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Post by DT 11 on Apr 10, 2013 6:40:16 GMT
A reliable source on Facebook mentioned that there is a possibility of redundancies with the changes - I guess we'll have to wait and see. If true, then I feel for those members of staff involved. God no My idea is to hand the 365, 165 and 252 routes early to Stagecoach and then TUPE the staff to stagecoach, that would stop the redundancies. The routes should not transfer early. IMO. That's probably the reason Forst have not sold the garage. I personally think Go Ahead or Arriva should be the ones to get DM as they are most likely to keep it open. Go Ahead plan to transfer SI work to DM, but IMO I don't see the point as the majority of Routes at SI are close to the Garage. If Stagecoach get it. It is very likely that a garage will close, which will cause redundancies. Tbh I don't like the idea of Metroline taking over 5 garages close to their own. I can see possible closures happening in future.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2013 6:46:52 GMT
Well i personally say that 2013 have been a bad year for First London. I am glad the Australians and Metroline saved the routes as well as the workers. I hope to see some Australian built buses to run in London. Have you ever tried to get things from Australia to the UK for something small it costs a lot and buses aren't exactly small. I don't think we'll be seeing Aussie buses. ADL took over Australia's main bus maker last year ... So shipping Enviros from Oz makes no financial sense :-)
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Post by cc2005 on Apr 10, 2013 7:19:05 GMT
I find it hard to believe that because of a change of logos, service A will start to be run awfully Go-Ahead made sure the 476 was run just as badly as First ran it, so there was continuity ;D I think Metroline will do well with the new routes - it will be weird seeing Metroline 207's though And weird seeing Metroline operating 607 too.... The 207 gives them a new type of bus too..the Scania Omnicity (SN)....
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Post by DT 11 on Apr 10, 2013 7:24:06 GMT
Possibly buses for the 425. There is no decision about DM, but the DN's soon to become spare could have been helpful for Metroline to get old crap out (I.E. VPL's etc ;D) Yes, there's some DNs due on the 425 for July but I doubt they'll arrive in anything other than First spec, though they may end up arriving logo less. As Metrobus said they could also end up being the first place we see the new logo applied, though that depends on when the changeover actually occurs and the speed with which existing buses are re-logoed ELBG were owned by a Bank, but this is a family owned operator, so they actually have experience in operating buses unlike Macquarie, abit not in the UK. Fair point - though the main sentiment in my post was that an outsider with very little experience in London/UK transport will be rushing in and taking over some difficult routes! Abellio seem to manage quite well, but then again they aren't total outsiders. cf. ELBG ;D Have you ever tried to get things from Australia to the UK for something small it costs a lot and buses aren't exactly small. I don't think we'll be seeing Aussie buses.[/quote] Yes though in the age of "globalisation" transport costs are more and more irrelevant. MCV manufacture in Egypt, Scania in Brazil, everyone buys Japanese cars, etc. People have different opinions on Metroline. Im not really too fond of them myself but really it's better to respect the opinion than react against it. If you cannot cope with the comments altogether then all I suggest is for you to pull out of the thread altogether to try and prevent any heated discussion about 'This and that' on Metroline.[/quote] I agree - with such a big move everyone is going to have different opinions. Not everyone has to like an operator just because you do![/quote] IMO we just have to wait a see how Tower Transit handle things. Just because they are an outside does not mean they cannot run services efficiently. Also remember In 1994 every company who acquired Garages in London were outsiders.... Abellio seem to be doing a fine job apart from the poor service on the T33.
