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Post by snowman on Apr 3, 2019 16:40:17 GMT
I wonder if the western services will start on dates scheduled, but run into Paddington mainline.
Rolling stock could be the determinant. The Heathrow Express stock is due off lease this year (2 of the units are effectively gone already, loads of parts taken to keep others going, which is why often cant find unit for T4 shuttle)
There are requirements for the 165 and 166 in Bristol area, and 387s would be spread too thin once some take over HEX service. Only realistic option is to switch some of the stopping services to the 345s.
Not sure how many platforms at Paddington can take them (and some platforms are needed for mainline services), but 9 car trains are far too long for the area by the H&C platforms
I'm aware some mainline trains will only be half length, but how practical it would be to timetable them into the short platforms, I can't tell. The fast lines serve the low numbered platforms, so appears to need lot of track switching to do so. However in all my visits to Paddington (rare these days) I can't remember ever seeing all platforms occupied at same time.
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Post by snoggle on Apr 3, 2019 18:50:41 GMT
I wonder if the western services will start on dates scheduled, but run into Paddington mainline. Rolling stock could be the determinant. The Heathrow Express stock is due off lease this year (2 of the units are effectively gone already, loads of parts taken to keep others going, which is why often cant find unit for T4 shuttle) There are requirements for the 165 and 166 in Bristol area, and 387s would be spread too thin once some take over HEX service. Only realistic option is to switch some of the stopping services to the 345s. Not sure how many platforms at Paddington can take them (and some platforms are needed for mainline services), but 9 car trains are far too long for the area by the H&C platforms I'm aware some mainline trains will only be half length, but how practical it would be to timetable them into the short platforms, I can't tell. The fast lines serve the low numbered platforms, so appears to need lot of track switching to do so. However in all my visits to Paddington (rare these days) I can't remember ever seeing all platforms occupied at same time. AIUI the plan is that TfL *do* take over in December this year. The trains will run into the mainline and 345s will be used. A contract has either been issued or is imminent for a further series of platform extensions and installation of CCTV for 345 dispatch. Whether Network Rail can do all the work in barely 7 months remains to be seen - might be doable if all the design work has been done already. If design has not been done then it will be one heck of a race to get it done by December. You are quite right that rolling stock is a key factor as is abandonment of the HEX depot at Old Oak Common to allow HS2 construction work to proceed. A conversion contract for the 387s has been let and I understand the first unit is being done now. The other key factor is getting 345s into Heathrow and that depends on signalling software progress. I understand that in addition to getting ETCS to work in the Heathrow tunnels TPWS is also being fitted. Both of these replace the old BR-ATP system but ETCS would be the primary system. Happy to be corrected if others are aware of plans being different.
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Apr 3, 2019 19:02:43 GMT
I wonder if the western services will start on dates scheduled, but run into Paddington mainline. Rolling stock could be the determinant. The Heathrow Express stock is due off lease this year (2 of the units are effectively gone already, loads of parts taken to keep others going, which is why often cant find unit for T4 shuttle) There are requirements for the 165 and 166 in Bristol area, and 387s would be spread too thin once some take over HEX service. Only realistic option is to switch some of the stopping services to the 345s. Not sure how many platforms at Paddington can take them (and some platforms are needed for mainline services), but 9 car trains are far too long for the area by the H&C platforms I'm aware some mainline trains will only be half length, but how practical it would be to timetable them into the short platforms, I can't tell. The fast lines serve the low numbered platforms, so appears to need lot of track switching to do so. However in all my visits to Paddington (rare these days) I can't remember ever seeing all platforms occupied at same time. AIUI the plan is that TfL *do* take over in December this year. The trains will run into the mainline and 345s will be used. A contract has either been issued or is imminent for a further series of platform extensions and installation of CCTV for 345 dispatch. Whether Network Rail can do all the work in barely 7 months remains to be seen - might be doable if all the design work has been done already. If design has not been done then it will be one heck of a race to get it done by December. You are quite right that rolling stock is a key factor as is abandonment of the HEX depot at Old Oak Common to allow HS2 construction work to proceed. A conversion contract for the 387s has been let and I understand the first unit is being done now. The other key factor is getting 345s into Heathrow and that depends on signalling software progress. I understand that in addition to getting ETCS to work in the Heathrow tunnels TPWS is also being fitted. Both of these replace the old BR-ATP system but ETCS would be the primary system. Happy to be corrected if others are aware of plans being different. I would assume this would all take place on the 7th of December, signalled by the fact the 266 is suggested to be split on this date upon its new contract with RATP. I would also hazard a guess and say this is when a lot of the West London bus changes would also take place as they're more focussed on the increased service level of the GWML as opposed to Crossrail running into the core. Talking of platform extensions, is the stuff at Liverpool Street still going ahead this summer? I can't imagine how that will work at all with the whole service still running into LST high level as a lot of the services were meant to go into the core by the summer.
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Post by snoggle on Apr 3, 2019 20:05:54 GMT
I would assume this would all take place on the 7th of December, signalled by the fact the 266 is suggested to be split on this date upon its new contract with RATP. I would also hazard a guess and say this is when a lot of the West London bus changes would also take place as they're more focussed on the increased service level of the GWML as opposed to Crossrail running into the core. Talking of platform extensions, is the stuff at Liverpool Street still going ahead this summer? I can't imagine how that will work at all with the whole service still running into LST high level as a lot of the services were meant to go into the core by the summer. Err the Crossrail service in West London in Dec 19 won't be any greater than FGW run now. It would be foolhardy for TfL to rejig lots of bus routes on the assumption that a non existent high frequency train service will be running. It won't be. TfL are only taking over 2 tph off peak and 4 tph in the peaks. You need the core open to achieve the planned service levels that would justify ripping bus services to bits. The changes in Hammersmith, Chiswick and Acton are all nothing to do with Crossrail IMO. It's about achieving other objectives like reduced operational costs and dealing with chronic unreliability. TfL just lumped them under Crossrail consultation for convenience. Although not confirmed I don't believe the Liv St platform works are happening this year. Possibly delayed to next Summer or even later. Ideally you want Shenfield services running into the core before you try to do such major work. The alternative is Stratford in a state of collapse as trains would have to be turned there with the tube taking the strain - something it clearly cannot do given how full trains are in the peak. Even in the Summer holidays it could not cope with train after train of displaced Shenfield line commuters.
