|
Post by jrussa on Dec 15, 2013 3:56:13 GMT
|
|
|
Post by IanF on Dec 15, 2013 8:29:57 GMT
I can see how it would be a good idea but if the tunnel has issues the service will suffer as it does now.
|
|
|
Post by DT 11 on Dec 15, 2013 8:42:50 GMT
I like the idea, since Stratford City opened I honestly thought it would be a better terminus for the 108 simply because it avoids delays in Stratford Centre. I think if it went to at Least Stratford International it would be a great thing.
I also think the 108 needs 12m Citaros. I think the DWLs and EDs are starting to get tired. I also think it needs more running time and a frequency increase in the Peaks to reduce curtailments from happening. The link from Lewisham to North Greenwich is very popular and what I find is that, Bexleyheath have 3 services to North Greenwich, Woolwich have 4 (486), Lewisham only have 1 which is single decker which cannot be helped.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 15, 2013 9:21:12 GMT
108 could do with splitting in two, Lewisham to Greenwich could use EH's, Greenwich to Stratford could use EB's
|
|
|
Post by TA1 on Dec 15, 2013 9:53:25 GMT
I like the idea, since Stratford City opened I honestly thought it would be a better terminus for the 108 simply because it avoids delays in Stratford Centre. I think if it went to at Least Stratford International it would be a great thing. I also think the 108 needs 12m Citaros. I think the DWLs and EDs are starting to get tired. I also think it needs more running time and a frequency increase in the Peaks to reduce curtailments from happening. The link from Lewisham to North Greenwich is very popular and what I find is that, Bexleyheath have 3 services to North Greenwich, Woolwich have 4 (486), Lewisham only have 1 which is single decker which cannot be helped. Just a few points to rebut in regards to your opinionated argument: Re: What delays occur at Stratford Centre particularly? - Heavy Loadings? If thats the case, of course that's bound to happen as you know the 108 isn't as frequent as the 25, For example Open Boarding would not speed up boarding times if it was implemented with newer buses upon tender renewal. Also, the 108 is the only bus link from East to South East from Stratford which is bound to cause heavy loadings. If the route is diverted via Stratford City, You must comprehend that the heavy loadings will move along with it, maybe not at first as passengers may not walk the distance to potential new stops but others will, if things are publicized enough and the general public pay attention. In reply to the current vehicles being tired, Some of the vehicles emit a variety of sounds mainly 'dodgy exhausts', which is bound to happen after a long period of vigorous service; Yes you often see/hear the 129's being double decked to allow the rest of NX's single decker routes to use SD's, mainly IMO would be down to preventing buses breaking down in the Tunnel, for normal car drivers 'running out of fuel' in the tunnel is a fineable offence. In my opinion, I feel that a frequency increase in the peaks could cause reliability to falter as how many weekday evenings do you hear about the A12/Blackwall Tunnel approach being clogged up or even closed due to a broken down car, pretty much nightly. I know for a fact, those factors cause buses to lose time, which in affect may effect driver time aswell. The curtailments are likely to implemented as you know to try and get the service back up time, if the route is very popular south of the river perhaps, extra DD's could be sourced running at a 20 mins frequency similar to the 108D. If for example, the running time is extended and their aren't any delays, buses will crawl along and people will complain, which is a normality.
|
|
|
Post by twobellstogo on Dec 15, 2013 9:56:23 GMT
The southern portion of the 108 really requires double deckers, and I'm afraid I'm unconvinced that a northern extension of the 108 will do anything other than make an already overcrowded and rather unreliable service (through no fault of GAL, I must add), even worse.
For me, I think, as a compromise, as the 108 can't take double decks through the tunnel, that I'd convert it to 12m Citaros and leave it at that.
|
|
|
Post by Mokujin on Dec 15, 2013 10:07:01 GMT
108 could do with splitting in two, Lewisham to Greenwich could use EH's, Greenwich to Stratford could use EB's Why should the Lewisham to North Greenwich section use DDs, then the North Greenwich to Stratford section use SDs? Surely the route should use 12m Citaros for the whole journey. And what is EBs?
|
|
|
Post by twobellstogo on Dec 15, 2013 10:12:36 GMT
108 could do with splitting in two, Lewisham to Greenwich could use EH's, Greenwich to Stratford could use EB's Why should the Lewisham to North Greenwich section use DDs, then the North Greenwich to Stratford section use DDs? Surely the route should use 12m Citaros for the whole journey. And what is EBs? I think EB is the class code for the forthcoming electric BYD single decks, ob1234
|
|
|
Post by Mokujin on Dec 15, 2013 10:13:54 GMT
I like the idea, It releases more space at Stratford Bus Station and gives a more extended link into Stratford City. IMO, the route needs a new timetable at least: Monday - Saturday every 8 minutes Sundays and evenings every 12 minutes with a PVR overall of 16 or 18 because I don't think 14 is enough for such an overcrowded route. The route should also get 12m Citaros as the route is begging for it and those DWLs aren't long enough for the route. Maybe for the start of the new contract in 2016, it should get MECs and the EDs could go back to BE for 646 and 648 (if retained).
