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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Jul 12, 2017 21:53:27 GMT
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Post by snoggle on Jul 12, 2017 23:11:12 GMT
Havering is a very strangely controlled council. This "motion" is led by one of the UKIP councillors. Many other councillors are from local residents groups from different areas within Havering. This issue popped up on Twitter the other day. I suggested that a) all TfL bus services turned at the borough boundary or were else withdrawn. Loads of new turning circles and stands would be built at the border. b) that Stagecoach could run expensive, commercial bus services from North Street garage but only in Havering and to Essex. No cross boundary routes permitted - you'd have to get off and change buses. c) to give the fully authentic effect a wall would need to be built with checkpoints on the railway lines at Chadwell Heath and Dagenham East with all LU, TfL Rail, Greater Anglia and C2C trains forced to stop, all passengers to disembark and go through checkpoints. Just like East Germany of old. I travelled to Berlin by rail when the wall was still extant and I've been through the border crossings in Berlin itself so I know what this was like and how starkly different things were. One of the resident association councillors "liked" my Tweets.  At least they saw the ludicrous humour of it. Some local people are far from impressed with the posturing going on with the UKIP councillor who proposed this nonsense. They feel it's a last gasp for attention before they lose all their seats in next year's local elections. Havering is never going to be a Labour area but at least some people can recognise there is benefit from being part of Greater London. Someone else said the Freedom Pass, Oyster Card and 60+ pass would also have to be withdrawn from Havering too. Personally if they want to "secede" from Greater London then "ta ra" but they should immediately lose every single aspect of being covered by London wide services like the Met Police, LFB, London NHS, TfL etc etc on day one. Their fares can shoot up and their buses can become as appalling as they are in Essex. No "picking and choosing" allowed.  |
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Post by TNL33036 on Jul 13, 2017 0:53:14 GMT
Does this mean that FirstGroup would attempt to try and gain a foothold around the Romford area if that actually happened I wonder?....
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Post by vjaska on Jul 13, 2017 1:49:12 GMT
Havering is a very strangely controlled council. This "motion" is led by one of the UKIP councillors. Many other councillors are from local residents groups from different areas within Havering. This issue popped up on Twitter the other day. I suggested that a) all TfL bus services turned at the borough boundary or were else withdrawn. Loads of new turning circles and stands would be built at the border. b) that Stagecoach could run expensive, commercial bus services from North Street garage but only in Havering and to Essex. No cross boundary routes permitted - you'd have to get off and change buses. c) to give the fully authentic effect a wall would need to be built with checkpoints on the railway lines at Chadwell Heath and Dagenham East with all LU, TfL Rail, Greater Anglia and C2C trains forced to stop, all passengers to disembark and go through checkpoints. Just like East Germany of old. I travelled to Berlin by rail when the wall was still extant and I've been through the border crossings in Berlin itself so I know what this was like and how starkly different things were. One of the resident association councillors "liked" my Tweets. At least they saw the ludicrous humour of it. Some local people are far from impressed with the posturing going on with the UKIP councillor who proposed this nonsense. They feel it's a last gasp for attention before they lose all their seats in next year's local elections. Havering is never going to be a Labour area but at least some people can recognise there is benefit from being part of Greater London. Someone else said the Freedom Pass, Oyster Card and 60+ pass would also have to be withdrawn from Havering too. Personally if they want to "secede" from Greater London then "ta ra" but they should immediately lose every single aspect of being covered by London wide services like the Met Police, LFB, London NHS, TfL etc etc on day one. Their fares can shoot up and their buses can become as appalling as they are in Essex. No "picking and choosing" allowed. Entirely agree with all the above - as the saying goes, "The grass isn't always greener on the other side" so cheerio to your decent public transport & other services and hello to mountains of cuts and black holes  |