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Post by snoggle on Apr 12, 2019 19:21:57 GMT
The nearest to official confirmation that Crossrail will run Paddington to Reading from December 2019 that I've seen. Letter from Crossrail to leader of Windsor and Maidenhead Council (in attached tweet)
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Post by snowman on Apr 18, 2019 0:41:46 GMT
Elizabeth Line likely to be delayed untilf 2021, 3 potential seasons for opening depending on dynamic testing, earliest would be Spring 2020, latest Spring 2021 www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47967766
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Post by COBO on Apr 18, 2019 2:54:36 GMT
Elizabeth Line likely to be delayed untilf 2021, 3 potential seasons for opening depending on dynamic testing, earliest would be Spring 2020, latest Spring 2021 www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-47967766What will come first Brexit or the Elizabeth Line?
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Post by Deleted on Apr 18, 2019 5:54:36 GMT
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Post by rif153 on Apr 21, 2019 21:00:06 GMT
Is it true that platform 18 at Liverpool Street is to be closed once Crossrail is fully operational?
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Post by snoggle on Apr 21, 2019 23:06:21 GMT
Is it true that platform 18 at Liverpool Street is to be closed once Crossrail is fully operational? Yes because two other platforms (16 and 17 I think) have to be rejigged to allow 9 car class 345s to run into Liverpool St surface in the peaks. The platforms are too short on the eastern sie of Liv St for the full length 345s. There will be a 4 tph peak only direction service from Shenfield into Liverpool Street. 12 tph will go via the tunnel.
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Post by snowman on Apr 23, 2019 6:12:01 GMT
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Post by busman on Apr 23, 2019 10:11:47 GMT
Naturally Sadiq Khan will bat this away back to Crossrail as criticism of TfL must strike too close to home. Someone correct me if I’m wrong, but wouldn’t it have been TfL’s duty to do occasional document audits and physical engineering inspections to check that what Crossrail were reporting in emails and meetings was factually correct? Surely they had a responsibility to do at least that? I accept that Crossrail Ltd are ultimately accountable for delivery of the project, but TfL leadership cannot go without blame for this debacle.
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Post by snoggle on Apr 23, 2019 12:22:10 GMT
Naturally Sadiq Khan will bat this away back to Crossrail as criticism of TfL must strike too close to home. Someone correct me if I’m wrong, but wouldn’t it have been TfL’s duty to do occasional document audits and physical engineering inspections to check that what Crossrail were reporting in emails and meetings was factually correct? Surely they had a responsibility to do at least that? I accept that Crossrail Ltd are ultimately accountable for delivery of the project, but TfL leadership cannot go without blame for this debacle. The fundamental issue here is that the governance arrangements gave Crossrail an enormous amount of autonomy with the Sponsors kept at arms length (at best). The sponsors basically had no real right to do what you suggest in any formal way. If they were to do it informally then that would cause even more upset. Furthermore there was a complete failure to change the governance arrangements to reflect the start of the move out of construction into preparation for operations. On a large project like Crossrail it is essential to make such changes because the skills, pressures, risks etc do change considerably. I am not trying to make excuses here for anyone but there were real flaws in the basic control mechanisms for the project. We are now realing the whirlwind of those failings. I will also repeat that we are now in the start of the long campaign for the Mayoralty so it is inevitable that opposition Assembly politicians will be seeking to wreck the Mayor's position and discredit those who report to him. I do think Mike Brown was very ill advised to edit project progress information but he has to account for that. He is appearing in front of the Transport Cttee on Thursday 25th April so I am sure he will be challenged repeatedly on this and face multiple demands to resign. The politicians, in their usual pathetic way, smell blood and will be on the attack. The main problem for any Mayor is that there is no obvious successor to Mike Brown - so many possible replacements have been kicked out of TfL to save money or have retired or have opted to work in Australia. The only possible candidate is NYCTA President Andy Byford who has worked for LU before. He has the stature and experience for the post but it would mean him leaving New York with a job unfinished. However he is in conflict with his direct political master so he may opt to go if the TfL Commissioner post became vacant.
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Post by redbus on Apr 23, 2019 17:56:27 GMT
I have just heard the BBC local news and as I understand matters what the Commissioner was accused of in the London Assembly report was that warnings the project would not open on time were downplayed by the Commissioner.
In terms of replacement Commissioners I can think of a number of candidates (oddly all with bus backgrounds as I feel that is what is now needed!), but whether the Mayor would want them, or even if they were willing to do the job is another matter!!!!
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Post by snowman on Apr 23, 2019 18:13:42 GMT
I have just heard the BBC local news and as I understand matters what the Commissioner was accused of in the London Assembly report was that warnings the project would not open on time were downplayed by the Commissioner. In terms of replacement Commissioners I can think of a number of candidates (oddly all with bus backgrounds as I feel that is what is now needed!), but whether the Mayor would want them, or even if they were willing to do the job is another matter!!!! Report is here, even has examples of emails where he has deleted the warnings before they went to the mayor www.london.gov.uk/sites/default/files/final_-_london_assembly_transport_committee_crossrail_investigation_report_0.pdf
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