|
Post by redbus on Feb 24, 2019 19:05:01 GMT
Yes. The link from Mornington Crescent / Hampstead Rd to Gt Portland St / Portland Place / Oxford Circus is lost as a result of this change. One of the more retrograde aspects of this change if you ask me. Even in the dire days on the late 80s when routes were being cut LT still kept a 135 service over this link (when the 137 was split in two). To think they could have used the 159 to cover that link in conjunction with its cut back from Marble Arch to Oxford Circus, bearing in mind I'm not too fond of the 159 change in the first place. Ha!! To use the 159 to cover the link from Oxford Circus to Camden Town is going back in time, as up to 1947 when it was re-routed to West Hampstead, it used to have that routing to Camden Town. Anyway that was well before my time.
|
|
|
Post by busaholic on Feb 24, 2019 19:10:57 GMT
To think they could have used the 159 to cover that link in conjunction with its cut back from Marble Arch to Oxford Circus, bearing in mind I'm not too fond of the 159 change in the first place. Ha!! To use the 159 to cover the link from Oxford Circus to Camden Town is going back in time, as up to 1947 when it was re-routed to West Hampstead, it used to have that routing to Camden Town. Anyway that was well before my time. Even a little before mine.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Mar 4, 2019 12:07:12 GMT
I don't know if this has been highlighted before, but this is a TfL quote from their 2016 Business Development paper for Central London.
"Alternative option considered 5.2.28 The proposals reduce the length of route C2 significantly. Consideration was given to re-routeing the 88 via Albany Street and Parkway and extending it via the C2 routeing to Parliament Hill Fields, which would allow route C2 to be withdrawn. This would create significant savings and remove a route from Hampstead Road, which is likely to be adversely affected by HS2 from 2017. However route 88 currently has a PM peak cycle time of 185 minutes and the extension adds an additional 32 minutes, making route 88 too long to operate reliably and was therefore not progressed further."
|
|
|
Post by snoggle on Mar 4, 2019 12:44:02 GMT
I don't know if this has been highlighted before, but this is a TfL quote from their 2016 Business Development paper for Central London. "Alternative option considered 5.2.28 The proposals reduce the length of route C2 significantly. Consideration was given to re-routeing the 88 via Albany Street and Parkway and extending it via the C2 routeing to Parliament Hill Fields, which would allow route C2 to be withdrawn. This would create significant savings and remove a route from Hampstead Road, which is likely to be adversely affected by HS2 from 2017. However route 88 currently has a PM peak cycle time of 185 minutes and the extension adds an additional 32 minutes, making route 88 too long to operate reliably and was therefore not progressed further." And 2 years later TfL conveniently ignore this presumably because they've found a magical solution that ensures it will be splendidly reliable when merged in a few weeks time.
|
|
|
Post by vjaska on Mar 4, 2019 14:33:00 GMT
I don't know if this has been highlighted before, but this is a TfL quote from their 2016 Business Development paper for Central London. "Alternative option considered 5.2.28 The proposals reduce the length of route C2 significantly. Consideration was given to re-routeing the 88 via Albany Street and Parkway and extending it via the C2 routeing to Parliament Hill Fields, which would allow route C2 to be withdrawn. This would create significant savings and remove a route from Hampstead Road, which is likely to be adversely affected by HS2 from 2017. However route 88 currently has a PM peak cycle time of 185 minutes and the extension adds an additional 32 minutes, making route 88 too long to operate reliably and was therefore not progressed further." Which is something I said when the proposal first came about - very convenient from TfL!
|
|
|
Post by Eastlondoner62 on Mar 25, 2019 20:00:02 GMT
Had an e-mail earlier today regarding the changes
|
|
|
Post by busaholic on Mar 25, 2019 21:48:00 GMT
Had an e-mail earlier today regarding the changes For 'Hampstead routes' read 'Hampstead Road', presumably. I think this may also be a first for TfL in suggesting that inconvenienced (though they'd never put it thus) passengers in effect double back from Camden Town. Wow, so easy, why did no-one think of it before?
