the 340. The 23x 13reg VHs could be a good fit for the revised 414 to Putney Heath as a previous post suggested. Or alternatively send them to the E3, with the 62reg ADHs at V going the other way to top up the 414 - either way allowing the 60reg ADHs to be withdrawn. I'm also not sure the 340's allocation will involve anything else in the Westbourne Park fleet. RATP are probably quite keen to withdraw the VDWs, being a small batch of a non-standard type, and so the 452 would likely need to keep both the VMHs from the 13's PVR cut, and the 16reg VHs when they return from the 125. It would then make the most sense to use the BCEs from the 94's cutback to Marble Arch to release some hybrids to the 340. I think it was suggested this may take place at the same time at Bond Street Crossrail opening? So plenty of time to reallocate BCEs and refurbish any hybrids as necessary.
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