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Post by vjaska on Nov 10, 2021 23:39:53 GMT
If there were concerns regarding overcrowding on the 390 then here goes: Route 73: Extended to Victoria via current Route 390. This was vastly more popular into Islington than the 390 is into York Way/Torriano Estate. Route 390: Withdrawn between Oxford Circus but revised to run every 5 minutes during the AM & PM peak (if the residential section is where demand is). Thoughts? As far as I'm aware there haven't been any overcrowding issues. I see the 390 regularly along the full length of Oxford Street and its not exactly rammed. It become more frequent between Kings X and Archway then pre 2017 and it still have the 73 from Oxo to help I was on Shaftesbury Avenue and Piccadilly tonight between 5.30 and 6ish I guess and I have to say I was quite shocked by how empty the 38s are now. I know people on here never want to acknowledge it but I genuinely was shocked by just how many I saw in either direction with little more then a handful on each, some probably with 3 people. 19s similar aswell if running behind a 38. Also on Piccadilly in the direction of Russell Square literally empty 14s in convoy which admittedly against the flow at that time but even heading away from the town the 14s and 22s were light is best to describe it. Half the seats maybe taken upstairs and some downstairs but no standing. Hard to belive in the original Routemaster days, which did hold less I know, but would be heaving at these times back to Victoria, Putney etc. Really quite a surprise and either shows quite how bad the decline is and what a mountain to get some back or how work from home really has taken hold. Sad really. What it shows is what happens when you cut buses back, they simply decline even further but it won't stop people suggesting more on here? |
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Post by YX10FFN on Nov 10, 2021 23:50:48 GMT
As far as I'm aware there haven't been any overcrowding issues. I see the 390 regularly along the full length of Oxford Street and its not exactly rammed. It become more frequent between Kings X and Archway then pre 2017 and it still have the 73 from Oxo to help What it shows is what happens when you cut buses back, they simply decline even further but it won't stop people suggesting more on here? They should've started some sort of branding scheme or better information/publicity when they first identified the issues and started cutting things back in the late 2010s, if they were really interested in reviving Central London bus traffic. Routes like the 11, 15, 23 (before cutback), 24, 38, 168 would've been perfect as iconic cross-Central London trunk routes to show off and make more attractive to advertise not just buses but London itself. Instead they gave up, thought the decline was terminal and didn't bother trying to get passengers back. This 63 scheme is great and all but on the other hand they're continuing to cut Central London services left right and centre. |
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Post by capitalomnibus on Nov 11, 2021 0:59:44 GMT
If there were concerns regarding overcrowding on the 390 then here goes: Route 73: Extended to Victoria via current Route 390. This was vastly more popular into Islington than the 390 is into York Way/Torriano Estate. Route 390: Withdrawn between Oxford Circus but revised to run every 5 minutes during the AM & PM peak (if the residential section is where demand is). Thoughts? As far as I'm aware there haven't been any overcrowding issues. I see the 390 regularly along the full length of Oxford Street and its not exactly rammed. It become more frequent between Kings X and Archway then pre 2017 and it still have the 73 from Oxo to help I was on Shaftesbury Avenue and Piccadilly tonight between 5.30 and 6ish I guess and I have to say I was quite shocked by how empty the 38s are now. I know people on here never want to acknowledge it but I genuinely was shocked by just how many I saw in either direction with little more then a handful on each, some probably with 3 people. 19s similar aswell if running behind a 38. Also on Piccadilly in the direction of Russell Square literally empty 14s in convoy which admittedly against the flow at that time but even heading away from the town the 14s and 22s were light is best to describe it. Half the seats maybe taken upstairs and some downstairs but no standing. Hard to belive in the original Routemaster days, which did hold less I know, but would be heaving at these times back to Victoria, Putney etc. Really quite a surprise and either shows quite how bad the decline is and what a mountain to get some back or how work from home really has taken hold. Sad really. The 38's was very busy before. Combination of reduced frequency, faffing around with constant diversions between Holborn and Victoria. Whether it be roadworks, protests, demo's, events etc. It really has taken its toll on the route. Plus all the never ending roadworks and temporary traffic lights. The section between Green Park and Victoria is still busy. Pre-pandemic, some buses were full to leaving passengers behind. |
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Post by greenboy on Nov 11, 2021 6:32:26 GMT
