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Post by snowman on Oct 1, 2022 9:57:36 GMT
I doubt that BT/SO/CP would have space for any new work, and doubt RP would either. Any space freed up by the loss of the 142 (PVR 16) will be taken when the 13 moves in (PVR 22) but the N13 has a PVR of 4 so gives BT a little bit of breathing space along with the N5's 6 buses. I don't know what the space situation at X will be like once RATP take on the 226 and 295 - of course the 218 and 228 are moving out but assuming there is space there RATP could always move routes from North West London garages there - for instance if it can be accommodated moving the 18 there would free up huge amounts of space at RP. X has room (physical space) for dozens more buses (although currently wouldn’t be enough staff to operate them RP remains a mystery mid term, from memory it is on a 10 year lease which is now more than half way through. There are plans to redevelop the area, but could get a short extension if building work delayed. The dates are in this thread somewhere (might be 2026). No idea where everything will move to when it does finally close for redevelopment
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Post by LD71YLO (BE37054) on Oct 1, 2022 10:44:40 GMT
Any space freed up by the loss of the 142 (PVR 16) will be taken when the 13 moves in (PVR 22) but the N13 has a PVR of 4 so gives BT a little bit of breathing space along with the N5's 6 buses. I don't know what the space situation at X will be like once RATP take on the 226 and 295 - of course the 218 and 228 are moving out but assuming there is space there RATP could always move routes from North West London garages there - for instance if it can be accommodated moving the 18 there would free up huge amounts of space at RP. X has room (physical space) for dozens more buses (although currently wouldn’t be enough staff to operate them RP remains a mystery mid term, from memory it is on a 10 year lease which is now more than half way through. There are plans to redevelop the area, but could get a short extension if building work delayed. The dates are in this thread somewhere (might be 2026). No idea where everything will move to when it does finally close for redevelopment 2017 second half RP opened - coinciding with takeup of route 18/N18 and new 220 contract. So lease ends 2027
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Post by LK65EBO on Oct 1, 2022 10:54:12 GMT
Stil no sign of ADEs 40307-10. I’m guessing they are destined for Bedfont Lakes service now the 635 has been lost to Metroline. 40308 has just entered service at AV, I wonder if it's refurbed, and if it is, I wonder what it's for. ADE40310 is also at AV. Refurbished as well.
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Post by dragonman on Oct 1, 2022 12:17:48 GMT
Could the 13 reg VHs that end up becoming spare from the 28 possibly end up straying on the 142 if they do transfer to BT before January. And if they don't transfer there maybe they'll go to TV to displace some of the ADEs on the 406 and 418?
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Post by ADH45258 on Oct 1, 2022 12:39:44 GMT
Could the 13 reg VHs that end up becoming spare from the 28 possibly end up straying on the 142 if they do transfer to BT before January. And if they don't transfer there maybe they'll go to TV to displace some of the ADEs on the 406 and 418? It depends how long it takes for the 295's new BCEs to enter service, as they will need to stay at X until then. Potentially would then be used as refurb floats somewhere for a while, before going for refurbishment and returning to BT.
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Post by dragonman on Oct 1, 2022 12:50:54 GMT
Could the 13 reg VHs that end up becoming spare from the 28 possibly end up straying on the 142 if they do transfer to BT before January. And if they don't transfer there maybe they'll go to TV to displace some of the ADEs on the 406 and 418? It depends how long it takes for the 295's new BCEs to enter service, as they will need to stay at X until then. Potentially would then be used as refurb floats somewhere for a while, before going for refurbishment and returning to BT. they won't be going for refurbishments though as they were all refurbished last year.
