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Post by DT 11 on Jan 25, 2013 7:16:07 GMT
What I liked when Metrobus ran the X26 was they put a lot of double deckers on it. The early morning journeys are packed to the brim. IMO it should have got 10.9m Enviro 400s with a single door with luggage racks on the lower deck. DDs will be good for the X26 as the extra capacity will be there when it is required. The X26 can pick up a full load at Heathrow and a half hour wait for anybody that can't get on, it should be top of the list for double deckers. Metrobus put quite a few deckers out particularly on Sundays. See that's why double deckers would have been much more efficient, especially as the service is Low Frequency. Whatever Double decker Metrobus had available most of the time was on the X26. Many have said the X26 needs double deckers and I couldn't agree more!
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2013 8:35:10 GMT
why cant Quality Lines buy more double decks
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Post by TA1 on Jan 25, 2013 8:42:22 GMT
why cant Quality Lines buy more double decks Because their is no need for them to buy double deckers right now, seeing as they've not gained any route with double deckers yet, although the Croydon tranche tenders are outstanding so I don't know.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 25, 2013 9:42:04 GMT
why cant Quality Lines buy more double decks Because Quality Line only buy what TFL ask them to buy for a contract - the specifications for the bus are set out when they bid for the contract. If TFL ask for 12m buses with one door (i.e. the current Citaros) then that's what they'll buy. It would be very rare for an operator to double-deck a route with new buses if TFL weren't paying - because the company would be out of pocket. As far as the company would see it, it's TFL's problem to pay for them to deal with the overcrowding - they simply do as they're told. I do think one-door double decks could work though, especially with a longer wheelbase. A lot of people don't use that route for the airport, and they could just go and sit upstairs, with no need to be anywhere near the luggage rack.
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Post by T.R. on Jan 26, 2013 1:06:15 GMT
I once suggested this to TfL last year re the 112 but got no reply: A suggestion I'm considering putting through to TfL would be to increase the allocation/PVR to 8. At periods of serious A406 disruption, at least half the buses would run the full route, whereas 2 or 3 could be split to turn at Stonebridge Park (S.P. - Brent Cross and/or S.P. - Ealing, depending on the severity of the traffic). Whilst it may not work in practice, it could be a good way to keep as much of the route running efficiently. As for the X26... I think we've discussed this too many times and there are good arguments on both sides. While I'm in favour of DD's (personal benefit), whatever TfL has specified will have to suffice for now.
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Post by Steve80 on Jan 26, 2013 3:30:24 GMT
Every day this week I seen at least one DD on the X26. I wonder why?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2013 10:49:00 GMT
I once suggested this to TfL last year re the 112 but got no reply: A suggestion I'm considering putting through to TfL would be to increase the allocation/PVR to 8. At periods of serious A406 disruption, at least half the buses would run the full route, whereas 2 or 3 could be split to turn at Stonebridge Park (S.P. - Brent Cross and/or S.P. - Ealing, depending on the severity of the traffic). Whilst it may not work in practice, it could be a good way to keep as much of the route running efficiently. As for the X26... I think we've discussed this too many times and there are good arguments on both sides. While I'm in favour of DD's (personal benefit), whatever TfL has specified will have to suffice for now. How are there good arguments on both sides? If a route is struggling with single deckers then it needs double deckers or a frequency increase. Surely every TfL route serving Heathrow is busy enough for double deckers.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2013 11:18:09 GMT
have there ever been single deckers serving the night bus route?
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Post by snoggle on Jan 26, 2013 11:34:50 GMT
I once suggested this to TfL last year re the 112 but got no reply: As for the X26... I think we've discussed this too many times and there are good arguments on both sides. While I'm in favour of DD's (personal benefit), whatever TfL has specified will have to suffice for now. How are there good arguments on both sides? If a route is struggling with single deckers then it needs double deckers or a frequency increase. Surely every TfL route serving Heathrow is busy enough for double deckers. Oh come on. The X26 has been debated to death on here. There are obvious merits to having long single decks on the X26 as luggage can be supervised easily and people do not have to deal with stairs. You have repeatedly remarked about TfL's poor double deck layout especially downstairs. Why foist that on people using an express service? The counter argument, naturally enough, is that the X26 has extremely high local flows on top of the Heathrow traffic. One way to deal with that could be double deckers or it could be to remove some of the intermediate stops. This would dampen down the demand and speed up the service. It is quite clear from many comments that double deckers are more expensive to purchase and operate. This therefore increases costs for any service currently run with single decks. When the trial of the enhanced X26 service was completed it was evident that the subsidy for the route went up as extra revenue did not cover the extra costs. Putting deckers on the route would simply make that subsidy requirement even larger. The better frequency was only retained for political reasons. Now we are back to our favourite argument - where does the money come from to cover the costs of sticking double deckers on routes that are currently run with single decks? The Mayor and TfL have clearly set out in the draft business plan that there is no increase in the bus contract budget beyond that allowed for expansion of routes at the Olympic Park. If you think double decks are needed on all Heathrow routes then you need to say how much frequencies will be reduced on those routes or other ones or what else "gives" in order to free up the money to fund it. Frequency is one of the key drivers of patronage so it is not the most sensible thing to reduce if TfL wishes to maintain a successful bus network and growing patronage and revenue.
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Post by snoggle on Jan 26, 2013 11:49:58 GMT
have there ever been single deckers serving the night bus route? Yes. All on 24 hour routes but I've used "N" below. N236 - night jnys now withdrawn N274 - night jnys now withdrawn N33 - still runs N72 - still runs N214 - still runs N285 - still runs When the bendy buses ran then some night runs were single deck then too - N29, N453, N12 Many years ago the old N96 (Leyton - Central London) was run with Leyland Nationals as Leyton did not have sufficient double deck OPO buses at the time. I'm sure there are other examples. Out of curiosity why do you ask these questions when I am sure you know the answer or where to find it? It's obvious from other things you write that you know how to dig out information.
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Post by M1104 on Jan 26, 2013 11:57:43 GMT
have there ever been single deckers serving the night bus route? The N11 used to be Dart operated (10.8m bodies I believe) before London General took over in 2003.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2013 14:12:15 GMT
have there ever been single deckers serving the night bus route? The N11 used to be Dart operated (10.8m bodies I believe) before London General took over in 2003. Really
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2013 14:21:28 GMT
snoggle......WTF? Ive never mentioned poor layouts on deckers. The X26 needs more capacity, frequency increase or deckers. Larger single deckers? Artics are out of the question for a number of reasons. Reduce stops? That was done when the X26 replaced the 726. And whats all this about luggage? It can be taken upstairs
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Post by IanF on Jan 26, 2013 14:26:10 GMT
snoggle......WTF? Ive never mentioned poor layouts on deckers. The X26 needs more capacity, frequency increase or deckers. Larger single deckers? Artics are out of the question for a number of reasons. Reduce stops? That was done when the X26 replaced the 726. And whats all this about luggage? It can be taken upstairs Are you seriously saying that someone should have to lug a 15-20kg suitcase up stairs on a bus as you do know that'll slow boarding and create other issues such as where to stick said luggage. Funny as it may seem tfl do know what there doing and the only thing that needs to happen to the route is a frequency increase.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 26, 2013 14:45:35 GMT
Errr..........well strangely enough I have seen people going upstairs with suitcases and not only on the X26
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