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Post by southlondon413 on Sept 11, 2023 12:36:18 GMT
Wilko: All 400 stores to close by early October www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-66743050I feel sorry for the staff but this is what happens when your owners effectively steal £77m from an already failing business. If you owned a failing company, would you not want to try and savlvage as much from the company before it went bust, or would you be happy to see all your money go up in flames. Let's be honest, Wilko was going to the wall no matter what. How can salvaging your money be classed as stealing? Sounds like prudent financial management to me. Awarding dividends on falling profits is tantamount to stealing. We should have laws that prevent this. They were still drawing dividends at the beginning of this year when Wilko had massive restructuring loans from Hilco. The fact is the family allowed this to happen, it’s entirely negligent on the their part and they should have never let it get to this point. For the granddaughter owner to say it wouldn’t have mattered whatever she did just shows her complete lack of regard for the company her grandfather built and the employees who built their lives working for the business. |
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Post by TB123 on Sept 11, 2023 12:38:55 GMT
If you owned a failing company, would you not want to try and savlvage as much from the company before it went bust, or would you be happy to see all your money go up in flames. Let's be honest, Wilko was going to the wall no matter what. How can salvaging your money be classed as stealing? Sounds like prudent financial management to me. Awarding dividends on falling profits is tantamount to stealing. We should have laws that prevent this. They were still drawing dividends at the beginning of this year when Wilko had massive restructuring loans from Hilco. The fact is the family allowed this to happen, it’s entirely negligent on the their part and they should have never let it get to this point. And all this in a booming market (discount retail) - not like Arcadia/BHS/Debenhams, collapses which have not been helped by mismanagement but taken place in markets (middle-market fashion, department stores) with serious structural challenges or decline. |
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Post by SILENCED on Sept 11, 2023 12:40:27 GMT
If you owned a failing company, would you not want to try and savlvage as much from the company before it went bust, or would you be happy to see all your money go up in flames. Let's be honest, Wilko was going to the wall no matter what. How can salvaging your money be classed as stealing? Sounds like prudent financial management to me. Awarding dividends on falling profits is tantamount to stealing. We should have laws that prevent this. They were still drawing dividends at the beginning of this year when Wilko had massive restructuring loans from Hilco. The fact is the family allowed this to happen, it’s entirely negligent on the their part and they should have never let it get to this point. So you would rather they collapsed just before Christmas? You talking rubbish and making accusations that are baseless. Why should you not be able to protect your investments? You would then stifle those that wish to take risk with innovation. Without innovation our country will stagnate and fail. The fact nobody wanted to save them shows what a lost case Wilko was. Many of the other retail companies were saved. Low profit margin companies, will always be susceptible to change in shopping trends, given mans trend to desert the high street, which unfortunately is the Wilko business model. So blame the public for not shopping in the high streets. Then you blame local politicians for making high streets and town centres unattractive. Local councillors are to blame. Let's be honest. Who has spent more than £150 shopping since COVID on a single item purchased :- A) The High Street B) A Retail Park C) On-line I have last two but not the first. Why? Councils for last 20 years have discouraged people to go go shopping in High Streets. Parking charges are exorbitant. It is clear councillors what high streets and town centres to fail. If anything is to blame for Wilko's issues it is this, not anything the family members have done. |
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Post by southlondon413 on Sept 11, 2023 13:03:36 GMT
Awarding dividends on falling profits is tantamount to stealing. We should have laws that prevent this. They were still drawing dividends at the beginning of this year when Wilko had massive restructuring loans from Hilco. The fact is the family allowed this to happen, it’s entirely negligent on the their part and they should have never let it get to this point. So you would rather they collapsed just before Christmas? You talking rubbish and making accusations that are baseless. Why should you not be able to protect your investments? You would then stifle those that wish to take risk with innovation. Without innovation our country will stagnate and fail. The fact nobody wanted to save them shows what a lost case Wilko was. Many of the other retail companies were saved. Low profit margin companies, will always be susceptible to change in shopping trends, given mans trend to desert the high street, which unfortunately is the Wilko business model. So blame the public for not shopping in the high streets. Then you blame local politicians for making high streets and town centres unattractive. Local councillors are to blame. The granddaughter admitted nothing she did would have helped but continued to take dividends, ergo her own fault. In this case Wilko failed to adapt to long term trends and changes in the high street. It failed to adapt to competitors who were doing the same and more for a lot cheaper. It failed to have a workable business and perhaps the worst offence failed to have a resemblance of a management team for the better part of the last decade. The public only perceives what they know to be reality and the reality is Wilko has had stock issues for a long time. Their competitors responded to Brexit and COVID well but they didn’t. But taking money out of a business when it should be using it to restructure, pay its debts and hopefully fix itself is just wrong. This whole situation has been the companies own making, the external factors pale in comparison to the internal factors. |
