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Post by ServerKing on Sept 23, 2023 6:48:24 GMT
Nothing wrong with those DW's I actually like the 2 series ones the best, They remind me of the Stagecoach euro3 TA's very nice and punchy and has some serious torque with kickdown. As an enthusiast , I’m beginning to realise how bland the EVs are and find them quite boring. They are smooth and comfortable , and stylish yes. But I miss the engines. I’m reminded what I really liked about the first types of buses i traveled on (LSs , SNBs , Ms) - and it was the sound and smell of the engines and how different the buses were. M199 (FW) was a heap always breaking down & had a proper throaty engine rattling away. M194 & M189 however , only a few builds away from each other , were superb and hummed . I could tell blindfolded which was which. Good for environment (provided they don’t burn and provided the batteries & all parts are recycled ) , but give me T7 / T11 / T38 any day of the week over an EV It's just the way things evolve and progress, I guess. I used to love the Brush traction motors on Greater Anglia's trains, especially with jointed track (such as the Thorpe le Soken to Walton line), but all that's gone now the 321's were binned. The whine of an electric bus doesn't compare to thrash from a DW but it will be nice not to be on a bus with that horrid Volvo i-shift box  Perhaps a few Electroliners will escape onto the 123 in time and we can see what they can do  |
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Post by LD71YLO (BE37054) on Sept 23, 2023 7:01:39 GMT
This news is not unexpected and has been a source of lots of speculation here. You would have thought they might have tried to retain the 175 from GY.
Purely from an enthusiast perspective it makes east London very dull. I guess there is a small possibility of Arriva gaining the SL2 from EC.
Indeed, I would have thought Arriva could still bid the 175 from GY at least, though we would see if that is the case, I wouldn't be surprised if the 150 ends up at Stagecoach from BK or Go-Ahead from RR. Would GY have the space if they retained the 66/103/370? |
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Post by billa on Sept 23, 2023 8:55:48 GMT
didn't Expect new electric buses for 243 that's great new looks like HVs 243s and 242s might go to GY or DX replace them horrible DWs Nothing wrong with those DW's I actually like the 2 series ones the best, They remind me of the Stagecoach euro3 TA's very nice and punchy and has some serious torque with kickdown. Agree with that. I dont know what they did with the later series DW's the performance seemed to be subbed quite a bit, the 20X buses you would think are entirely different vehicles at times. Dont know if its down to fuel or gearbox mapping or something else |
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Post by Busboy105 on Sept 23, 2023 9:46:46 GMT
Indeed, I would have thought Arriva could still bid the 175 from GY at least, though we would see if that is the case, I wouldn't be surprised if the 150 ends up at Stagecoach from BK or Go-Ahead from RR. Would GY have the space if they retained the 66/103/370? If they have all of them right now ,I don't see why not |
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Post by DE20106 on Sept 23, 2023 9:57:19 GMT
This news is not unexpected and has been a source of lots of speculation here. You would have thought they might have tried to retain the 175 from GY.
Purely from an enthusiast perspective it makes east London very dull. I guess there is a small possibility of Arriva gaining the SL2 from EC.
I think the writing was on the wall with the continued lack of potential work coming in, I imagine RR setting up down the road could be what ended up causing it. I can imagine a lot of drivers will not be very happy if this is true but I think Arriva do need to be applauded for keeping the garage going until the route's tender. I'm sure they could have sold up instead otherwise. I don't think East London will be much duller without them, GY should still be present in the Romford area and Stagecoach and Go Ahead will probably ensure between themselves that no tender in the area is predictable. Wouldn't be surprised to see the 175 heading to Stagecoach and the 150 to Go Ahead, should be enough space at RR for the 150 and enough space at RM for the 175. Stagecoach started it with the 128 and 173 tenders, Go Ahead continued with the 368 and 325 tenders, the final blow could be a split between the two. I do think the 175 will be back at Stagecoach, they will want that route back. It was one of NS’s longest serving routes before passing over to Arriva |
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Post by DE20106 on Sept 23, 2023 10:00:20 GMT
Nothing wrong with those DW's I actually like the 2 series ones the best, They remind me of the Stagecoach euro3 TA's very nice and punchy and has some serious torque with kickdown. As an enthusiast , I’m beginning to realise how bland the EVs are and find them quite boring. They are smooth and comfortable , and stylish yes. But I miss the engines. I’m reminded what I really liked about the first types of buses i traveled on (LSs , SNBs , Ms) - and it was the sound and smell of the engines and how different the buses were. M199 (FW) was a heap always breaking down & had a proper throaty engine rattling away. M194 & M189 however , only a few builds away from each other , were superb and hummed . I could tell blindfolded which was which. Good for environment (provided they don’t burn and provided the batteries & all parts are recycled ) , but give me T7 / T11 / T38 any day of the week over an EV As a passenger though, I cannot stress enough how amazing those high spec EVs are in hot weather!! Very much needed when we do occasionally get weather like that, will trade that for an engine noise any day |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Sept 23, 2023 10:45:53 GMT
