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Post by Dillon95 on Feb 27, 2022 16:34:55 GMT
Buses move and scrolling information is difficult to follow particularly when hidden by other buses. London has got by without intermediate information on the bus exterior for many years now. Bus stop information with route diagrams showing intermediates is better than many parts of the country. Should we not strive to make thing better just because we have got by for many years. We got by without mobile devices fir many years. Exactly. We want people in London to start using bus services do we not? Well I feel that advertising key places that the routes serve will make people take note and use them more. For example someone that lives in Bromley but doesn’t a clue about buses might want to go to see a dentist in Beckenham. If they see the 227 going along one day and realise that it doesn’t just go to Crystal Palace, they might think oh I know what I can get that. Having key places that the route serves rather than just the ultimate destination worked well for London buses for donkey’s years and it is used by most bus operators everywhere else in the country. When I went on holiday in Torquay I didn’t have a clue where the local Stagecoach bus services went. The route information and branding on them made me feel comfortable with using them to visit some next door towns.
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Post by dashing0ne on Feb 27, 2022 17:16:28 GMT
Should we not strive to make thing better just because we have got by for many years. We got by without mobile devices fir many years. Exactly. We want people in London to start using bus services do we not? Well I feel that advertising key places that the routes serve will make people take note and use them more. For example someone that lives in Bromley but doesn’t a clue about buses might want to go to see a dentist in Beckenham. If they see the 227 going along one day and realise that it doesn’t just go to Crystal Palace, they might think oh I know what I can get that. Having key places that the route serves rather than just the ultimate destination worked well for London buses for donkey’s years and it is used by most bus operators everywhere else in the country. When I went on holiday in Torquay I didn’t have a clue where the local Stagecoach bus services went. The route information and branding on them made me feel comfortable with using them to visit some next door towns. The problem is buses work so many routes in London the branding is constantly inaccurate and ineffective. However blinds should include those destinations perhaps small letters at the top.
for example:
x y z a b dashing0ne speedy road
NOT TO SCALE
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Post by Dillon95 on Feb 27, 2022 17:29:30 GMT
Exactly. We want people in London to start using bus services do we not? Well I feel that advertising key places that the routes serve will make people take note and use them more. For example someone that lives in Bromley but doesn’t a clue about buses might want to go to see a dentist in Beckenham. If they see the 227 going along one day and realise that it doesn’t just go to Crystal Palace, they might think oh I know what I can get that. Having key places that the route serves rather than just the ultimate destination worked well for London buses for donkey’s years and it is used by most bus operators everywhere else in the country. When I went on holiday in Torquay I didn’t have a clue where the local Stagecoach bus services went. The route information and branding on them made me feel comfortable with using them to visit some next door towns. The problem is buses work so many routes in London the branding is constantly inaccurate and ineffective. However blinds should include those destinations perhaps small letters at the top.
for example:
x y z a b dashing0ne speedy road
NOT TO SCALE
Not to scale here as well, I’d go with for example: Town A, Town B Ultimate Destination 123 Which would change every 4 or 5 seconds to Town C, Town D Ultimate Destination 123 As the route moves along, towns/areas/villages it has served will stop showing on the top. Much more useful for passengers than what we have now. Here is an example:
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Post by WH241 on Feb 27, 2022 17:32:38 GMT
The problem is buses work so many routes in London the branding is constantly inaccurate and ineffective. However blinds should include those destinations perhaps small letters at the top.
for example:
x y z a b dashing0ne speedy road
NOT TO SCALE
Not to scale here as well, I’d go with for example: Town A, Town B Ultimate Destination 123 So and so road Which would change every 4 or 5 seconds to Town C, Town D Ultimate Destination 123 So and so road As the route moves along, towns/areas/villages it has served will stop showing on the top. So only a useful advert for people heading in the direction the bus is travelling and gives no indication of where the bus has been? Not a fan on branding but at least that’s static and usual shows the start and end of a route with a few via points.
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Post by vjaska on Feb 27, 2022 17:33:28 GMT
Exactly. We want people in London to start using bus services do we not? Well I feel that advertising key places that the routes serve will make people take note and use them more. For example someone that lives in Bromley but doesn’t a clue about buses might want to go to see a dentist in Beckenham. If they see the 227 going along one day and realise that it doesn’t just go to Crystal Palace, they might think oh I know what I can get that. Having key places that the route serves rather than just the ultimate destination worked well for London buses for donkey’s years and it is used by most bus operators everywhere else in the country. When I went on holiday in Torquay I didn’t have a clue where the local Stagecoach bus services went. The route information and branding on them made me feel comfortable with using them to visit some next door towns. The problem is buses work so many routes in London the branding is constantly inaccurate and ineffective. However blinds should include those destinations perhaps small letters at the top.
for example:
x y z a b dashing0ne speedy road NOT TO SCALE
Branded buses outside London stray quite a bit and even then, the Barkingside scheme showed that to a large extent, you can keep strays to a relative minimum so I can’t accept the argument that branding won’t work in London if done properly
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Post by Dillon95 on Feb 27, 2022 17:37:11 GMT
Not to scale here as well, I’d go with for example: Town A, Town B Ultimate Destination 123 So and so road Which would change every 4 or 5 seconds to Town C, Town D Ultimate Destination 123 So and so road As the route moves along, towns/areas/villages it has served will stop showing on the top. So only a useful advert for people heading in the direction the bus is travelling and gives no indication of where the bus has been? Not a fan on branding but at least that’s static and usual shows the start and end of a route with a few via points. Otherwise you’ll have passengers unfamiliar with the route complaining that it’s advertised a town that it’s already been to. If an 89 going towards Lewisham is in Welling, there is no point in it still displaying Bexleyheath is there? It works everywhere else, I don’t see why the idea is so far fetched just because it’s in London.