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Post by SILENCED on Sept 11, 2023 13:07:27 GMT
So you would rather they collapsed just before Christmas? You talking rubbish and making accusations that are baseless. Why should you not be able to protect your investments? You would then stifle those that wish to take risk with innovation. Without innovation our country will stagnate and fail. The fact nobody wanted to save them shows what a lost case Wilko was. Many of the other retail companies were saved. Low profit margin companies, will always be susceptible to change in shopping trends, given mans trend to desert the high street, which unfortunately is the Wilko business model. So blame the public for not shopping in the high streets. Then you blame local politicians for making high streets and town centres unattractive. Local councillors are to blame. The granddaughter admitted nothing she did would have helped but continued to take dividends, ergo her own fault. In this case Wilko failed to adapt to long term trends and changes in the high street. It failed to adapt to competitors who were doing the same and more for a lot cheaper. It failed to have a workable business and perhaps the worst offence failed to have a resemblance of a management team for the better part of the last decade. The public only perceives what they know to be reality and the reality is Wilko has had stock issues for a long time. Their competitors responded to Brexit and COVID well but they didn’t. But taking money out of a business when it should be using it to restructure, pay its debts and hopefully fix itself is just wrong. This whole situation has been the companies own making, the external factors pale in comparison to the internal factors. So if you owned a company, you would happy to lose yours and your relatives savings? The fault lies firmly with local urban planning policies which have been to destroy local high streets. |
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Post by southlondon413 on Sept 11, 2023 13:14:55 GMT
The granddaughter admitted nothing she did would have helped but continued to take dividends, ergo her own fault. In this case Wilko failed to adapt to long term trends and changes in the high street. It failed to adapt to competitors who were doing the same and more for a lot cheaper. It failed to have a workable business and perhaps the worst offence failed to have a resemblance of a management team for the better part of the last decade. The public only perceives what they know to be reality and the reality is Wilko has had stock issues for a long time. Their competitors responded to Brexit and COVID well but they didn’t. But taking money out of a business when it should be using it to restructure, pay its debts and hopefully fix itself is just wrong. This whole situation has been the companies own making, the external factors pale in comparison to the internal factors. So if you owned a company, you would happy to lose yours and your relatives monies? The fault lies firmly with local urban policies which have been to destroy local high streets. The moment they realised the business was failing as far back as 2014 the family should have either sold when it was still viable to do so or taken a break on dividends to allow the business access to more funds to restructure without the need of massive loans from Hilco. This is exactly why businesses like BHS and Arcadia failed because the owners stripped their values and took what they could. We absolutely should have laws that prevent this kind of issue. The Wilko collapse had everything to do with the mismanagement of the company and whilst falling foot traffic hasn’t helped it’s funny that rivals like B&M, Home Bargains and even Lidl have been able to copy their model and make it more successful. The retail analysts all seem to agree it was down to a failure in their business model, an overburden of failing stores, mismanagement and the rise of cheaper competitors. |
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Post by SILENCED on Sept 11, 2023 13:24:44 GMT
So if you owned a company, you would happy to lose yours and your relatives monies? The fault lies firmly with local urban policies which have been to destroy local high streets. The moment they realised the business was failing as far back as 2014 the family should have either sold when it was still viable to do so or taken a break on dividends to allow the business access to more funds to restructure without the need of massive loans from Hilco. This is exactly why businesses like BHS and Arcadia failed because the owners stripped their values and took what they could. We absolutely should have laws that prevent this kind of issue. The Wilko collapse had everything to do with the mismanagement of the company and whilst falling foot traffic hasn’t helped it’s funny that rivals like B&M, Home Bargains and even Lidl have been able to copy their model and make it more successful. The retail analysts all seem to agree it was down to a failure in their business model, an overburden of failing stores, mismanagement and the rise of cheaper competitors. Have you looked at the financials? Prior to 2022, they made a profit in 6 of the 7 years, how is that failing? The year they didn't they invested money to try and improves the companies position. The huge loss was in 2022. Wilko like many retailers over the past decade have been screwed by local councils. The fact so many high street companies have had troubles, shows it is not management and their is a common external element, which is rooted to the incompetence in town halls. |
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Post by southlondon413 on Sept 11, 2023 13:42:51 GMT