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Post by mondraker275 on Jul 13, 2017 9:59:28 GMT
Dubbed 'Hexit'...  Where is the need for shorthands? Where is the imagination? Who's the person dubbing? Hillingdon are probably panicking around for a shorthand now that Hexit is taken. Would not be surprised if Ealing come out with eexit with two e's demonstrating the lack of any imagination. Anyway the government is working towards giving local authorities more power over themselves i.e. increased devolution, and also giving them more of their income to themselves. So Havering should sit back and not make things worse for themselves. Could you imagine that the edge of the london map would be trimmed off. It would be dubbed the great 'shavering' of 21st century London. I could not help myself. Sorry. |
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Jul 13, 2017 12:10:13 GMT
If they do end up leaving the GLA, just give it a year before they want to be a part of it again  All this short termist views aren't helping. Both the local MPs Andrew Rosindell and Jon Cruddas seem to have differing opinions. Labour's Jon Cruddas wants to remain in the GLA while Tory Andrew Rosindell wants to leave the GLA. |
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Post by vjaska on Jul 13, 2017 13:16:26 GMT
If they do end up leaving the GLA, just give it a year before they want to be a part of it again All this short termist views aren't helping. Both the local MPs Andrew Rosindell and Jon Cruddas seem to have differing opinions. Labour's Jon Cruddas wants to remain in the GLA while Tory Andrew Rosindell wants to leave the GLA. But that's the thing - who in their right mind would want to leave the GLA? The amount of perks you get from being in the GLA outweighs anything else. If anything, I'm surprised there aren't any non GLA councils wanting to join it. Saying that, we still have people in outer London boroughs like Bromley & Croydon referring to their location as Bromley & Kent not to mention people in Havering as part of Essex when they haven't been for donkeys. |
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Post by snoggle on Jul 13, 2017 14:40:12 GMT
If they do end up leaving the GLA, just give it a year before they want to be a part of it again All this short termist views aren't helping. Both the local MPs Andrew Rosindell and Jon Cruddas seem to have differing opinions. Labour's Jon Cruddas wants to remain in the GLA while Tory Andrew Rosindell wants to leave the GLA. If they leave I want to hand Mr Rosindell the letter cancelling the 375 bus and then I will be driven along the route in a loudspeaker car saying "ha ha goodbye 375 bus you voted to lose it".   (Yes, I know I'm pathetic [1] and I don't care)  [1] before anyone else says it. |
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Post by vjaska on Jul 13, 2017 14:50:01 GMT
If they do end up leaving the GLA, just give it a year before they want to be a part of it again All this short termist views aren't helping. Both the local MPs Andrew Rosindell and Jon Cruddas seem to have differing opinions. Labour's Jon Cruddas wants to remain in the GLA while Tory Andrew Rosindell wants to leave the GLA. If they leave I want to hand Mr Rosindell the letter cancelling the 375 bus and then I will be driven along the route in a loudspeaker car saying "ha ha goodbye 375 bus you voted to lose it". (Yes, I know I'm pathetic [1] and I don't care) [1] before anyone else says it. Pathetic or not, I'd love to see that lool. |
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Post by john on Jul 14, 2017 20:56:17 GMT
If they do end up leaving the GLA, just give it a year before they want to be a part of it again All this short termist views aren't helping. Both the local MPs Andrew Rosindell and Jon Cruddas seem to have differing opinions. Labour's Jon Cruddas wants to remain in the GLA while Tory Andrew Rosindell wants to leave the GLA. But that's the thing - who in their right mind would want to leave the GLA? The amount of perks you get from being in the GLA outweighs anything else. If anything, I'm surprised there aren't any non GLA councils wanting to join it. Saying that, we still have people in outer London boroughs like Bromley & Croydon referring to their location as Bromley & Kent not to mention people in Havering as part of Essex when they haven't been for donkeys. I had so many arguments about Romford being in London but nooooo, it's Essex.....idiots Anyway, I'm born and bred Romford. Moved to Thurrock about 5 years ago and have to say, Havering are morons. Always knew it but have noticed it even more. It's one of the most racist, single/simple minded boroughs I've ever known. I read this somewhere else and knew it was Havering before reading it. Tbh, it won't happen, it's just big mouths spouting off in the area as usual. |