As far as I'm aware there haven't been any overcrowding issues. I see the 390 regularly along the full length of Oxford Street and its not exactly rammed. It become more frequent between Kings X and Archway then pre 2017 and it still have the 73 from Oxo to help I was on Shaftesbury Avenue and Piccadilly tonight between 5.30 and 6ish I guess and I have to say I was quite shocked by how empty the 38s are now. I know people on here never want to acknowledge it but I genuinely was shocked by just how many I saw in either direction with little more then a handful on each, some probably with 3 people. 19s similar aswell if running behind a 38. Also on Piccadilly in the direction of Russell Square literally empty 14s in convoy which admittedly against the flow at that time but even heading away from the town the 14s and 22s were light is best to describe it. Half the seats maybe taken upstairs and some downstairs but no standing. Hard to belive in the original Routemaster days, which did hold less I know, but would be heaving at these times back to Victoria, Putney etc. Really quite a surprise and either shows quite how bad the decline is and what a mountain to get some back or how work from home really has taken hold. Sad really. The 38's was very busy before. Combination of reduced frequency, faffing around with constant diversions between Holborn and Victoria. Whether it be roadworks, protests, demo's, events etc. It really has taken its toll on the route. Plus all the never ending roadworks and temporary traffic lights. The section between Green Park and Victoria is still busy. Pre-pandemic, some buses were full to leaving passengers behind. I remember in Routemaster days the 38 had peak hour short workings between Victoria and Piccadilly Circus but commuting levels are well down since those days. Before the frequency reductions it wasn't unusual to see convoys of buses with barely a handful of passengers between them, probably a more appropriate level of service now. |
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Post by greenboy on Nov 11, 2021 6:37:22 GMT
What it shows is what happens when you cut buses back, they simply decline even further but it won't stop people suggesting more on here? They should've started some sort of branding scheme or better information/publicity when they first identified the issues and started cutting things back in the late 2010s, if they were really interested in reviving Central London bus traffic. Routes like the 11, 15, 23 (before cutback), 24, 38, 168 would've been perfect as iconic cross-Central London trunk routes to show off and make more attractive to advertise not just buses but London itself. Instead they gave up, thought the decline was terminal and didn't bother trying to get passengers back. This 63 scheme is great and all but on the other hand they're continuing to cut Central London services left right and centre. Exactly that, TfL have done nothing to market or promote bus travel. What's happening on the 63 is certainly a step in the right direction but there's a long way to go. |
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Post by abellion on Nov 11, 2021 6:38:31 GMT
If there were concerns regarding overcrowding on the 390 then here goes: Route 73: Extended to Victoria via current Route 390. This was vastly more popular into Islington than the 390 is into York Way/Torriano Estate. Route 390: Withdrawn between Oxford Circus but revised to run every 5 minutes during the AM & PM peak (if the residential section is where demand is). Thoughts? I was on Shaftesbury Avenue and Piccadilly tonight between 5.30 and 6ish I guess and I have to say I was quite shocked by how empty the 38s are now. I know people on here never want to acknowledge it but I genuinely was shocked by just how many I saw in either direction with little more then a handful on each, some probably with 3 people. 19s similar aswell if running behind a 38. There are so many instances where I have to wait forever for a bus and seven empty 38s come in that time, it is odd to think that one of the most iconic routes is just carrying air through the City |
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Post by LondonNorthern on Nov 11, 2021 7:00:19 GMT
If there were concerns regarding overcrowding on the 390 then here goes: Route 73: Extended to Victoria via current Route 390. This was vastly more popular into Islington than the 390 is into York Way/Torriano Estate. Route 390: Withdrawn between Oxford Circus but revised to run every 5 minutes during the AM & PM peak (if the residential section is where demand is). Thoughts? As far as I'm aware there haven't been any overcrowding issues. I see the 390 regularly along the full length of Oxford Street and its not exactly rammed. It become more frequent between Kings X and Archway then pre 2017 and it still have the 73 from Oxo to help I was on Shaftesbury Avenue and Piccadilly tonight between 5.30 and 6ish I guess and I have to say I was quite shocked by how empty the 38s are now. I know people on here never want to acknowledge it but I genuinely was shocked by just how many I saw in either direction with little more then a handful on each, some probably with 3 people. 19s similar aswell if running behind a 38. Also on Piccadilly in the direction of Russell Square literally empty 14s in convoy which admittedly against the flow at that time but even heading away from the town the 14s and 22s were light is best to describe it. Half the seats maybe taken upstairs and some downstairs but no standing. Hard to belive in the original Routemaster days, which did hold less I know, but would be heaving at these times back to Victoria, Putney etc. Really quite a surprise and either shows quite how bad the decline is and what a mountain to get some back or how work from home really has taken hold. Sad really. That was what a member here said and that was why I said "if there were concerns about overcrowding" so the northern section would receive more capacity.