The moment they realised the business was failing as far back as 2014 the family should have either sold when it was still viable to do so or taken a break on dividends to allow the business access to more funds to restructure without the need of massive loans from Hilco. This is exactly why businesses like BHS and Arcadia failed because the owners stripped their values and took what they could. We absolutely should have laws that prevent this kind of issue. The Wilko collapse had everything to do with the mismanagement of the company and whilst falling foot traffic hasn’t helped it’s funny that rivals like B&M, Home Bargains and even Lidl have been able to copy their model and make it more successful. The retail analysts all seem to agree it was down to a failure in their business model, an overburden of failing stores, mismanagement and the rise of cheaper competitors. Have you looked at the financials? Prior to 2022, they made a profit in 6 of the 7 years, how is that failing? The year they didn't they invested money to try and improves the companies position. The huge loss was in 2022. Wilko like many retailers over the past decade have been screwed by local councils. The fact so many high street companies have had troubles, shows it is not management and their is a common external element, which is rooted to the incompetence in town halls. But their sales were falling consistently year on year and weren’t recovering. Numerous retail experts are quoted saying that the failing sales, failure to react to competition, a lack of stock, an oversized store network, the lack of a CEO who often sets the tone for the culture of the company and an overall mismanagement had lead to this but you honestly believe a council changing it’s parking policy has ultimately lead Wilko to failure? It is entirely delusional to think like that. Okay councils have lent helped but Wilko is a business that killed itself. It failed for the same reason Woolworths did and that is ultimately bad management. It’s the same reason why a retailer like Boots will probably fail in the next five years, probably Asda too but you keep believing it is the council town centre planners fault. |
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Post by vjaska on Sept 11, 2023 13:51:05 GMT
Awarding dividends on falling profits is tantamount to stealing. We should have laws that prevent this. They were still drawing dividends at the beginning of this year when Wilko had massive restructuring loans from Hilco. The fact is the family allowed this to happen, it’s entirely negligent on the their part and they should have never let it get to this point. So you would rather they collapsed just before Christmas? You talking rubbish and making accusations that are baseless. Why should you not be able to protect your investments? You would then stifle those that wish to take risk with innovation. Without innovation our country will stagnate and fail. The fact nobody wanted to save them shows what a lost case Wilko was. Many of the other retail companies were saved. Low profit margin companies, will always be susceptible to change in shopping trends, given mans trend to desert the high street, which unfortunately is the Wilko business model. So blame the public for not shopping in the high streets. Then you blame local politicians for making high streets and town centres unattractive. Local councillors are to blame. Let's be honest. Who has spent more than £150 shopping since COVID on a single item purchased :- A) The High Street B) A Retail Park C) On-line I have last two but not the first. Why? Councils for last 20 years have discouraged people to go go shopping in High Streets. Parking charges are exorbitant. It is clear councillors what high streets and town centres to fail. If anything is to blame for Wilko's issues it is this, not anything the family members have done. C only for me however, I'm not here for that discussion but for your last paragraph which I'm afraid isn't an entirely open and shut point and is dependent on a particular place. Lambeth Council has discouraged cars to park in Brixton for more than 20 years and yet rather than harm, the town centre is still continuing to weather any problems thrown at it. That's not to say we haven't lost shops (Costa was a blow) and that some sort of shop only sales and events would bring even more in but the place isn't dying unlike other areas and I have to say it's because of our excellent transport hub. Maybe if your own council had another plan other than simply pedestrianising Croydon and moving buses away from the shops, it might be in a better place for the parking charges issue to not be a thing at all, but it's not exactly indicative of everywhere - each area has different requirements. |
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Post by twobellstogo on Sept 11, 2023 13:57:42 GMT
It’s the same reason why a retailer like Boots will probably fail in the next five years, probably Asda too but you keep believing it is the council town centre planners fault. I fear you may be right on the money about ASDA. By some margin they look the wobbliest of the main supermarket chains. |
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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Sept 11, 2023 14:00:10 GMT
It’s the same reason why a retailer like Boots will probably fail in the next five years, probably Asda too but you keep believing it is the council town centre planners fault. I fear you may be right on the money about ASDA. By some margin they look the wobbliest of the main supermarket chains. I don't think Asda will fail, they're owned by Walmart so while they may be offloaded they've probably got the strongest financial backing and are among the biggest in the world. |
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Post by SILENCED on Sept 11, 2023 14:01:13 GMT