As an enthusiast , I’m beginning to realise how bland the EVs are and find them quite boring. They are smooth and comfortable , and stylish yes. But I miss the engines. I’m reminded what I really liked about the first types of buses i traveled on (LSs , SNBs , Ms) - and it was the sound and smell of the engines and how different the buses were. M199 (FW) was a heap always breaking down & had a proper throaty engine rattling away. M194 & M189 however , only a few builds away from each other , were superb and hummed . I could tell blindfolded which was which. Good for environment (provided they don’t burn and provided the batteries & all parts are recycled ) , but give me T7 / T11 / T38 any day of the week over an EV As a passenger though, I cannot stress enough how amazing those high spec EVs are in hot weather!! Very much needed when we do occasionally get weather like that, will trade that for an engine noise any day The buses on the 174 in the recent hot weather was nice, upperdeck cooling was very effective. Some of the 248 LT's also seemed to have been re-gassed, I don't know if it was part of the refurb package, but in the hot weather it was pumping cool air. Compared to non refurb ones on the 5 and EL3 which were roastmasters. |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Sept 23, 2023 10:46:33 GMT
Indeed, I would have thought Arriva could still bid the 175 from GY at least, though we would see if that is the case, I wouldn't be surprised if the 150 ends up at Stagecoach from BK or Go-Ahead from RR. Would GY have the space if they retained the 66/103/370? No they would not |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Sept 23, 2023 10:48:48 GMT
Nothing wrong with those DW's I actually like the 2 series ones the best, They remind me of the Stagecoach euro3 TA's very nice and punchy and has some serious torque with kickdown. Agree with that. I dont know what they did with the later series DW's the performance seemed to be subbed quite a bit, the 20X buses you would think are entirely different vehicles at times. Dont know if its down to fuel or gearbox mapping or something else Different mapping, changed for fuel economy. They have the exact same engines though. Exhaust system is slightly different as well. Although there is nothing stopping another operator changing it back to the spec of the 200 series. |
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Post by ServerKing on Sept 23, 2023 16:04:36 GMT
Agree with that. I dont know what they did with the later series DW's the performance seemed to be subbed quite a bit, the 20X buses you would think are entirely different vehicles at times. Dont know if its down to fuel or gearbox mapping or something else Different mapping, changed for fuel economy. They have the exact same engines though. Exhaust system is slightly different as well. Although there is nothing stopping another operator changing it back to the spec of the 200 series. I stumbled across a video of DW487 on rail replacement work, and it was a beast! www.youtube.com/watch?v=4tkrwxSfZGo - this is a regular on the 144, sometimes it just needs the right driver I've even been on DW335 and 537 being thrashed on the 123 and both performed well, despite a 3 year age difference between the two. Now the 123 is a 24 hour route, which got a 2 year extension with the same buses, I think they're good enough for now (although interiors are looking tired, such as the grab poles). Look how well the DLAs did when they left London, some on punishing NSL country lanes in the Northeast, others are still plying their trade in The Shires and down in Kent |
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Post by yunus on Sept 23, 2023 21:18:21 GMT
Nothing wrong with those DW's I actually like the 2 series ones the best, They remind me of the Stagecoach euro3 TA's very nice and punchy and has some serious torque with kickdown. As an enthusiast , I’m beginning to realise how bland the EVs are and find them quite boring. They are smooth and comfortable , and stylish yes. But I miss the engines. I’m reminded what I really liked about the first types of buses i traveled on (LSs , SNBs , Ms) - and it was the sound and smell of the engines and how different the buses were. M199 (FW) was a heap always breaking down & had a proper throaty engine rattling away. M194 & M189 however , only a few builds away from each other , were superb and hummed . I could tell blindfolded which was which. Good for environment (provided they don’t burn and provided the batteries & all parts are recycled ) , but give me T7 / T11 / T38 any day of the week over an EV Welcome to my world lol. The reason that I am into buses is cos of the Diesels that I have grew up with mainly being TAs, TNLs, VLAs etc. Not too say I still love new MMCs as long as it is Diesel. Tbf with me it is mainly my principal of what I feel strongly about that we do not need Battery buses e.g Hybrid/Electric which also pollute and have emissions in other ways (have said this many times). Sadly the old buses have and are disappearing from London rapidly hence why I go out a bit when have free time. I suggest taking a trip to Surrey around Guildford where Stagecoach TAs still run. |
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Post by cardinal on Sept 23, 2023 21:35:12 GMT
