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Post by routew15 on Nov 10, 2016 20:23:37 GMT
Judging from the never ending series of questions about GOBLIN electrification and the rail replacement buses it seems that TfL and the line user group have fallen out again. TfL are clearly not responding to queries and suggestions based on this question from Jennette Arnold to the Mayor. Whilst it seems highly unlikely to happen. Could this potentially be accommodated until the new trains were ready?
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Post by snoggle on Nov 10, 2016 21:23:19 GMT
Judging from the never ending series of questions about GOBLIN electrification and the rail replacement buses it seems that TfL and the line user group have fallen out again. TfL are clearly not responding to queries and suggestions based on this question from Jennette Arnold to the Mayor. Whilst it seems highly unlikely to happen. Could this potentially be accommodated until the new trains were ready? The user group have been banging about this for months. While I see their point there have been previous pretty detailed Mayor's Answers which explained why it's not feasible. Here are some of the reasons. 1. Probably not costed in Arriva's new Overground contract which starts this Saturday. 2. Drivers would need to be type trained. Almost certainly no flex to do this and then train them again on Class 710s when they turn up. 3. Willesden depot has no experience of maintaining the type. Would cost a lot of money for a short time period. Highly unlikely that Ilford could keep maintaining them because it will be taking on the class 345s and they will be the priority. Willesden will also be preparing to take on the class 710s and wouldn't want a short term hire and maintain arrangement getting in the way of that. 4. We have no idea if the ROSCO is willing to give a reasonable lease cost for short term hires. Just because a type is being withdrawn on one route doesn't mean it's available for pennies to use elsewhere. 5. We don't know if class 315 is cleared for the route. If it isn't then there is a cost in doing that and possible clearance works. Unlikely to be money to cover this. 6. Even if Ilford depot could maintain the 315s there's unlikely to be the paths out of the depot and on to the GOBLIN. ECS working out of Ilford already cause problems on the GEML. No one would want to do something to make it worse and TfL Rail and Greater Anglia would almost certainly be required to object to any request for paths made to ORR. Making matters more complex on the GEML may also interfere with Network Rail's programme of Crossrail works along the GEML. I'm sure there are other issues I've missed. The user group would argue that all the above could be waved away with money but there isn't the money. They'd also argue it's farcical for the line to reopen with wires with diesel trains and they're probably right but going with a new design of trains was always going to involve a longer lead time than converting the infrastructure. However the option of using 315s is off the table and if they are simply going to keep moaning every single month then TfL will be even more p*issed off with them than they already seem to be.
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Post by T.R. on Dec 5, 2016 17:35:37 GMT
Erection of the OHLE poles/masts/gantries have gathered pace over the last few weeks. Harringay Green Lanes: Hornsey Road (Crouch Hill - Upper Holloway): Pardon the poor quality shots
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Post by snoggle on Dec 5, 2016 19:57:29 GMT
A couple of photos from Blackhorse Road today showing works under way on Access for All and the extent of electrification. Cranes were in evidence at both of the Lea crossings near Tottenham Hale. A concrete pour was also being done for mast foundations on the Ferry Lane stretch. I imagine the masts will be in place very shortly. www.flickr.com/photos/24759744@N02/30573040574/in/dateposted-public/www.flickr.com/photos/24759744@N02/31025450360/in/dateposted-public/The concrete mast bases on Ferry Lane are because the Vic Line tunnels are below ground so NR can't use their usual pile driving technique. Also there are mast foundations behind the platforms at Blackhorse Road - looks like a big cross catenary will be put in there. Network Rail are also going round bolting on height extenders on footbridges to provide additional clearance from the wires. Makes taking photos much more awkward though.
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Post by snoggle on Jan 30, 2017 20:19:53 GMT
Looks like 27 Feb for resumption of service. However there will be few if any wires in place. Based on a conversation on District Dave it seems there have been problems with the supply of steelwork for the electrification masts and spans. They should be mostly in place come reopening but wires will follow afterwards. No word yet about whether there have to be late start up / early closure / multiple weekend closures to allow NR to "catch up". If there are going to be multiple weekend closures I can't see that going down well at all and is likely to cause dreadful problems with other major weekend closures in East London. All a bit disappointing really after 9 months of no service on the east end of the route.