Have you looked at the financials? Prior to 2022, they made a profit in 6 of the 7 years, how is that failing? The year they didn't they invested money to try and improves the companies position. The huge loss was in 2022. Wilko like many retailers over the past decade have been screwed by local councils. The fact so many high street companies have had troubles, shows it is not management and their is a common external element, which is rooted to the incompetence in town halls. But their sales were falling consistently year on year and weren’t recovering. Numerous retail experts are quoted saying that the failing sales, failure to react to competition, a lack of stock, an oversized store network, the lack of a CEO who often sets the tone for the culture of the company and an overall mismanagement had lead to this but you honestly believe a council changing it’s parking policy has ultimately lead Wilko to failure? It is entirely delusional to think like that. Okay councils have lent helped but Wilko is a business that killed itself. It failed for the same reason Woolworths did and that is ultimately bad management. It’s the same reason why a retailer like Boots will probably fail in the next five years, probably Asda too but you keep believing it is the council town centre planners fault. What you fail to realise is it was a family owned business, not owned by a FTSE100 company, they don't have a large pool of shareholders to inject investment, as much as I know most of you deride shareholders, but they ones that have and do provide funding. If Boots fails, it just adds weight to my argument! If huge retail heavyweights continue to fail, it has to be more than just company mismanagement, there has to be and underlying issue. ... I rest my case, had enough. Just going down my high street to look at all those closed shops, badly converted flats |
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Post by southlondon413 on Sept 11, 2023 14:06:11 GMT
I fear you may be right on the money about ASDA. By some margin they look the wobbliest of the main supermarket chains. I don't think Asda will fail, they're owned by Walmart so while they may be offloaded they've probably got the strongest financial backing and are among the biggest in the world. Walmart only hold an interest share in Asda. The business is owned by the Issa brothers now. But they paid for the transaction by burdening Asda with a ton of debt. |
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Post by southlondon413 on Sept 11, 2023 14:15:57 GMT
But their sales were falling consistently year on year and weren’t recovering. Numerous retail experts are quoted saying that the failing sales, failure to react to competition, a lack of stock, an oversized store network, the lack of a CEO who often sets the tone for the culture of the company and an overall mismanagement had lead to this but you honestly believe a council changing it’s parking policy has ultimately lead Wilko to failure? It is entirely delusional to think like that. Okay councils have lent helped but Wilko is a business that killed itself. It failed for the same reason Woolworths did and that is ultimately bad management. It’s the same reason why a retailer like Boots will probably fail in the next five years, probably Asda too but you keep believing it is the council town centre planners fault. What you fail to realise is it was a family owned business, not owned by a FTSE100 company, they don't have a large pool of shareholders to inject investment, as much as I know most of you deride shareholders, but they ones that have and do provide funding. If Boots fails, it just adds weight to my argument! If huge retail heavyweights continue to fail, it has to be more than just company mismanagement, there has to be and underlying issue. ... I rest my case, had enough. Just going down my high street to look at all those closed shops, badly converted flats They still had shareholders who were lasso taking their dividend shares. If Boots fails it’s because Walgreens lead it down a road from great management and one of the best companies to work for on the high street to the worst. I when I worked at Boots the Nottingham management had to do and regularly did shifts on the shop floor around the country, management in stores did months of training courses and that had all been dropped by the time I left to cut costs. So the management and the HO support staff lost touch with the customer, their needs and the needs of the staff. Plus the attrition leve reached biblical proportions, in the store I worked in there were up to 150-200 staff at peak Xmas and that barely breaks 100 now. Retail has changed and it’s not as simple as a council making a change. Customers aren’t stupid and they notice when their previously well stocked and well staffed store changes which is ultimately down to mismanagement. |
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Post by enviroPB on Sept 11, 2023 18:28:49 GMT
But their sales were falling consistently year on year and weren’t recovering. Numerous retail experts are quoted saying that the failing sales, failure to react to competition, a lack of stock, an oversized store network, the lack of a CEO who often sets the tone for the culture of the company and an overall mismanagement had lead to this but you honestly believe a council changing it’s parking policy has ultimately lead Wilko to failure? It is entirely delusional to think like that. Okay councils have lent helped but Wilko is a business that killed itself. It failed for the same reason Woolworths did and that is ultimately bad management. It’s the same reason why a retailer like Boots will probably fail in the next five years, probably Asda too but you keep believing it is the council town centre planners fault. What you fail to realise is it was a family owned business, not owned by a FTSE100 company, they don't have a large pool of shareholders to inject investment, as much as I know most of you deride shareholders, but they ones that have and do provide funding. If Boots fails, it just adds weight to my argument! If huge retail heavyweights continue to fail, it has to be more than just company mismanagement, there has to be and underlying issue. ... I rest my case, had enough. Just going down my high street to look at all those closed shops, badly converted flats Unfortunately it doesn't go too far from mismanagement, financial or otherwise. Without reiterating what was said today, I want to add that the going concern of Wilko clearly wasn't adhered to for a long while. Businesses plan to always be trading, but lack of investment on all rounds (products, shops, ads) and yanking 77 million out of the company purse does not say 'planning for the future'. When I went to my local branch in mid August, I was shocked to learn the sparsely populated shelves wasn't as a result of theft prevention but lack of stock. One of the golden rules in retail is to never have empty shelves. After watching the evening news and learning a rescue deal fell through because suppliers wanted money upfront, it is a further sign of mismanagement and a poor relationship with stakeholders. |
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