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Post by ADH45258 on Oct 1, 2022 12:51:36 GMT
So presumably when 94 is cut there will be spare BCEs S has 47001-29 (29 buses) and 47084-99 (16) and 47129 (1 extra) =46 94 will have PVR of 20, 49 has PVR of 15, PVR of 35, so about 6 or 7 spare I wonder where they will go, my hunch is on 6 going to FW to release 47148, 47152-6 to the 183 (their scheduled route), so that 125 can take the 22reg versions. In turn releasing VHs to cover take up of 295 in 4 weeks time The 22reg are the 183's batch, and are delivered but in storage at X. As SO is at full capacity, more BCEs can only be moved there is something else leaves in return. So it is expected that the BCEs will be shuffled around once electrification work is complete at BT, with each route gaining the intended batch. It's possible the BCEs spare from the 94 could move to FW, but that wouldn't make any difference to the 125/295/etc - just releasing a further 6-8 VHs for use somewhere. The VHs from the 28 and 125 are more than enough to cover the 295's temporary allocation. Also at S, the 148 is still regularly using a small number of BCEs, so I wouldn't be surprised if nothing leaves immediately after the 94's cut. The 148 recently had a minor frequency increase, but no more LTs were transferred. Could perhaps move LT461-463 to S, which are now spare at V (the older batch exactly covers the 9's allocation).
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Post by ADH45258 on Oct 1, 2022 12:56:54 GMT
It depends how long it takes for the 295's new BCEs to enter service, as they will need to stay at X until then. Potentially would then be used as refurb floats somewhere for a while, before going for refurbishment and returning to BT. they won't be going for refurbishments though as they were all refurbished last year. I thought so too, but it was recently confirmed here that they will be refurbished again. I suppose they were done slightly in advance of the 28's contract start, so there will be about a 2.5 year gap. Also the 340 is awarded on a 7 year contract, so the refurbishment last year may not be enough to keep the VHs in good condition through to 2030. Probably makes sense to refurbish them in early 2023 while they aren't needed for anything, rather than mid-contract. I also wonder if those still with orange handrails may be changed to turqoise this time?
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Post by VMH2452 on Oct 1, 2022 13:07:16 GMT
they won't be going for refurbishments though as they were all refurbished last year. I thought so too, but it was recently confirmed here that they will be refurbished again. I suppose they were done slightly in advance of the 28's contract start, so there will be about a 2.5 year gap. Also the 340 is awarded on a 7 year contract, so the refurbishment last year may not be enough to keep the VHs in good condition through to 2030. Probably makes sense to refurbish them in early 2023 while they aren't needed for anything, rather than mid-contract. I also wonder if those still with orange handrails may be changed to turqoise this time? The 340 is getting the ex-TT VHs not the 13reg. This was posted yesterday: Presumably the 452's allocation is currently a mix of WHs, VMHs and VDWs. If this is correct, are there any plans for the BU16 VHs once the 295 gets its electrics? Perhaps the 203 could be converted to DDs if retained? Also guessing the refurbishment only applies to the ADHs, as the 13reg VHs have only recently been done for the 28. Vh45081-8 are to be refurbished for the 340.
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Post by WH241 on Oct 1, 2022 13:20:39 GMT
they won't be going for refurbishments though as they were all refurbished last year. I thought so too, but it was recently confirmed here that they will be refurbished again. I suppose they were done slightly in advance of the 28's contract start, so there will be about a 2.5 year gap. Also the 340 is awarded on a 7 year contract, so the refurbishment last year may not be enough to keep the VHs in good condition through to 2030. Probably makes sense to refurbish them in early 2023 while they aren't needed for anything, rather than mid-contract. I also wonder if those still with orange handrails may be changed to turqoise this time? That seems very wasteful to have two refurbishments so close together especially when some routes have buses that missed being refurbished at all.