As an enthusiast , I’m beginning to realise how bland the EVs are and find them quite boring. They are smooth and comfortable , and stylish yes. But I miss the engines. I’m reminded what I really liked about the first types of buses i traveled on (LSs , SNBs , Ms) - and it was the sound and smell of the engines and how different the buses were. M199 (FW) was a heap always breaking down & had a proper throaty engine rattling away. M194 & M189 however , only a few builds away from each other , were superb and hummed . I could tell blindfolded which was which. Good for environment (provided they don’t burn and provided the batteries & all parts are recycled ) , but give me T7 / T11 / T38 any day of the week over an EV Welcome to my world lol. The reason that I am into buses is cos of the Diesels that I have grew up with mainly being TAs, TNLs, VLAs etc. Not too say I still love new MMCs as long as it is Diesel. Tbf with me it is mainly my principal of what I feel strongly about that we do not need Battery buses e.g Hybrid/Electric which also pollute and have emissions in other ways (have said this many times). Sadly the old buses have and are disappearing from London rapidly hence why I go out a bit when have free time. I suggest taking a trip to Surrey around Guildford where Stagecoach TAs still run. I go outside London now more than in. Lots of variety, currently relatively cheap . Lovely scenery. And ex London buses galore. Perfect. |
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Post by ThinLizzy on Sept 23, 2023 21:43:27 GMT
As an enthusiast , I’m beginning to realise how bland the EVs are and find them quite boring. They are smooth and comfortable , and stylish yes. But I miss the engines. I’m reminded what I really liked about the first types of buses i traveled on (LSs , SNBs , Ms) - and it was the sound and smell of the engines and how different the buses were. M199 (FW) was a heap always breaking down & had a proper throaty engine rattling away. M194 & M189 however , only a few builds away from each other , were superb and hummed . I could tell blindfolded which was which. Good for environment (provided they don’t burn and provided the batteries & all parts are recycled ) , but give me T7 / T11 / T38 any day of the week over an EV Welcome to my world lol. The reason that I am into buses is cos of the Diesels that I have grew up with mainly being TAs, TNLs, VLAs etc. Not too say I still love new MMCs as long as it is Diesel. Tbf with me it is mainly my principal of what I feel strongly about that we do not need Battery buses e.g Hybrid/Electric which also pollute and have emissions in other ways (have said this many times). Sadly the old buses have and are disappearing from London rapidly hence why I go out a bit when have free time. I suggest taking a trip to Surrey around Guildford where Stagecoach TAs still run. To be honest, I absolutely love the electrics. I can remember getting on one on the 174 for the first time being really impressed with the bright airy interior and how smooth they are, almost as nice as a diesel MMC. Likewise, the new E200EVs on the 366 are fantastic. I'm also really looking forward to the electrics starting on the 86 as it's my local route. I grew up with mostly Ts (Titans) and the variety Grey Green used to send out on the 173 and 179 (will be sad to see DX go if it closes,) and what Ensign/Capital Citybus would send out on anything, but I'd much rather something modern like an electric |
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Post by yunus on Sept 23, 2023 21:51:06 GMT
Welcome to my world lol. The reason that I am into buses is cos of the Diesels that I have grew up with mainly being TAs, TNLs, VLAs etc. Not too say I still love new MMCs as long as it is Diesel. Tbf with me it is mainly my principal of what I feel strongly about that we do not need Battery buses e.g Hybrid/Electric which also pollute and have emissions in other ways (have said this many times). Sadly the old buses have and are disappearing from London rapidly hence why I go out a bit when have free time. I suggest taking a trip to Surrey around Guildford where Stagecoach TAs still run. I go outside London now more than in. Lots of variety, currently relatively cheap . Lovely scenery. And ex London buses galore. Perfect. As Hybrids and Electrics continue taking over Diesels, I for sure plan to continue travelling more frequently outside of London. I have totally given up with Central London these days. As there are no Diesels in/around Oxford Circus / City of London it just totally bores me out. If I do need to travel into the City normally go for the train. |
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Post by yunus on Sept 23, 2023 21:54:06 GMT
Welcome to my world lol. The reason that I am into buses is cos of the Diesels that I have grew up with mainly being TAs, TNLs, VLAs etc. Not too say I still love new MMCs as long as it is Diesel. Tbf with me it is mainly my principal of what I feel strongly about that we do not need Battery buses e.g Hybrid/Electric which also pollute and have emissions in other ways (have said this many times). Sadly the old buses have and are disappearing from London rapidly hence why I go out a bit when have free time. I suggest taking a trip to Surrey around Guildford where Stagecoach TAs still run. To be honest, I absolutely love the electrics. I can remember getting on one on the 174 for the first time being really impressed with the bright airy interior and how smooth they are, almost as nice as a diesel MMC. Likewise, the new E200EVs on the 366 are fantastic. I'm also really looking forward to the electrics starting on the 86 as it's my local route. I grew up with mostly Ts (Titans) and the variety Grey Green used to send out on the 173 and 179 (will be sad to see DX go if it closes,) and what Ensign/Capital Citybus would send out on anything, but I'd much rather something modern like an electric I totally respect and understand. At the end of the day this is our hobby so each to their own opinion. I do like the style and design of Hybrids and Electrics but again it is the topic that I and many others (not just enthusiasts) feel strongly about. Honestly dread to think how they will progress once the batteries are exhausted. As we see now Hybrid/Electric buses have none or very limited use outside of the TFL network. |
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Perhaps a few Electroliners will escape onto the 123 in time and we can see what they can do 