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Post by Alex on Jul 14, 2017 21:19:27 GMT
I had so many arguments about Romford being in London but nooooo, it's Essex.....idiots Anyway, I'm born and bred Romford. Moved to Thurrock about 5 years ago and have to say, Havering are morons. Always knew it but have noticed it even more. It's one of the most racist, single/simple minded boroughs I've ever known. I read this somewhere else and knew it was Havering before reading it. Tbh, it won't happen, it's just big mouths spouting off in the area as usual. I'm glad you posted that one John, it confirms my fears of the area, there seems to be a lot of angry people there! I moved down the road (Chadwell Heath) last year and got that impression with Havering, but wondered if was just my imagination. To be honest I never go further away from London to do anything, if we shop or eat out local we (wife and I) head towards Ilford/Gants Hill/Seven Kings - only been to Romford once. It didn't seem very welcoming. Have to admit, Redbridge is a nice borough (or seems) and I can recommend the borough of Greenwich very highly. The missus is born and bought up in Newham which seems a place of it's own  And no, I don't get the 'county' thing either, I've heard loads of them, 'Morden in Surrey', 'Richmond in Surrey', in addition to the 'Bromley Kent' and 'Romford Essex' ones mentioned. As far as I'm concerned, if it's in a London borough - it's in London. No arguments!!!  |
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Post by vjaska on Jul 14, 2017 23:11:53 GMT
I had so many arguments about Romford being in London but nooooo, it's Essex.....idiots Anyway, I'm born and bred Romford. Moved to Thurrock about 5 years ago and have to say, Havering are morons. Always knew it but have noticed it even more. It's one of the most racist, single/simple minded boroughs I've ever known. I read this somewhere else and knew it was Havering before reading it. Tbh, it won't happen, it's just big mouths spouting off in the area as usual. I'm glad you posted that one John, it confirms my fears of the area, there seems to be a lot of angry people there! I moved down the road (Chadwell Heath) last year and got that impression with Havering, but wondered if was just my imagination. To be honest I never go further away from London to do anything, if we shop or eat out local we (wife and I) head towards Ilford/Gants Hill/Seven Kings - only been to Romford once. It didn't seem very welcoming. Have to admit, Redbridge is a nice borough (or seems) and I can recommend the borough of Greenwich very highly. The missus is born and bought up in Newham which seems a place of it's own And no, I don't get the 'county' thing either, I've heard loads of them, 'Morden in Surrey', 'Richmond in Surrey', in addition to the 'Bromley Kent' and 'Romford Essex' ones mentioned. As far as I'm concerned, if it's in a London borough - it's in London. No arguments!!! Newham is a strange one - to me, the northern part is similar to where Croydon & Thornton Heath are situated in South London where Stratford is the 'Croydon' of Newham but with arguably better transport and amenities and is surrounded by multiple 'Thornton Heath' areas that look dreadful. The southern section on the other hand is a different animal entirely due to all the regeneration work that took place over the last 30 odd years. The county thing really does pee me off - I mean if we're using history as some sort of excuse to include a county in our address, then maybe I should start adding 'Surrey' into my address given Brixton was once a part of Surrey a few centuries ago |
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PaulH
Conductor
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Post by PaulH on Jul 14, 2017 23:42:40 GMT
