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Post by TB123 on Nov 8, 2024 13:18:36 GMT
He speaks for most locals on this point - £23M down the drain. Especially given a Superloop 2 route is proposed to run between Thamesmead and North Greenwich. Actually the 244, 301, 380 and 472 all do an excellent job of bring people between Thamesmead and Woolwich quickly. There are big fat bus lanes along the A206 which are very effective at making the journey rapid. Plus all the reasons suggested in that article. I agree - when other parts of London are losing connections, you would at least hope they would be spending it on Superloop routes that bring about new connections like Superloop 1 did. Duplicating the SL3 doesn’t look like money well spent and the 472 is hardly a lumbering, slow hulk of a route I tend to agree. I like the idea of a BRT along the 472 corridor but can’t help but wonder if it could be done on a much cheaper basis, with more targeted interventions at pinch points and high-capacity vehicles, eg bendy buses or tri-axle, dual-staircase double deckers. Do free-flowing 50 mph dual carriageways really need digging up for bus lanes? Not really imo. I think corridors like Brixton Hill would suit a BRT application more with wider roads, more pinch points and a lack of suitable rail alternatives |
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Post by busman on Nov 8, 2024 14:02:09 GMT
He speaks for most locals on this point - £23M down the drain. Especially given a Superloop 2 route is proposed to run between Thamesmead and North Greenwich. Actually the 244, 301, 380 and 472 all do an excellent job of bring people between Thamesmead and Woolwich quickly. There are big fat bus lanes along the A206 which are very effective at making the journey rapid. Plus all the reasons suggested in that article. The Superloop 2 proposal *is* the BRT from what I hear It doesn’t need to be a fancy bus. Just a regular bus is absolutely fine. Plenty of bus lanes along the whole route. Besides, it doesn’t matter what the vehicle is, it’s getting disrupted when the Woolwich Ferry goes belly up or Charlton play at home. |
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Post by adl on Nov 8, 2024 14:06:57 GMT
Forgive me if I’m being aruoid but what is South Havering, I live in Havering and no one’s says South Havering! But I’d imagine it’s either going to go to Rainham, Beam Park or South Hornchurch/Elm Park? I don’t see the point in this route if I’m perfectly honest. ‘South Havering’ is well served by existing routes.
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Post by VMH2537 on Nov 8, 2024 15:14:11 GMT
Forgive me if I’m being aruoid but what is South Havering, I live in Havering and no one’s says South Havering! But I’d imagine it’s either going to go to Rainham, Beam Park or South Hornchurch/Elm Park? I don’t see the point in this route if I’m perfectly honest. ‘South Havering’ is well served by existing routes. From what I understand, Havering has been criticising City Hall for not introducing Superloop initially within the borough despite recently seen improvements to its own network between Upminster and Harold Wood from the 346/497 changes as well the just recent frequency uplifts to the 66, 103, 175 and the 370. Even looking at the network itself, there really isn't much viable options I can see for an express service. The 66 provides fast journey times on the A12 to Newbury Park and onwards to Gants Hill and Leytonstone. Routes to South Havering from Romford are mostly itself adequate and doesn't cater such market demand. The only corridor I could potentially see is one paralleling the 5 at least between Barking and Romford from which I've previously suggested the idea. |
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Post by adl on Nov 8, 2024 15:41:57 GMT
Forgive me if I’m being aruoid but what is South Havering, I live in Havering and no one’s says South Havering! But I’d imagine it’s either going to go to Rainham, Beam Park or South Hornchurch/Elm Park? I don’t see the point in this route if I’m perfectly honest. ‘South Havering’ is well served by existing routes. From what I understand, Havering has been criticising City Hall for not introducing Superloop initially within the borough despite recently seen improvements to its own network between Upminster and Harold Wood from the 346/497 changes as well the just recent frequency uplifts to the 66, 103, 175 and the 370. Even looking at the network itself, there really isn't much viable options I can see for an express service. The 66 provides fast journey times on the A12 to Newbury Park and onwards to Gants Hill and Leytonstone. Routes to South Havering from Romford are mostly itself adequate and doesn't cater such market demand. The only corridor I could potentially see is one paralleling the 5 at least between Barking and Romford from which I've previously suggested the idea. Maybe TFL should focus on enhancing existing routes than put a new stupid express route on which will inevitably cut our existing routes. Evening and Sunday frequency uplifts are nice but there is definitely still actual daytime frequency’s that need improving rather than introducing a Fruitloop bus (the fruitloop being whoever wants to introduce it) spending money on it. Come to think of it they best get a map or something out because ‘South Havering’ I assume is their interpretation of South Hornchurch which is what we actually call the area ‘south of Hornchurch’ Never heard someone say they are going to South Havering. |
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Post by matthieu1221 on Nov 8, 2024 18:36:12 GMT
The Superloop 2 proposal *is* the BRT from what I hear It doesn’t need to be a fancy bus. Just a regular bus is absolutely fine. Plenty of bus lanes along the whole route. Besides, it doesn’t matter what the vehicle is, it’s getting disrupted when the Woolwich Ferry goes belly up or Charlton play at home. Maybe we might be getting proper traffic light priority for the first time in London like proper BRTs elsewhere.
