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Post by snoggle on May 28, 2014 23:39:06 GMT
IMHO the 1 should run from Willesden Garage (as a terminus, not necessarily from AC itself) Wait, why Willesden? That's a random place to choose Look at the history of where the 1 and 176 used to run to (assuming you didn't know, of course!). Route 1Route 176
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Post by vjaska on May 29, 2014 0:10:26 GMT
A new one added to my local bus service manifesto: 57 - EXTEND NIGHT SERVICE TO BRIXTON Run from Atkins Road via Kings Road and Acre Lane. Clapham Park has no night service to Brixton despite it being the main local centre to the area, with connections during the day provided by the 45 and 355. A night extension of the 24-hour 57 would be an easy way to provide this and would be less disruptive than rerouting one of the Brixton Hill services to rub via Kings Road. Sorry to be pedantic but it's Kings Avenue rather than Kings Road.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2014 1:24:32 GMT
Anyone familiar with Rayners Lane, Northolt Park area?
Was wondering whether there might be some benefit in diverting the H9/10 away from Eastcote Lane to serve Carlyon and then Northolt Road, before picking up their former alignments.
The benefits would be better serving Earlsmead Stadium, and providing a nearer service to an area of housing. New links for the area around Rayners Lane to the Asda supermarket and station at Northold Park.
The drawbacks might be an extra minute or so per direction, and the need for the junction of Somerville Road and Northolt road to be reconfigured to allow buses a right turn.
Thoughts?
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Post by snoggle on May 29, 2014 8:12:06 GMT
Anyone familiar with Rayners Lane, Northolt Park area? Was wondering whether there might be some benefit in diverting the H9/10 away from Eastcote Lane to serve Carlyon and then Northolt Road, before picking up their former alignments. The benefits would be better serving Earlsmead Stadium, and providing a nearer service to an area of housing. New links for the area around Rayners Lane to the Asda supermarket and station at Northold Park. The drawbacks might be an extra minute or so per direction, and the need for the junction of Somerville Road and Northolt road to be reconfigured to allow buses a right turn. Thoughts? I'm not familiar with the H9/H10 so I don't know what traffic there is on the section that would lose buses. The dreaded "broken links / journeys" factor always has to be considered as TfL would measure that and calculate the disbenefit as well as the ability of say the 114 to take any displaced traffic (for trips from Harrow town centre). Having done the obligatory Streetview look my immediate reaction is that there are a lot of parked cars on relatively narrow streets even though the houses have drives. The other issue would be stop locations given all the driveways and grass verges. That sort of territory is always difficult to site stops in because no one wants their driveway blocked! It looks relatively promising territory provided you could get the buses through safely.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2014 9:47:57 GMT
For the night service, create a new N355, similar to the regular 355, but with a different terminus at the southern end of the route; Wimbledon or New Malden... What is the demand or need for an N355? The 57 is timetabled to take 43 minutes at night, so an extension of around ten minutes to an half-hourly service should be far cheaper than adding a whole new route. Sorry to be pedantic but it's Kings Avenue rather than Kings Road. No problem, thanks for pointing it out. Would be quite a detour otherwise!
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2014 21:05:11 GMT
Someone came up with the idea of linking Harrow and Ealing. Dont think it was in this thread though. It involved, iirc, the 226 getting a large extension and rerouting.
This made me wonder if there might be a simpler (read: cheaper, easier, less resource heavy) way of doing it. Think I might have something now, and its only a round the corner extension too. Though obviously it has drawbacks which are probably terminal.
The E11 has a PVR of 5, is 8km long and takes 23-39mins to do its journey between Greenford Red Lion and Ealing Warwick Dean. The 395 has a PVR of 4, is 9km long and takes 24-37mins to travel between Westway Cross Retail Park in Greenford and Harrow Bus station. They both use single deckers, though the E11 uses shorter ones. Both have very similar P/E/S frequencies of ~20/30/30 mins.
The missing section between them is Greenford Red Lion to Greenford Station, which seems in peaks according to timetables to take the E6, 105 and 92 about 11mins. Onwards to Westway Cross is another 2 mins. Harrow=Warwick Dean according to google is 20km following the line of routes and double running to Westway Cross. And from the timetables the longest journey time would be 39min+2+11+37=89mins, or 1 hour 29 (call it 90). Which is fairly long for a london bus route.
90*2=180mins round time (exc. standing) 180/9=20
So without any stand time youd have a 20min frequency.
The average peak frequency of the two routes is every 21mins. 180/21=8.58 PVR - the difference between 8.58 and 9 works out as the possible stand time, 9*21 is new total round trip inc stand time =189, minus actual journey time = 9 mins total stand time, or 4.5 mins each end. Too little.
The 395 runs every 22mins in peak. Using this interval over the whole new route you'd end up with 18mins total stand time, or 9 mins each end.
The other way of decreasing round journey time would be to peg the Ealing Broadway-Warwick Dean section onto another route, or possibly run non stop between Red Lion and Westway Cross. I don't though though this would save much time because of traffic.
So in summary, not an unqualified sucess. The main aim of linking Harrow and Ealing is achieved but in such a long and convluted manner that no-one would likely undertake it. Would result in a less frequent E11 to the tune of 2mins. Links Greenford Station and Ealing Broadway, but so does the Ealing shuttle for now. On the plus side, doesnt use any extra buses, and has small scope for improvement.