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Post by routew15 on Jan 30, 2017 22:39:19 GMT
Looks like 27 Feb for resumption of service. However there will be few if any wires in place. Based on a conversation on District Dave it seems there have been problems with the supply of steelwork for the electrification masts and spans. They should be mostly in place come reopening but wires will follow afterwards. No word yet about whether there have to be late start up / early closure / multiple weekend closures to allow NR to "catch up". If there are going to be multiple weekend closures I can't see that going down well at all and is likely to cause dreadful problems with other major weekend closures in East London. All a bit disappointing really after 9 months of no service on the east end of the route. I had seen mast in place on various parts of the line but it was quite patchy along sections i saw (Ferry Boat Inn - Leytonstone High Road). Guessing Network Rail had forgotten that they have some very large electrification projects still taking place that would require identical OLE. I think many passengers are going to be disappointed, whilst it was not promised upon completion of the 2016/17 works, a lot commuters are going to be expecting; electric trains, faster journeys and better station/platforms conditions, but none of this will be in place for a while to come.
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Post by snoggle on Jan 30, 2017 22:57:02 GMT
Looks like 27 Feb for resumption of service. However there will be few if any wires in place. Based on a conversation on District Dave it seems there have been problems with the supply of steelwork for the electrification masts and spans. They should be mostly in place come reopening but wires will follow afterwards. No word yet about whether there have to be late start up / early closure / multiple weekend closures to allow NR to "catch up". If there are going to be multiple weekend closures I can't see that going down well at all and is likely to cause dreadful problems with other major weekend closures in East London. All a bit disappointing really after 9 months of no service on the east end of the route. I had seen mast in place on various parts of the line but it was quite patchy along sections i saw (Ferry Boat Inn - Leytonstone High Road). Guessing Network Rail had forgotten that they have some very large electrification projects still taking place that would require identical OLE. I think many passengers are going to be disappointed, whilst it was not promised upon completion of the 2016/17 works, a lot commuters are going to be expecting; electric trains, faster journeys and better station/platforms conditions, but none of this will be in place for a while to come. I think once the "penny drops" there is going to be quite a negative reaction. The line's user group is very adept at channelling its questions and concerns via various Assembly Members and even Jeremy Corbyn (a long time supporter of electrification). As they have been expressing their concern over a "lack of progress" they will no doubt make hay when the line reopens and nothing obvious has been done. Unfortunately passengers don't notice track lowering, reballasting, new bridges, new track, better drainage etc. They're expecting longer, electric trains. NR won't even be changing line speeds upon reopening despite new bridges being in place that should entirely remove permanent speed restrictions. A review of line speeds is due later this year though. Looking at the NR GOBE Twitter a/c lots of people are asking when services restart. NR can't give a firm date as it's TfL's call to announce that. They have been emphasising that the old trains come back in late Feb not new electric ones. There is going to have to be some clever PR effort to counter what will probably be a negative public reaction and one which could reach the media pretty quickly if stoked up in the right way. I also expect questions to the Mayor in due course - especially if more weekend closures are needed.
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Post by romfordbuses on Jan 31, 2017 6:25:13 GMT
The wires were never planned to be finished during this closure, It was only about getting the civil work done in preperation for it.
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Post by snoggle on Jan 31, 2017 12:02:42 GMT
The wires were never planned to be finished during this closure, It was only about getting the civil work done in preperation for it. You may well have understood this from day one but I've not seen anything definitive that says that was the intent. Note I'm not questioning what you're saying just that the "purpose" of the blockade has never been made fully clear AFAICS. What's even odder is that NR's own local publicity notices said their wiring train would be running 24 hours a day from 12 Jan. That certainly led me to expect wires to be being strung now. Given that mast foundations were in place well before the blockade started last *June* it's odd that even in December some were not in place. I think I understood the wires might not have been energised by the time services recommenced but at least they would be there. I think I read something on another forum that NR was now in some difficulty with freight operators because the possession was due to finish on 4 Feb and operators were expecting trains to be rerouted. Given there are impending full weekend shutdowns on the Shenfield route that will now overlap with the GOBLIN this may cause further issues. There were rules agreed about what works could or could not overlap which was why the timing of the GOBLIN blockade was a "once off" event. It couldn't be done any later as it would heavily affect other works in East London.