Iirc the 23 million is entirely from the govt and has a date limit on when it can be spent and what it can be spent on so by now it's a case of use it or lose it.
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Post by southlondonbus on Nov 8, 2024 19:58:08 GMT
It doesn’t need to be a fancy bus. Just a regular bus is absolutely fine. Plenty of bus lanes along the whole route. Besides, it doesn’t matter what the vehicle is, it’s getting disrupted when the Woolwich Ferry goes belly up or Charlton play at home. Maybe we might be getting proper traffic light priority for the first time in London like proper BRTs elsewhere. Iirc the 23 million is entirely from the govt and has a date limit on when it can be spent and what it can be spent on so by now it's a case of use it or lose it.
Is this like the thing that was proposed to run between Colliers Wood or South Wimbledon and Sutton in place of the long term Tram extension? |
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Post by southlondon413 on Nov 8, 2024 20:37:42 GMT
Maybe we might be getting proper traffic light priority for the first time in London like proper BRTs elsewhere. Iirc the 23 million is entirely from the govt and has a date limit on when it can be spent and what it can be spent on so by now it's a case of use it or lose it.
Is this like the thing that was proposed to run between Colliers Wood or South Wimbledon and Sutton in place of the long term Tram extension? Let’s never forget that was the worst idea ever. |
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Post by southlondonbus on Nov 8, 2024 20:51:23 GMT
Is this like the thing that was proposed to run between Colliers Wood or South Wimbledon and Sutton in place of the long term Tram extension? Let’s never forget that was the worst idea ever. The whole tram saga in Sutton has been a 20 year waste of time and money when it was unlikely to ever actually happen. |
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Post by lj61nwc on Nov 8, 2024 20:58:43 GMT
Let’s never forget that was the worst idea ever. The whole tram saga in Sutton has been a 20 year waste of time and money when it was unlikely to ever actually happen. I disagree, before covid, it would have been game-changing if the Wimbledon-Sutton half of the Sutton Loop was converted to a tram system, releasing more 700s for the rest of the Thameslink routes whilst increasing the frequency for the passengers and it being the much cheaper option with tracks in place. The other two options were never viable as a tram system, digging up Morden Hall Road and St Helier Avenue for tracks would've caused more harm than good. |
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Post by vjaska on Nov 8, 2024 23:10:07 GMT
The whole tram saga in Sutton has been a 20 year waste of time and money when it was unlikely to ever actually happen. I disagree, before covid, it would have been game-changing if the Wimbledon-Sutton half of the Sutton Loop was converted to a tram system, releasing more 700s for the rest of the Thameslink routes whilst increasing the frequency for the passengers and it being the much cheaper option with tracks in place. The other two options were never viable as a tram system, digging up Morden Hall Road and St Helier Avenue for tracks would've caused more harm than good. What about people who travel across Wimbledon on the current Thameslink services? |
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Post by lj61nwc on Nov 8, 2024 23:18:57 GMT
I disagree, before covid, it would have been game-changing if the Wimbledon-Sutton half of the Sutton Loop was converted to a tram system, releasing more 700s for the rest of the Thameslink routes whilst increasing the frequency for the passengers and it being the much cheaper option with tracks in place. The other two options were never viable as a tram system, digging up Morden Hall Road and St Helier Avenue for tracks would've caused more harm than good. What about people who travel across Wimbledon on the current Thameslink services? I believe if that option was chosen, there would still be a thameslink service starting from Wimbledon but obviously the plans never got that far into development |
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Post by southlondon413 on Nov 8, 2024 23:29:01 GMT
What about people who travel across Wimbledon on the current Thameslink services? I believe if that option was chosen, there would still be a thameslink service starting from Wimbledon but obviously the plans never got that far into development Not to mention that Wimbledon is a major alighting point in both directions. I’ve been on full Thameslink services from both directions that have pretty much emptied out at Wimbledon. Very few cross passengers in my experience. |
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Post by sdaniel on Nov 17, 2024 13:26:00 GMT
Does anybody have any idea when the Superloop 2 consultations are coming out?
The mayor said he will release the consultations towards the end of the year if I’m not mistaken.
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Post by VMH2537 on Nov 17, 2024 13:37:19 GMT
Does anybody have any idea when the Superloop 2 consultations are coming out? The mayor said he will release the consultations towards the end of the year if I’m not mistaken. Only information we have so far is the one for the Thamesmead to Woolwich route should be launched early next year as well as the Bakerloop? I'm happy to be corrected here. |
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