|
|
|
Post by vjaska on Mar 25, 2019 22:25:24 GMT
Had an e-mail earlier today regarding the changes Is it me or are TfL suggesting the journey time of the extended 88 will be the same as the current 88 because I'm sure if you extend something, it takes longer
|
|
|
Post by busaholic on Mar 25, 2019 23:10:02 GMT
Had an e-mail earlier today regarding the changes Is it me or are TfL suggesting the journey time of the extended 88 will be the same as the current 88 because I'm sure if you extend something, it takes longer I read it as journey times on the 88 would be exactly the same as on the C2, which is presumably correct.
|
|
|
Post by snoggle on Mar 25, 2019 23:30:58 GMT
Had an e-mail earlier today regarding the changes More "economical avec la verité" nonsense from TfL. The fast and convenient link from the south end of Camden Town, Mornington Crescent and Hampstead Road to Oxford Circus and Regent St is being removed without replacement. The so called interchange at Great Portland St is cumbersome at best and involves at least two separate pedestrian crossing phases going s/b and is much worse going n/b. In fact I'd so far as to say no one in the right mind would try and change from a 88 / 453 to a 27 in the Gt Portland St area given how awful crossing Euston Rd is at this point. It's this sort of thing that TfL just blithely ignore in their "hopper ticket" speak. It's bad enough if you're reasonably fit and have good eyesight and hearing but if you are slow on your feet, lacking in confidence or are mobility impaired then changing buses is not easy in locations like this. As a complete aside I was reading an article today about bus cuts in Gtr Manchester [1] and the problems with enforced interchange and long waits featured VERY heavily in the concerns listed in the article. Now London generally has an upside in that many services are frequent but all this enforced "change on street corners and walk down the road" stuff that TfL are forcing is deeply unpopular with a significant segment of bus users. [1] see also this Manc Evening News StoryNote also the rather pointed remarks from both Stagecoach and the Manchester operators group in both of the linked articles about what is happening in regulated London at the moment. They're using TfL's current plight as a defence against re-regulation in their area. For those who moan about consultation being unnecessary in London then look at what happens when lifeline services are removed with next to no formal notice and people just finding out by word of mouth.
|
|
|
Post by MetrolineGA1511 on Mar 30, 2019 7:24:30 GMT
It would have been a happy reminder of 1981-84 had route 3 been extended back to Parliament Hill, even if route 88 were then cut back to Trafalgar Square or Whitehall. It might also have been fairer for Abellio having just lost route C2 (although its tender was expiring anyway).
|
|
|
Post by southlondonbus on Mar 30, 2019 8:16:40 GMT
I think the 3 might have been slightly longer from Oxford Circus to Crystal Palace then to Clapham Common thou either way the route will be pretty long now.
|
|
|
Post by sid on Mar 30, 2019 12:01:27 GMT
I had a chat yesterday with a friendly driver on the C2, he's sorry to see it go as it's a nice little route but can't argue with the decision, he said passenger numbers are often in single digits. He said he has been telling his regulars about the change but a lot of people seem to be completely unaware. He's hoping to get on the 24 rota when Abellio get it.
|
|
|
Post by M1104 on Mar 30, 2019 15:18:22 GMT
It would have been a happy reminder of 1981-84 had route 3 been extended back to Parliament Hill, even if route 88 were then cut back to Trafalgar Square or Whitehall. It might also have been fairer for Abellio having just lost route C2 (although its tender was expiring anyway). Would have been ideal if the 159, which is due to be cut away from Oxford Street, was to be extended via Great Portland Street and Warren Street to Camden Town. That would then maintain the bus link lost by the rerouting of the 88 and on the fluke reduce the work reduction within abellio.
|
|
|
Post by paulsw2 on Mar 30, 2019 15:23:27 GMT
It would have been a happy reminder of 1981-84 had route 3 been extended back to Parliament Hill, even if route 88 were then cut back to Trafalgar Square or Whitehall. It might also have been fairer for Abellio having just lost route C2 (although its tender was expiring anyway). Would have been ideal if the 159, which is due to be cut away from Oxford Street, was to be extended via Great Portland Street and Warren Street to Camden Town. That would then maintain the bus link lost by the rerouting of the 88 and on the fluke reduce the work reduction within abellio. ironically the 159 used to run from Camden Town to Thornton Heath Clock Tower from 1934-1946
|
|