I'm glad you posted that one John, it confirms my fears of the area, there seems to be a lot of angry people there! I moved down the road (Chadwell Heath) last year and got that impression with Havering, but wondered if was just my imagination. To be honest I never go further away from London to do anything, if we shop or eat out local we (wife and I) head towards Ilford/Gants Hill/Seven Kings - only been to Romford once. It didn't seem very welcoming. Have to admit, Redbridge is a nice borough (or seems) and I can recommend the borough of Greenwich very highly. The missus is born and bought up in Newham which seems a place of it's own And no, I don't get the 'county' thing either, I've heard loads of them, 'Morden in Surrey', 'Richmond in Surrey', in addition to the 'Bromley Kent' and 'Romford Essex' ones mentioned. As far as I'm concerned, if it's in a London borough - it's in London. No arguments!!! Newham is a strange one - to me, the northern part is similar to where Croydon & Thornton Heath are situated in South London where Stratford is the 'Croydon' of Newham but with arguably better transport and amenities and is surrounded by multiple 'Thornton Heath' areas that look dreadful. The southern section on the other hand is a different animal entirely due to all the regeneration work that took place over the last 30 odd years. The county thing really does pee me off - I mean if we're using history as some sort of excuse to include a county in our address, then maybe I should start adding 'Surrey' into my address given Brixton was once a part of Surrey a few centuries ago The problem is/was the Royal Mail, who, despite these places becoming part of Greater London in 1965 continued to use 'Postal Counties' in their Postcode Address File database until 1996. The postal counties of the United Kingdom, now known officially as the former postal counties, were postal subdivisions in routine use by Royal Mail until 1996. The raison d'être of the postal county – as opposed to any other kind of county – was to aid the sorting of mail by enabling differentiation between like-sounding post towns. Since 1996 this has been done by using the outward code (first half) of the postcode instead. For operational reasons the former postal counties, although broadly based on the counties of the United Kingdom, did not match up to their boundaries, in some cases with significant differences. The Royal Mail adopted some, but not all, of the local government reforms of 1965 and 1974/5 and this caused postal counties in some areas to reflect boundary changes, while in other areas they did not. Although the Royal Mail did not follow the changes of the London Government Act 1963 with respect to the outer London suburbs, it did reflect the move of Potters Bar from Middlesex to Hertfordshire. In contrast, Middlesex remained part of the postal address for Staines and Sunbury, which had transferred to Surrey. Retaining the existing postal county boundaries was explained as largely due to cost reasons. The Times pointed out that this might cause confusion, noting that in future "children will no doubt wonder why their address should refer to a county in which they have never lived", but that "some people […] want the name of Middlesex preserved because of its historical associations". |
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Post by Alex on Jul 15, 2017 15:35:14 GMT
Big thanks to PaulH there as I never realised the Post Office thing and it makes perfect sense why people still have the ideas they have on certain areas , also vjaska I would agree Newham is aesthetically similar to Croydon - I have spent a lot of time in the latter as well (I still play in the Thornton Heath & District darts league and was at my 'home' pub last Saturday). Newham and Croydon are definitely both areas where you need to keep your wits about you Fascinating stuff, this forum has a lot of interesting topics in addition to the obligatory buses |
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Post by RandomBusesGirl on Jul 15, 2017 19:13:16 GMT
Saying that, we still have people in outer London boroughs like Bromley & Croydon referring to their location as Bromley & Kent not to mention people in Havering as part of Essex when they haven't been for donkeys. Oh yes, as a foreigner both to the country and the city this always baffled me. I recently heard one of my coworkers say "Newbury Park, Essex". 🤔 Best ones though are "Edgware/Stanmore/Harrow/Hounslow, Middlesex" - y'all, it doesn't exist since 1965!!! 😂 Move with the times This whole thing just shows Havering want to hit new lows after plastering everywhere in their borough with Leave posters, and not removing them for months and months… Should be charged with littering… 😴 |
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Where is the need for shorthands? Where is the imagination? Who's the person dubbing? Hillingdon are probably panicking around for a shorthand now that Hexit is taken. Would not be surprised if Ealing come out with eexit with two e's demonstrating the lack of any imagination. 
All this short termist views aren't helping. Both the local MPs Andrew Rosindell and Jon Cruddas seem to have differing opinions. Labour's Jon Cruddas wants to remain in the GLA while Tory Andrew Rosindell wants to leave the GLA.