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Post by WH241 on Feb 27, 2022 17:39:16 GMT
The problem is buses work so many routes in London the branding is constantly inaccurate and ineffective. However blinds should include those destinations perhaps small letters at the top.
for example:
x y z a b dashing0ne speedy road NOT TO SCALE
Branded buses outside London stray quite a bit and even then, the Barkingside scheme showed that to a large extent, you can keep strays to a relative minimum so I can’t accept the argument that branding won’t work in London if done properly Was fairly easy to keep the buses allocated at T as the 55 is LT the 56 had its dedicated hybrids and the 257 had the MMCs. Branding in a busy garage would just cause a lot of headaches for allocation and engineering for very little benefit. Why can’t energy be put into getting buses up to speed and less regulation of services. This will benefit passengers more than anything IMO.
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Post by dashing0ne on Feb 27, 2022 17:43:01 GMT
The problem is buses work so many routes in London the branding is constantly inaccurate and ineffective. However blinds should include those destinations perhaps small letters at the top.
for example:
x y z a b dashing0ne speedy road
NOT TO SCALE
Not to scale here as well, I’d go with for example: Town A, Town B Ultimate Destination 123 Which would change every 4 or 5 seconds to Town C, Town D Ultimate Destination 123 As the route moves along, towns/areas/villages it has served will stop showing on the top. Much more useful for passengers than what we have now. Here is an example: I basically would bring the layout how it used to be, here is a paper blind with the formate on route P13 obviously not taken recently:
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Post by cl54 on Feb 27, 2022 18:29:51 GMT
So far current LED blinds rolled out are leading (hope they start working!) but only one vote short compared to the paper blinds. If all LED blinds combined (including the non-fancy displays used outside of London) are included then all LED blinds are leading by 9 points. Please vote and explain your reasoning!!! Poor quality LED displays are in 3rd place and should remain there.
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Post by cl54 on Feb 27, 2022 18:35:32 GMT
Exactly. We want people in London to start using bus services do we not? Well I feel that advertising key places that the routes serve will make people take note and use them more. For example someone that lives in Bromley but doesn’t a clue about buses might want to go to see a dentist in Beckenham. If they see the 227 going along one day and realise that it doesn’t just go to Crystal Palace, they might think oh I know what I can get that. Having key places that the route serves rather than just the ultimate destination worked well for London buses for donkey’s years and it is used by most bus operators everywhere else in the country. When I went on holiday in Torquay I didn’t have a clue where the local Stagecoach bus services went. The route information and branding on them made me feel comfortable with using them to visit some next door towns. The problem is buses work so many routes in London the branding is constantly inaccurate and ineffective. However blinds should include those destinations perhaps small letters at the top.
for example:
x y z a b dashing0ne speedy road
NOT TO SCALE
The problem is the glass areas got bigger and the destination/route number boxes got smaller. There are minimum heights for destinations and route numbers for the good reason that they need to be read by intending passengers. Broadly speaking the RATP displays meet TfL's (and national) standards.
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Post by Dillon95 on Feb 27, 2022 18:40:53 GMT
Most non TFL operators manage it with the same modern bus types. People’s eyes aren’t any worse in London than they are in Kent.
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Post by LondonExplorer316 on Feb 27, 2022 18:49:19 GMT
I'd say that LEDs should look like this, with changing vias next to the route no. and the dest. below so:
Hanworth, Heston 111 Heathrow Central
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Post by southlondon413 on Feb 27, 2022 19:35:30 GMT
I'd say that LEDs should look like this, with changing vias next to the route no. and the dest. below so:
Hanworth, Heston 111 Heathrow Central
That looks awful, the via points are too big and the final destination is too small. It would lead to confusion with passengers over their final destination if they were planning on going to the end of the route. The last thing a driver wants is to answer the same question of “where are you going?” dozens of times because the blinds are too clumped and hard to read. Personally I would just retain via points on the side blinds and keep the front as simple as possible. We are also ignoring the fact that the majority of passengers in the suburbs know their local routes and don’t need via points. Perhaps in central London where it would benefit tourists and other short term visitors but beyond zone 2 it would be pointless.
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Post by vjaska on Feb 27, 2022 19:35:38 GMT
Branded buses outside London stray quite a bit and even then, the Barkingside scheme showed that to a large extent, you can keep strays to a relative minimum so I can’t accept the argument that branding won’t work in London if done properly Was fairly easy to keep the buses allocated at T as the 55 is LT the 56 had its dedicated hybrids and the 257 had the MMCs. Branding in a busy garage would just cause a lot of headaches for allocation and engineering for very little benefit. Why can’t energy be put into getting buses up to speed and less regulation of services. This will benefit passengers more than anything IMO. As you well know, I’ve said on several occasions that the priority is to speed up buses through priority, less regulation and cutting congestion but once that is done, there is still a place for branding whether people like it or not. Again, you say branding in a busy garage but there are many busy garages across the country who manage it no problem so I can’t accept that reason
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Post by Dillon95 on Feb 28, 2022 12:49:26 GMT
Was fairly easy to keep the buses allocated at T as the 55 is LT the 56 had its dedicated hybrids and the 257 had the MMCs. Branding in a busy garage would just cause a lot of headaches for allocation and engineering for very little benefit. Why can’t energy be put into getting buses up to speed and less regulation of services. This will benefit passengers more than anything IMO. As you well know, I’ve said on several occasions that the priority is to speed up buses through priority, less regulation and cutting congestion but once that is done, there is still a place for branding whether people like it or not. Again, you say branding in a busy garage but there are many busy garages across the country who manage it no problem so I can’t accept that reason I think it comes down to a lot of London bus enthusiasts not liking change to be honest, even if it’s for the better.
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