|
|
|
Post by snoggle on Dec 15, 2013 11:30:20 GMT
I don't see the point really. It all depends on what you consider to be more important - serving the Olympic Park's doorstep or running to Stratford to afford reasonable connections to other transport and to serve the old Stratford town centre. I've got used to changing to the 97 at Stratford City from the tube but it's a heck of a drag if you want to change between bus stations. I have actually done the 97 to the 108 walking across the huge footbridge plus two escalators etc and it's not much fun. One advantage of the 108 running to the Bus Station is at night when interchange to other night routes is relatively straightforward. Having to schlep across the bridge at night would not be much fun.
As things are currently laid out there are no stops from Warton Road to Stratford City Bus Station on the D8 and 339 which means you ride past the Olympic Stadium and Acquatic Centre but don't stop! I fail to see the point of sending a bus via a route that doesn't serve the places the campaigners say they want it to go to. Perhaps when TfL gets round to adding several more stops in the Park when facilities re-open or new buildings are built then it might be worth considering?
The fundamental problem with Stratford's overall layout results partly from the gyratory which makes interchange from w/b to the railway station non terminating routes awkward. It also means some routes have to double back on themselves to serve the Broadway eastbound. The other issue is that there was a huge missed opportunity from the Olympic Park rebuild to provide a bus only road from Statford City to the bus station directly which would allow the 241 and 308 to serve the main bus station in both directions. Such a facility would make extending other terminating routes at Stratford simpler given the greatest volume of interchange is at the main bus station. The 241 hardly picks anyone up at Stratford City so its extension is pretty pointless IMO. I suspect rerouting the 108 would fall into the same category.
|
|
|
Post by vjaska on Dec 15, 2013 13:06:31 GMT
I'm against any extension of the 108 simply for reasons mentioned by others - the unreliability and overcrowding of the route. Like 'twobellstogo', at contract renewal, it should receive 12m Citaros and be left at that. Alternatively, 'tom99's idea could work but rather than split the route, run alternate buses alongside the 108 between Lewisham & North Greenwich.
|
|
|
Post by Steve09 on Dec 15, 2013 13:45:58 GMT
The 108 is a well established link from Lewisham, Blackheath and Greenwich to areas north of the Pond such as Stratford. I agree that an extension would probably suffer due to reliability issues on the route, thanks to the traffic prone areas it travels through, such as the Blackwall Tunnel.
|
|
|
Post by marlon101 on Dec 15, 2013 13:59:32 GMT
I think the case against has been well put by others. I don't think a close focus on the 108 is really the right outlet for transport issues between East and South-East London. It would be far more profitable to campaign to get the Thamesmead river crossing built and then take a look at the 108 along with the other bus route opportunities that arise.
|
|
|
Post by Mokujin on Dec 15, 2013 14:06:37 GMT
The 241 hardly picks anyone up at Stratford City so its extension is pretty pointless IMO. I suspect rerouting the 108 would fall into the same category. Although I don't use the 241 or go to Stratford that much, I would have to partly disagree on 241 not taking much passengers. I've seen a 241 at Stratford City take a fair amount of passengers which I assume maybe get off around the Plaistow area. Also yesterday, I saw a 241 at Stratford overcrowded. I think the extension would have an effect during the winter season as most people would want to shop at Westfield. But I have thought long and hard about the 108 and I've now seen that there's an advantage and disadvantage to it being extended. If the 108 was extended to Stratford City, most people would get off at Stratford Bus Station and walk along the footbridge as it leads you right into Westfield Shopping Centre so there wouldn't be a point of extending it. The same may go for the 241 aswell. But that's just my opinion of it.
|
|
|
Post by Mokujin on Dec 15, 2013 14:11:50 GMT
I think the case against has been well put by others. I don't think a close focus on the 108 is really the right outlet for transport issues between East and South-East London. It would be far more profitable to campaign to get the Thamesmead river crossing built and then take a look at the 108 along with the other bus route opportunities that arise. I agree, the Thamesmead-Beckton bridge would have been more profitable as it then can provide a South-East to North-East link alongside the Tower Bridge, Rotherhithe Tunnel, Blackwall Tunnel and Dartford Crossing which could also ease traffic along Blackwall Tunnel. I would think about B11 being extended to Beckton if that bridge was to ever be built!
|
|