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Post by Trident on Apr 10, 2013 7:41:34 GMT
A reliable source on Facebook mentioned that there is a possibility of redundancies with the changes - I guess we'll have to wait and see. If true, then I feel for those members of staff involved. God no My idea is to hand the 365, 165 and 252 routes early to Stagecoach and then TUPE the staff to stagecoach, that would stop the redundancies. What are you trying to be achieve here handing the routes early? The staff on thr lost routes already know their future so why is there a need to terminatre contracts early? There isnt a rush on deciding the future at DM
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Post by DT 11 on Apr 10, 2013 7:45:56 GMT
IMO we just have to wait a see how Tower Transit handle things. Just because they are an outside does not mean they cannot run services efficiently. Also remember In 1994 every company who acquired Garages in London were outsiders.... Abellio seem to be doing a fine job apart from the poor service on the T33. Yes, in 1994 all companies were outsiders and quite a few ended up throwing in the towel. Abellio do seem to run a decent service. The original service on the 172 was terrible, but then they were pressured into an extra bus (which GAL had bidded with!) They've improved the 484, which seems to run better than it used to, the 188 has always been decent, etc. I'm not saying all outsiders will fail, I'm just saying they're going to have a tough job. Tbh they are not going to have a tough job as First did. Tower Transit have fewer garages to take care of. The 25 is no doubt going to be their flagship route. Maybe the 25 may get a more decent service seeing as they have less routes to run. The 25 is one of the most difficult routes to operate as well.
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Post by cc2005 on Apr 10, 2013 7:57:12 GMT
Yes, in 1994 all companies were outsiders and quite a few ended up throwing in the towel. Abellio do seem to run a decent service. The original service on the 172 was terrible, but then they were pressured into an extra bus (which GAL had bidded with!) They've improved the 484, which seems to run better than it used to, the 188 has always been decent, etc. I'm not saying all outsiders will fail, I'm just saying they're going to have a tough job. Tbh they are not going to have a tough job as First did. Tower Transit have fewer garages to take care of. The 25 is no doubt going to be their flagship route. Maybe the 25 may get a more decent service seeing as they have less routes to run. The 25 is one of the most difficult routes to operate as well. I would (personally) say that the 23 would be their flagship route: central London, passes most tourist attractions. But they've got a lot of fairly big routes to run: the 23, 25, 26, 30. And I agree, the 25 is probably going to be the hardest to run. Don't forget the 28/31/328 group too which often suffer from heavy congestion in west London.
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Post by wh541 on Apr 10, 2013 8:55:20 GMT
A reliable source on Facebook mentioned that there is a possibility of redundancies with the changes - I guess we'll have to wait and see. If true, then I feel for those members of staff involved. God no My idea is to hand the 365, 165 and 252 routes early to Stagecoach and then TUPE the staff to stagecoach, that would stop the redundancies. OK I am going to say this nice and slllllooooooowwwwwwwwwwww FreeBBC The 365,165 and 252 o and 179 are NOTHING to do with the sale yesterday! even if First never sold the companies these routes would be moving! I really am failing to see what transferring the routes early will achieve? Can you tell me? Have you thought about where Stagecoach will get all the buses required for the routes 4 or so months early? Sorry if I sound sarcastic but just frustrating seeing you say the same thing again about the routes lost on tender and not anything to do with the sale.
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Post by marlon101 on Apr 10, 2013 9:01:02 GMT
First London in my opinion were actually good. I only called them Worst or Last when someone mentions Worst Capital Connect ;D You mean Worst Crapital Disconnect? A reliable source on Facebook mentioned that there is a possibility of redundancies with the changes - I guess we'll have to wait and see. If true, then I feel for those members of staff involved. I would have thought there would be a strong possibility in terms of management structures and at the higher levels of the business. It has been on the cards for a while, but what is First's rationale for cutting and running from London? Especially after their expensive, high profile presence in London last July
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Post by LX09FBJ on Apr 10, 2013 9:02:25 GMT
God no My idea is to hand the 365, 165 and 252 routes early to Stagecoach and then TUPE the staff to stagecoach, that would stop the redundancies. OK I am going to say this nice and slllllooooooowwwwwwwwwwww FreeBBC The 365,165 and 252 o and 179 are NOTHING to do with the sale yesterday! even if First never sold the companies these routes would be moving! I really am failing to see what transferring the routes early will achieve? Can you tell me? Have you thought about where Stagecoach will get all the buses required for the routes 4 or so months early? Sorry if I sound sarcastic but just frustrating seeing you say the same thing again about the routes lost on tender and not anything to do with the sale. They could borrow the existing DNs. Oh, and I think that Abellio should get the K1/K3 early too! Still not gonna happen. Hopefully both operators will get rid of this fleet number c**p. e.g. TNA33383! The 425 would be their best bet for a new logo (Abellio launched it's branding on the 407 when it was took over- no dobut LU would've done the same except there were no routes to take over at the time)
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Post by wh541 on Apr 10, 2013 9:03:31 GMT
I would (personally) say that the 23 would be their flagship route: central London, passes most tourist attractions. But they've got a lot of fairly big routes to run: the 23, 25, 26, 30. And I agree, the 25 is probably going to be the hardest to run. Don't forget the 28/31/328 group too which often suffer from heavy congestion in west London. I would agree. It was rumoured the 25 currently runs at a loss anyway. They do seem to have taken up the two most high-profile garages in the First London operation, with the 4 Central London routes you note as well as the RV1, 9H. Some of the local East London routes like the 339 and W-routes that they have picked up will also be fairly tough to run. The 25 rumor has been there since First took it over - There was a rather rubbish one about handing the route back to Stagecoach just after it was taken over in 2011.