The 73 was more popular than the 390 down to Victoria which is why it should've never been removed.
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Post by greenboy on Nov 11, 2021 7:08:27 GMT
If there were concerns regarding overcrowding on the 390 then here goes: Route 73: Extended to Victoria via current Route 390. This was vastly more popular into Islington than the 390 is into York Way/Torriano Estate. Route 390: Withdrawn between Oxford Circus but revised to run every 5 minutes during the AM & PM peak (if the residential section is where demand is). Thoughts? I thought the 73 should never have been removed from Victoria and the 390 curtailed at Oxford Circus but not much chance of it being changed back now. |
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Post by LondonNorthern on Nov 11, 2021 7:27:26 GMT
If there were concerns regarding overcrowding on the 390 then here goes: Route 73: Extended to Victoria via current Route 390. This was vastly more popular into Islington than the 390 is into York Way/Torriano Estate. Route 390: Withdrawn between Oxford Circus but revised to run every 5 minutes during the AM & PM peak (if the residential section is where demand is). Thoughts? I thought the 73 should never have been removed from Victoria and the 390 curtailed at Oxford Circus but not much chance of it being changed back now. If you'd have asked me in the 2000s what should've happened I might've even have gone as far as to have suggested a 41 extension to Tottenham Court Road/Oxford Circus over the 390 with the 390 completely discontinued. 0 chance of that happening today as to how much traffic both the 41/390 encounter and the excessive running time the 41 has on it's back. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2021 10:04:34 GMT
Changes in the Uxbridge area:
U1 - withdrawn, replaced by U3
U3 - extended to Ruislip via U1. Frequency of the new route to be the U3's current frequency, resulting in a slight frequency increase on the Uxbridge-Ruislip section which I feel is needed.
U2 - rerouted between Long Lane/Uxbridge Road and Hillingdon Hospital via Uxbridge Road and Royal Lane. Withdrawn between Brunel University and Hillingdon Hospital and extended to West Drayton via U5. To give Royal Lane a bus route. Lees Road will have no routes but it's only a small section and there are stops within walking distance. Although Hillingdon loses its link to Brunel University, the walk is max 10 minutes from Royal Lane, and I feel the demand from Brunel would be to Uxbridge, not Hillingdon. This also gives the Hillingdon Hospital - West Drayton link an extra bus per hour Mon-Sat via the U5's routing.
U4 - rerouted between Hillingdon Hospital and Uxbridge via U5. To replace the U5.
U5 - withdrawn, replaced by changes to U2, U4 and 495
U7 - frequency doubled Mon-Sat, to make up for the loss of the remaining buses on Kingston Lane. This road should be able to cope with less buses because passengers from Uxbridge wanting to access Brunel Uni can use the Greenway which is less than a 5 minute walk to campus.
495 - new route operating from Southall, Merrick Lane to West Drayton, via Merrick Lane, South Road, Southall station, Southall Waterside, Pump Lane, Hayes Town, route U5 to West Drayton. To link Southall Waterside with West Drayton. Route to operate at same frequency as U5, and DD.
I feel that the Uxbridge - Brunel corridor is overbussed and could do with some changes. The U5 is indirect and I feel most journeys are shorter like Uxbridge - Hillingdon Hospital, Hillingdon Hospital - West Drayton, West Drayton - Hayes, as there are quicker alternatives for longer journeys, such as the 222 between Uxbridge and West Drayton, the U4 between Hillingdon Hospital and Hayes. I also feel that this change will create more direct links like Cowley to Hayes on the U4 by diverting the U4 there
The U1/U3 merger would be good because it introduces new links to Heathrow from parts of Ickenham which currently don't have a bus route to Heathrow, whilst it would give Ickenham a higher frequency route to Uxbridge/Ruislip.
