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Post by greg on Aug 6, 2020 12:25:44 GMT
@greg I'm wondering why you think tfl will cut anything at the moment. Isn't public transport supposed to be accessible for all? Not going to lie I feel as if Geoff Hobbs is influencing these major decisions and I'm wondering if he's capitalist because I certainly can't imagine a labour Mayor being capitalist. It’s always supposed to be accessible, I only do think TFL will be cutting things because of their financial situation, not that they’re doing it for fun, but realistic thinking you realise they will have to in the upcoming/near future. They have lost a lot of money and need to save to keep them alive.
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Post by greg on Aug 6, 2020 12:30:01 GMT
There's too common an assumption on here that just because two routes used to be one that we should go back to then - its important to remember that these routes weren't split up for no reason. Also time after time I see people proposing merging routes with different frequencies which doesn't make sense at all - just because a 6bph service on Sundays is needed for the 274 doesn't mean you'll need the same service level on the 74 too. It's also worth bearing in mind that it might have been a good idea splitting these routes nearly 30 years ago, and the 74 was rerouted to Kings Cross then but it doesn't necessarily mean it's the best use of resources now. Returning the 74 to Camden Town shouldn't be a problem, the frequencies are virtually the same, or an obvious alternative would be just to curtail the 74 at Marble Arch and leave the 274 as it is. 74 to Camden is a good idea, however don’t think the 74 would work purely because it is too frequent for the areas past London Central Mosque. I always thought about this before too. Would curtail the 2 instead to Marble Arch only because you have the frequent 13 already to Victoria (Wilton Street) whereas the 74 is the only route to Kensington etc from Baker Street alongside the 27, which has a much longer routing though.
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Post by rif153 on Aug 6, 2020 12:53:59 GMT
The proposal wasn't to return the 74 to Camden Town but to simply merge the 74 & 274 together which is two different things altogether. My proposal is to extend the 74 to Camden Town with changes to the 274. Could you explain what changes you plan to make to the 274?
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Post by rif153 on Aug 6, 2020 13:17:03 GMT
It's also worth bearing in mind that it might have been a good idea splitting these routes nearly 30 years ago, and the 74 was rerouted to Kings Cross then but it doesn't necessarily mean it's the best use of resources now. Returning the 74 to Camden Town shouldn't be a problem, the frequencies are virtually the same, or an obvious alternative would be just to curtail the 74 at Marble Arch and leave the 274 as it is. 74 to Camden is a good idea, however don’t think the 74 would work purely because it is too frequent for the areas past London Central Mosque. I always thought about this before too. Would curtail the 2 instead to Marble Arch only because you have the frequent 13 already to Victoria (Wilton Street) whereas the 74 is the only route to Kensington etc from Baker Street alongside the 27, which has a much longer routing though. I wouldn't be at all surprised if TfL reviewed Park Lane as a corridor and looked to make changes. I could see the 74 fitting into part of a wider package of changes with the 414/430 which both seem vulnerable to withdrawal. The 6/414 could also be vulnerable to changes if TfL deem that there's no need for both between Maida Hill and Hyde Park Corner, the 6's patronage has plummeted since the rerouting. From my experience the 36 is the busiest route down Park Lane and could do with some support, cutting back the 436 was a disastrous move as the situation before then was fine. Others are more qualified to talk about the 2 than me but what I would say is that the route is that Marble Arch is a terrible terminus and cutting the 137 back there has lead to a slump in patronage so cutting the 2 back may well have similar consequences with people finding alternative means of travel.
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Post by vjaska on Aug 6, 2020 13:34:53 GMT
The proposal wasn't to return the 74 to Camden Town but to simply merge the 74 & 274 together which is two different things altogether. My proposal is to extend the 74 to Camden Town with changes to the 274. As your not local, what is this based on exactly?
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Post by vjaska on Aug 6, 2020 13:37:09 GMT
It's also worth bearing in mind that it might have been a good idea splitting these routes nearly 30 years ago, and the 74 was rerouted to Kings Cross then but it doesn't necessarily mean it's the best use of resources now. Returning the 74 to Camden Town shouldn't be a problem, the frequencies are virtually the same, or an obvious alternative would be just to curtail the 74 at Marble Arch and leave the 274 as it is. 74 to Camden is a good idea, however don’t think the 74 would work purely because it is too frequent for the areas past London Central Mosque. I always thought about this before too. Would curtail the 2 instead to Marble Arch only because you have the frequent 13 already to Victoria (Wilton Street) whereas the 74 is the only route to Kensington etc from Baker Street alongside the 27, which has a much longer routing though. The 2 provides the only link south of Victoria and generally gets good loadings so I wouldn't be happy about this being curtailed.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 6, 2020 13:49:32 GMT
My proposal is to extend the 74 to Camden Town with changes to the 274. As your not local, what is this based on exactly? Exactly! Too many arm chair experts making suggestions based on casual observations, no one here can really observer a route 7 days a week 247 so would rather its left to the people who have the proper data. Sure some want change just so they can observer something new!