So... there you go :/
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Post by COBO on Jun 6, 2014 21:52:30 GMT
Someone came up with the idea of linking Harrow and Ealing. Dont think it was in this thread though. It involved, iirc, the 226 getting a large extension and rerouting. This made me wonder if there might be a simpler (read: cheaper, easier, less resource heavy) way of doing it. Think I might have something now, and its only a round the corner extension too. Though obviously it has drawbacks which are probably terminal. The E11 has a PVR of 5, is 8km long and takes 23-39mins to do its journey between Greenford Red Lion and Ealing Warwick Dean. The 395 has a PVR of 4, is 9km long and takes 24-37mins to travel between Westway Cross Retail Park in Greenford and Harrow Bus station. They both use single deckers, though the E11 uses shorter ones. Both have very similar P/E/S frequencies of ~20/30/30 mins. The missing section between them is Greenford Red Lion to Greenford Station, which seems in peaks according to timetables to take the E6, 105 and 92 about 11mins. Onwards to Westway Cross is another 2 mins. Harrow=Warwick Dean according to google is 20km following the line of routes and double running to Westway Cross. And from the timetables the longest journey time would be 39min+2+11+37=89mins, or 1 hour 29 (call it 90). Which is fairly long for a london bus route. 90*2=180mins round time (exc. standing) 180/9=20 So without any stand time youd have a 20min frequency. The average peak frequency of the two routes is every 21mins. 180/21=8.58 PVR - the difference between 8.58 and 9 works out as the possible stand time, 9*21 is new total round trip inc stand time =189, minus actual journey time = 9 mins total stand time, or 4.5 mins each end. Too little. The 395 runs every 22mins in peak. Using this interval over the whole new route you'd end up with 18mins total stand time, or 9 mins each end. The other way of decreasing round journey time would be to peg the Ealing Broadway-Warwick Dean section onto another route, or possibly run non stop between Red Lion and Westway Cross. I don't though though this would save much time because of traffic. So in summary, not an unqualified sucess. The main aim of linking Harrow and Ealing is achieved but in such a long and convluted manner that no-one would likely undertake it. Would result in a less frequent E11 to the tune of 2mins. Links Greenford Station and Ealing Broadway, but so does the Ealing shuttle for now. On the plus side, doesnt use any extra buses, and has small scope for improvement. So... there you go :/ With this routing wouldn't the 395 be demoted to 8.9m single deckers? What about extending the E1?
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Post by Deleted on Jun 7, 2014 4:15:43 GMT
My point was to try to do it without increasing the PVR, nor decreasing the frequency noticably.
Though the E1's route is far more direct than the E11, look at its frequency and vehicle type.
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Post by bigbaddom1981 on Jul 8, 2014 16:44:08 GMT
My suggestions W3 extend from Northumberland Park via Angel Road and to Lea Valley Leisure Complex 102 rerouted from Silver Street via Montagu Road, Bounces Road, and Hertford Road to create extra support/capacity over existing routes and provide a night service to previously unserved areas 76 to Tottenham Hale Huh?
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Post by vjaska on Jul 8, 2014 17:33:28 GMT
I think 'nad' agrees with your proposal.
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Post by bigbaddom1981 on Jul 8, 2014 17:45:21 GMT
I think 'nad' agrees with your proposal. Maybe!
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2014 18:32:54 GMT
Route D7 extended from All Saints to Canning Town via East India Dock Road, giving a missing bus link from Canary Wharf and Cubitt Town to Canning Town. Although to avoid the banned right turn from Bazely Street to East India Dock Road it may need to be diverted via Cotton Street. Another alternative would be to extend the 277 on from Leamouth to Canning Town. I agree with Hassan in that the 277 should be extended to canning town or you could extend the 69 to canary wharf as they are both 24 hour routes so they would provide more efficient links in the day and night.
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2014 18:47:55 GMT
There are many proposals I have in mind but some are just theoretical I realise that there are some issues with these extensions:
325 to gallions reach 58 to beckton W14/108/262/8/205 to stratford city W11 rerouted to serve chingford morrisons and 397 D8 to leyton asda (more than 10 minutes) 69 to london city airport 330 to canary wharf or the 277 to canning town
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Post by Deleted on Jul 9, 2014 19:36:07 GMT
There are many proposals I have in mind but some are just theoretical I realise that there are some issues with these extensions: 325 to gallions reach 58 to beckton W14/108/262/8/205 to stratford city W11 rerouted to serve chingford morrisons and 397 D8 to leyton asda (more than 10 minutes) 69 to london city airport 330 to canary wharf or the 277 to canning town 69 used to run to London City Airport until the DLR extension opened. There would be little demand now, also the 474 covers the former 69 section. Also would the 58 serve any purpose? it would duplicate the 101 /300 between beckton and East Ham (assuming you mean via High St South) 277 - This comes up a lot - I really do agree Canning Town makes more sense than Leamouth + it opens up new links for Canning Town
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Post by jrussa on Jul 10, 2014 13:11:56 GMT
There are many proposals I have in mind but some are just theoretical I realise that there are some issues with these extensions: 325 to gallions reach 58 to beckton W14/108/262/8/205 to stratford city W11 rerouted to serve chingford morrisons and 397 D8 to leyton asda (more than 10 minutes) 69 to london city airport 330 to canary wharf or the 277 to canning town I agree with the following ideas: Route W14 and 277. If Route 277 was to be extended to Canning Town, I think it would reduce the argument for Route 330 to extend!
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