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Post by southlondonbus on Nov 11, 2021 11:59:33 GMT
I thought the 73 should never have been removed from Victoria and the 390 curtailed at Oxford Circus but not much chance of it being changed back now. If you'd have asked me in the 2000s what should've happened I might've even have gone as far as to have suggested a 41 extension to Tottenham Court Road/Oxford Circus over the 390 with the 390 completely discontinued. 0 chance of that happening today as to how much traffic both the 41/390 encounter and the excessive running time the 41 has on it's back. Plus the 41 is a short but very busy route to link tubeless areas with Turnpike Lane and Seven Sisters. |
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Post by Deleted on Nov 11, 2021 12:08:22 GMT
Perhaps the 41 could be extended to Kings Cross rather than merging with the 390 completely. The 73 would then be reinstated to Victoria with the 390 withdrawn. This would give more areas like Hornsey access to central London by bus and wouldn't be too long of an extension.
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Post by greenboy on Nov 11, 2021 13:51:43 GMT
If there were concerns regarding overcrowding on the 390 then here goes: Route 73: Extended to Victoria via current Route 390. This was vastly more popular into Islington than the 390 is into York Way/Torriano Estate. Route 390: Withdrawn between Oxford Circus but revised to run every 5 minutes during the AM & PM peak (if the residential section is where demand is). Thoughts? As far as I'm aware there haven't been any overcrowding issues. I see the 390 regularly along the full length of Oxford Street and its not exactly rammed. It become more frequent between Kings X and Archway then pre 2017 and it still have the 73 from Oxo to help I was on Shaftesbury Avenue and Piccadilly tonight between 5.30 and 6ish I guess and I have to say I was quite shocked by how empty the 38s are now. I know people on here never want to acknowledge it but I genuinely was shocked by just how many I saw in either direction with little more then a handful on each, some probably with 3 people. 19s similar aswell if running behind a 38. Also on Piccadilly in the direction of Russell Square literally empty 14s in convoy which admittedly against the flow at that time but even heading away from the town the 14s and 22s were light is best to describe it. Half the seats maybe taken upstairs and some downstairs but no standing. Hard to belive in the original Routemaster days, which did hold less I know, but would be heaving at these times back to Victoria, Putney etc. Really quite a surprise and either shows quite how bad the decline is and what a mountain to get some back or how work from home really has taken hold. Sad really. Not just Central London either, I was chatting to a Norwood driver this morning and he was saying how quiet routes like the 249,417 and 468 are nowadays compared to what they used to be. Unless TfL are going to make a concerted effort to get people back onto buses post covid the spiral of decline is going to continue. |
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Post by Busboy105 on Nov 11, 2021 15:16:53 GMT
Perhaps the 41 could be extended to Kings Cross rather than merging with the 390 completely. The 73 would then be reinstated to Victoria with the 390 withdrawn. This would give more areas like Hornsey access to central London by bus and wouldn't be too long of an extension. The 41 moves slowly as it is; extending it will ruin reliability |
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Post by southlondonbus on Nov 11, 2021 15:17:29 GMT
As far as I'm aware there haven't been any overcrowding issues. I see the 390 regularly along the full length of Oxford Street and its not exactly rammed. It become more frequent between Kings X and Archway then pre 2017 and it still have the 73 from Oxo to help I was on Shaftesbury Avenue and Piccadilly tonight between 5.30 and 6ish I guess and I have to say I was quite shocked by how empty the 38s are now. I know people on here never want to acknowledge it but I genuinely was shocked by just how many I saw in either direction with little more then a handful on each, some probably with 3 people. 19s similar aswell if running behind a 38. Also on Piccadilly in the direction of Russell Square literally empty 14s in convoy which admittedly against the flow at that time but even heading away from the town the 14s and 22s were light is best to describe it. Half the seats maybe taken upstairs and some downstairs but no standing. Hard to belive in the original Routemaster days, which did hold less I know, but would be heaving at these times back to Victoria, Putney etc. Really quite a surprise and either shows quite how bad the decline is and what a mountain to get some back or how work from home really has taken hold. Sad really. Not just Central London either, I was chatting to a Norwood driver this morning and he was saying how quiet routes like the 249,417 and 468 are nowadays compared to what they used to be. Unless TfL are going to make a concerted effort to get people back onto buses post covid the spiral of decline is going to continue. I think people really are still working from home and going out more locally. It's a very hard one for central government to fully enforce an office return I think now. |
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