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Post by andyc on Oct 1, 2022 13:32:35 GMT
I thought so too, but it was recently confirmed here that they will be refurbished again. I suppose they were done slightly in advance of the 28's contract start, so there will be about a 2.5 year gap. Also the 340 is awarded on a 7 year contract, so the refurbishment last year may not be enough to keep the VHs in good condition through to 2030. Probably makes sense to refurbish them in early 2023 while they aren't needed for anything, rather than mid-contract. I also wonder if those still with orange handrails may be changed to turqoise this time? That seems very wasteful to have two refurbishments so close together especially when some routes have buses that missed being refurbished at all. The 13 Reg ones will not be refurbished again - they are already refurbished… The 16 plate ex-TT buses are those that will be refurbished, as they have not yet been done…
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Post by snowman on Oct 1, 2022 13:43:39 GMT
I also wonder if those still with orange handrails may be changed to turqoise this time? The 340 is getting the ex-TT VHs not the 13reg. This was posted yesterday: Vh45081-8 are to be refurbished for the 340. VH45081-88 date from 2016, so will be 7 years old at start of contract, and 14 years old at the end of 340 contract It’s just that they were inherited which is why a number gap was found for them, but basically same age as VH 45162-199
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Post by DE20106 on Oct 1, 2022 13:59:21 GMT
Its designed to deliberately make overcrowding worse so people who can’t get on the 94 will switch to the more expensive central line, it’s TfL’s full intention to do just that. I keep saying that "Two anecdotes doesn't equal data" but I cannot recall a daytime trip on the 94 along the Bayswater Road eastbound or westbound when the bus hasn't been packed... I use the 94 an awful lot from MA to Shepherd’s Bush Westfield and vice Versa as it’s just such a lovely journey, relaxing and relatively quick thanks to the bus lanes and much more scenic and relaxing than the central line. Plus I absolutely love that batch of LB69 BCEs. To me they same smoother and less creaky than the newer ones. And yes I agree with you, frequently packed buses pretty much all day, only real time you get empty ones during the day are if it’s closely following a packed one in front. But on the bright side of this cut though the buses are still the same frequency in the day where it’s still just as packed so the tourists won’t be affected by it. If that’s such thing as a silver lining to it.
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Post by WH241 on Oct 1, 2022 14:48:58 GMT
That seems very wasteful to have two refurbishments so close together especially when some routes have buses that missed being refurbished at all. The 13 Reg ones will not be refurbished again - they are already refurbished… The 16 plate ex-TT buses are those that will be refurbished, as they have not yet been done… Thanks for confirming so much good information like you post gets mixed in with speculation or guesswork that’s presented almost as fact.
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Post by rif153 on Oct 1, 2022 15:01:58 GMT
So presumably when 94 is cut there will be spare BCEs S has 47001-29 (29 buses) and 47084-99 (16) and 47129 (1 extra) =46 94 will have PVR of 20, 49 has PVR of 15, PVR of 35, so about 6 or 7 spare I wonder where they will go, my hunch is on 6 going to FW to release 47148, 47152-6 to the 183 (their scheduled route), so that 125 can take the 22reg versions. In turn releasing VHs to cover take up of 295 in 4 weeks time The 22reg are the 183's batch, and are delivered but in storage at X. As SO is at full capacity, more BCEs can only be moved there is something else leaves in return. So it is expected that the BCEs will be shuffled around once electrification work is complete at BT, with each route gaining the intended batch. It's possible the BCEs spare from the 94 could move to FW, but that wouldn't make any difference to the 125/295/etc - just releasing a further 6-8 VHs for use somewhere. The VHs from the 28 and 125 are more than enough to cover the 295's temporary allocation. Also at S, the 148 is still regularly using a small number of BCEs, so I wouldn't be surprised if nothing leaves immediately after the 94's cut. The 148 recently had a minor frequency increase, but no more LTs were transferred. Could perhaps move LT461-463 to S, which are now spare at V (the older batch exactly covers the 9's allocation). The 94's PVR cut will release 5 buses which matches the 481's PVR so perhaps the BCEs will move to FW and replace the VHs on that route. These could move to X temporarily for the 295 and in the long term would be destined for the 340.
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