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Post by wh541 on Apr 10, 2013 9:07:28 GMT
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Post by ServerKing on Apr 10, 2013 9:09:53 GMT
First London in my opinion were actually good. I only called them Worst or Last when someone mentions Worst Capital Connect ;D You mean Worst Crapital Disconnect? A reliable source on Facebook mentioned that there is a possibility of redundancies with the changes - I guess we'll have to wait and see. If true, then I feel for those members of staff involved. I would have thought there would be a strong possibility in terms of management structures and at the higher levels of the business. It has been on the cards for a while, but what is First's rationale for cutting and running from London? Especially after their expensive, high profile presence in London last July It seems in other parts of the UK they're running away too... there won't be much of Worst Group left if they carry on like this Nearly every issue of Buses I see articles relating to different operations of there's selling up or being taken over by rivals - eg the Kidderminster ops went to Rotala last month I'm surprised about the investment (finally) in First Essex, perhaps we'll be reading soon that First have disappeared or just do rail (albeit not too well)
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Post by snoggle on Apr 10, 2013 9:12:05 GMT
A reliable source on Facebook mentioned that there is a possibility of redundancies with the changes - I guess we'll have to wait and see. If true, then I feel for those members of staff involved. God no My idea is to hand the 365, 165 and 252 routes early to Stagecoach and then TUPE the staff to stagecoach, that would stop the redundancies. This would make no difference. You have been told endless times that these DM routes are NOT part of the sale. Therefore please desist from repeating nonsense. There will be probably be cut backs to head office and possibly garage staff because Metroline will want to rationalise the number of staff to make savings. This always happens when one firm takes over another. It is relatively rare that the drivers and mechanics lose their jobs because they are needed to run the service. Who knows what will happen in respect of Tower Transit as they will need to start a business in London. They are unlikely to sack experienced staff who know how the First routes run. You might not like the thought of people being made redundant but it happens all the time - it's called life so you need to learn to accept it rather than going into a state of shock.
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Post by wh541 on Apr 10, 2013 9:18:26 GMT
God no My idea is to hand the 365, 165 and 252 routes early to Stagecoach and then TUPE the staff to stagecoach, that would stop the redundancies. This would make no difference. You have been told endless times that these DM routes are NOT part of the sale. Therefore please desist from repeating nonsense. There will be probably be cut backs to head office and possibly garage staff because Metroline will want to rationalise the number of staff to make savings. This always happens when one firm takes over another. It is relatively rare that the drivers and mechanics lose their jobs because they are needed to run the service. Who knows what will happen in respect of Tower Transit as they will need to start a business in London. They are unlikely to sack experienced staff who know how the First routes run. You might not like the thought of people being made redundant but it happens all the time - it's called life so you need to learn to accept it rather than going into a state of shock. Couldn’t agree more! Sadly a job is no longer there for life! It is all about saving money now days. I know somebody who could end up losing there house as they just been made redundant but they not doing a song and dance they just job hunting.
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