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Post by snoggle on Feb 6, 2017 19:28:00 GMT
Had a spin to East Ham on the GOBLIN RRS today so also got a look at bits of the eastern end of the line. Also had a little wander near Queens Rd / Blackhorse Road. I'll add some photo links later when I've processed my photos. Photo links now added below in text. In short there is still quite a lot of work to do. On the viaduct sections east of Queens Road there are masts in a number of locations and these are typically a full two track span. One surprise is that the distance between masts is either longer than I envisaged *or* there are a lot of masts missing. Often there are masts not in place yet near road bridges - metal fixings are evident but the masts themselves are not. Furthermore I couldn't see masts installed on the platforms at Leyton Midland Road or Wanstead Park. Where masts are in place there is nothing else - no link wires or "dangly bits" (technical term there ) to suspend the wires at the correct height. Wanstead Park station appears to be having a partition installed at entrance level. It's an odd location as the steps down from the platforms effectively land on the pavement under a road bridge. TfL appear to be creating a delineation. I suspect they would like to put in gates but I can't see how they can do it in the tiny amount of space. At Woodgrange Park there was a lot of activity at platform level. Two new enclosures are being built at platform level which will certainly have ticket gates inside them. The local fare dodgers won't be happy. Coming back to E17 there was a lot of work ongoing at WW Queens Road. The new lowered platforms are in place with new nosing stones. It's not clear, from a distance, whether the platforms area is big enough for 4 cars - I hope it is. A lot of track has been relaid in this area with a mix of ballasted and slab track. Looking east from Queens Road itself there were a lot of masts in place. At Blackhorse Road the lift towers are now complete as are the plant rooms. The footbridge is evidently remaining as it has received height extenders to provide more clearance from the wires. However there is still no physical connection to the ticket hall. No sign either of any platform extension works. One mast has been installed in the platform area on the wb platform but there isn't one attached to the foundations created near the eb platform! I'm beginning to wonder if you're going to have to use a "tarzan swing" from the bridge to the ticket hall. A few more masts have been added to the eastLooking down Ferry Lane there are more masts in place but still not all of them! I know there are tunnels underneath but even so - 8 months of no trains and still not all the masts. I know everyone keeps saying "the blockade was not to string the wires" but you could have lopped months off this blockade and still achieved the same volume of work. And yes that's me agreeing with those who were very critical of the timescale months ago. I'm not really very impressed at the lack of "pace" being displayed.
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Post by snoggle on Feb 7, 2017 16:46:15 GMT
Network Rail are saying the line reopens on 27 February but further closures needed. Apparently the electrification was "incorrectly designed"!!!! Interesting that NR have broken the news and not TfL. I guess TfL want NR to "wash their dirty laundry in public" first. And more via Rail magazine. What a bloomin' mess.
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Post by enviroPB on Feb 8, 2017 13:26:33 GMT
Received a letter through my box today reaffirming that the Gospel Oak- Barking line would open in 'late February'. I hope National Rail knows that February is the shortest month of the year, and so doesn't leave them much time to wrap up engineering works on the line!
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Post by routew15 on Feb 8, 2017 17:51:09 GMT
The first set of closures after February are currently set to be Sunday 23 April. Is it right to expect closures sloted in before then?
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Post by snoggle on Feb 8, 2017 20:34:00 GMT
The first set of closures after February are currently set to be Sunday 23 April. Is it right to expect closures sloted in before then? The April closure is a cyclical part line, limited closure for track maintenance. NR have these "blocks" for regular inspection and maintenance on all routes. The additional closures or blockade to deal with the overdue electrification works have not been made public and may not even be identified with NR yet nor agreed with TfL. The implications for other works such as Crossrail are also not clear yet. I understand significant works are planned at Stratford which require freights to run via the GOBLIN. It will be interesting to see which project wins out in the battle of closures. I suspect it might be Crossrail where failure is not to be entertained.
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Post by T.R. on Feb 9, 2017 12:40:56 GMT
Some masts between Upper Holloway & Crouch Hill have gained registration arms(?). This is Hornsey Road, at the site of the former station:
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