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Post by greenboy on Aug 6, 2020 13:58:44 GMT
My proposal is to extend the 74 to Camden Town with changes to the 274. Could you explain what changes you plan to make to the 274? I posted earlier in the thread, I've copied it below...... quote author=" aaron1" source="/post/586940/thread" timestamp="1596652963"] There have been talks of buses being replaced down Portman Square but you need to realise it's not a long corridor as is with Park Lane. Park Lane is a very good route for buses terminating at Victoria or like the 36 & 148, avoiding Central London. I don't know how busy the 74 gets, I could see that be a contender as with the 274, the 74 whenever I see though does seem to be fairly busy to Baker Street Station & Oxford Street however so I think the 274 would be a great option. The 94 talks are irking me, even if the 94 gets cut to Marble Arch/North Row I still think there would still be demand on the western side of the route to justify an extension with the 440 extended to Acton Green from TGC, and the 94 either extended to TGC or Chiswick Business Park via the old 440 routing in Bollo Lane. I could see the 274 going with it cut to Portman Square or Marble Arch and maybe the 148 may sustain a cut to Notting Hill with the 94 kept in a reliable form from Picadilly Circus - Acton Green/Chiswick Business Park. For the one way to get rid of 274 it and keep the links is to merge with the 74 I don't think a Putney to Camden Town or Islington Angel can work but it worth a try [/quote] Yes extend the 74 back to Camden Town and reroute the 274 via the 31 route to Maida Hill with a loop working eastbound to serve Camden High Street. As a result the 31 could be reduced slightly to every 12 minutes. Cross Camden link from Maida Hill to Islington and increases the busy Camden Town to Kilburn section of the 31 to 10bph.
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Post by greenboy on Aug 6, 2020 13:59:33 GMT
My proposal is to extend the 74 to Camden Town with changes to the 274. As your not local, what is this based on exactly? Local to what??
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Post by greenboy on Aug 6, 2020 14:04:45 GMT
It's also worth bearing in mind that it might have been a good idea splitting these routes nearly 30 years ago, and the 74 was rerouted to Kings Cross then but it doesn't necessarily mean it's the best use of resources now. Returning the 74 to Camden Town shouldn't be a problem, the frequencies are virtually the same, or an obvious alternative would be just to curtail the 74 at Marble Arch and leave the 274 as it is. 74 to Camden is a good idea, however don’t think the 74 would work purely because it is too frequent for the areas past London Central Mosque. I always thought about this before too. Would curtail the 2 instead to Marble Arch only because you have the frequent 13 already to Victoria (Wilton Street) whereas the 74 is the only route to Kensington etc from Baker Street alongside the 27, which has a much longer routing though. The 74 and 274 are roughly the same frequency now. I would rather merge the 74 and 274 than cut the 2 or 74 back to Marble Arch which I think is likely to happen otherwise.
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Post by vjaska on Aug 6, 2020 14:30:29 GMT
As your not local, what is this based on exactly? Local to what?? Let's not play dum here
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Post by george on Aug 6, 2020 15:18:04 GMT
74 to Camden is a good idea, however don’t think the 74 would work purely because it is too frequent for the areas past London Central Mosque. I always thought about this before too. Would curtail the 2 instead to Marble Arch only because you have the frequent 13 already to Victoria (Wilton Street) whereas the 74 is the only route to Kensington etc from Baker Street alongside the 27, which has a much longer routing though. The 74 and 274 are roughly the same frequency now. I would rather merge the 74 and 274 than cut the 2 or 74 back to Marble Arch which I think is likely to happen otherwise. I don't think merging the 74 and 274 is that good of an idea if I'm going to be honest. The 74 takes ages in rush hour and merging it won't be helpful. I don't have an experience of using the 274 but when in London I would 80% of the time choose a 14 or 22 over the 74 to get to Putney as they are much quicker.
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Post by greenboy on Aug 6, 2020 15:31:22 GMT
Let's not play dum here I'm not even gonna ask...........
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Post by greg on Aug 6, 2020 15:32:08 GMT
no need for everyone to be attacking each other, none of us are experts and we all have our own opinions. theres no need for all this fighting back. if you don’t agree, you don’t and if you do, you do.
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Post by greenboy on Aug 6, 2020 15:35:38 GMT
The 74 and 274 are roughly the same frequency now. I would rather merge the 74 and 274 than cut the 2 or 74 back to Marble Arch which I think is likely to happen otherwise. I don't think merging the 74 and 274 is that good of an idea if I'm going to be honest. The 74 takes ages in rush hour and merging it won't be helpful. I don't have an experience of using the 274 but when in London I would 80% of the time choose a 14 or 22 over the 74 to get to Putney as they are much quicker. The 14 and 22 are definitely quicker between Central London and Putney although I don't quite see what that has got to do with extending the 74 to Camden Town? Anyway if it's not viable the only other way I can see of reducing the number of buses between Oxford Street and Baker Street is cut the 2 and/or 74 to Marble Arch and the 189 and/or the 274 to Baker Street Station.
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