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Post by cl54 on Jul 14, 2024 6:41:37 GMT
Almost certainly given the number matches perfectly with the SL3’s TVR Will the SL3s LTs be moving onto the H98? LTs are allocated by TfL not the operators. They will choose where the buses they own go.
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Post by yunus on Jul 23, 2024 20:03:31 GMT
Who will agree that the Electroliners are by far better than the Enviro BYDs?
As all know I am no fan of EVs but this bus is very decent and I am actually enjoying it!
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Post by vjaska on Jul 23, 2024 22:14:08 GMT
Who will agree that the Electroliners are by far better than the Enviro BYDs? As all know I am no fan of EVs but this bus is very decent and I am actually enjoying it! The Electroliner is currently my favourite of the new deckers (the Abellio spec ones in particular) though I've yet to ride a Volvo BZL decker yet so it could change Single decker wise, the mini Metrocitys are my favourite, nippy little things they are. They also give me that tiny, snug Solo feel inside. Have yet to ride a GB Kite so again, my opinion might change
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Post by matthieu1221 on Jul 24, 2024 15:12:24 GMT
Who will agree that the Electroliners are by far better than the Enviro BYDs? As all know I am no fan of EVs but this bus is very decent and I am actually enjoying it! The improved lower deck alone is why I prefer it too, besides all the other reasons.
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Post by redbus on Jul 24, 2024 16:10:11 GMT
Who will agree that the Electroliners are by far better than the Enviro BYDs? As all know I am no fan of EVs but this bus is very decent and I am actually enjoying it! The improved lower deck alone is why I prefer it too, besides all the other reasons. What features do the Electroliners have that makes them better?
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Post by matthieu1221 on Jul 25, 2024 17:53:05 GMT
The improved lower deck alone is why I prefer it too, besides all the other reasons. What features do the Electroliners have that makes them better? I was answering based on my personal preferences. A bit like why someone might prefer a bus model to another for no particular reason. But being crammed into the back of the lower deck of the BYD E400 probably plays a subconscious part in why.
From a technical standpoint though, the Electroliner has a better range, bigger batteries (and better placed -- as in doesn't eat into the back of the lower deck as much). Which is to be expected from a more recently developed bus.
Generally, I don't rate BYD particularly well considering my experiences with them in Hong Kong. Bodywork build quality was terrible -- worse than ADL! (so small mercies in the way that ADL did the bodywork for the BYD E400) -- also issues with brakes and other such problems, they've also tended to be off the road for months often. The BYDs here so far seem to have fared a little better with the oldest approaching the 5 year anniversary doing fine unlike those in Hong Kong so who knows they might do a little better here, but will be interesting if they last as long as the usual lifespan of a bus here.
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Post by redbus on Jul 25, 2024 18:07:34 GMT
What features do the Electroliners have that makes them better? I was answering based on my personal preferences. A bit like why someone might prefer a bus model to another for no particular reason. But being crammed into the back of the lower deck of the BYD E400 probably plays a subconscious part in why.
From a technical standpoint though, the Electroliner has a better range, bigger batteries (and better placed -- as in doesn't eat into the back of the lower deck as much). Which is to be expected from a more recently developed bus.
Generally, I don't rate BYD particularly well considering my experiences with them in Hong Kong. Bodywork build quality was terrible -- worse than ADL! (so small mercies in the way that ADL did the bodywork for the BYD E400) -- also issues with brakes and other such problems, they've also tended to be off the road for months often. The BYDs here so far seem to have fared a little better with the oldest approaching the 5 year anniversary doing fine unlike those in Hong Kong so who knows they might do a little better here, but will be interesting if they last as long as the usual lifespan of a bus here.
Sure, some reasons will be personal preferences. I am waiting for the design which restores a proper rear window on the lower deck. I note that the original 5 test BYD DD buses which started on route 98 in 2016 are still going, albeit now with Uno bus.
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Post by ADH45258 on Jul 25, 2024 18:30:40 GMT
I was answering based on my personal preferences. A bit like why someone might prefer a bus model to another for no particular reason. But being crammed into the back of the lower deck of the BYD E400 probably plays a subconscious part in why.
From a technical standpoint though, the Electroliner has a better range, bigger batteries (and better placed -- as in doesn't eat into the back of the lower deck as much). Which is to be expected from a more recently developed bus.
Generally, I don't rate BYD particularly well considering my experiences with them in Hong Kong. Bodywork build quality was terrible -- worse than ADL! (so small mercies in the way that ADL did the bodywork for the BYD E400) -- also issues with brakes and other such problems, they've also tended to be off the road for months often. The BYDs here so far seem to have fared a little better with the oldest approaching the 5 year anniversary doing fine unlike those in Hong Kong so who knows they might do a little better here, but will be interesting if they last as long as the usual lifespan of a bus here.
Sure, some reasons will be personal preferences. I am waiting for the design which restores a proper rear window on the lower deck. I note that the original 5 test BYD DD buses which started on route 98 in 2016 are still going, albeit now with Uno bus. 3 out of the 5 BYDs at Uno have now been withdrawn, so they may not be that reliable
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Post by sam97 on Jul 28, 2024 18:20:57 GMT
Who will agree that the Electroliners are by far better than the Enviro BYDs? As all know I am no fan of EVs but this bus is very decent and I am actually enjoying it! Count me in. The acceleration on the Electroliners are better plus the obvious rear lower deck isn’t cramping my organs, like the BYD E400s. But I do like the sound of the BYD E400s, not as good as the electro liners.
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Post by mondraker275 on Jul 31, 2024 17:14:39 GMT
Do we think the recent cuts to winter fuel, some transport projects reduces the chances that TfL will get the funding for electric buses. I did read that Sadiq Khan said this week that SuperLoop 2 routes will be announced later this year for potential 2025 start and if they are in the same boat (i.e. both rely on funding) then maybe he has got the nod that he will get the funding otherwise I suspect you prioritise electrics over SL phase 2.
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Post by snowman on Jul 31, 2024 19:29:20 GMT
Do we think the recent cuts to winter fuel, some transport projects reduces the chances that TfL will get the funding for electric buses. I did read that Sadiq Khan said this week that SuperLoop 2 routes will be announced later this year for potential 2025 start and if they are in the same boat (i.e. both rely on funding) then maybe he has got the nod that he will get the funding otherwise I suspect you prioritise electrics over SL phase 2. The Government has not announced any funding. Per Chancellors statement, DfT will be reviewing projects and spending. The latest TfL Board Finance report (period 2) which was before recent announcement simply says "we continue to make the case to Government for long-term funding settlement" in box on capital investment. The section on variance to budget is rather negative for buses, so to some extent the idea of extra money for buses is like throwing money at a sinking ship. board.tfl.gov.uk/documents/s22827/Appendix%201%20P2%202024%20Finance%20Report.pdfThere are rather more comments in final year end March 2024 Finance report, but again rather looks like buses are a money pit that has turned out much worse than expected board.tfl.gov.uk/documents/s22831/Appendix%201%20Annual%20Report%20and%20Accounts%202024%20Draft.pdf
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Post by matthieu1221 on Aug 1, 2024 13:08:57 GMT
Do we think the recent cuts to winter fuel, some transport projects reduces the chances that TfL will get the funding for electric buses. I did read that Sadiq Khan said this week that SuperLoop 2 routes will be announced later this year for potential 2025 start and if they are in the same boat (i.e. both rely on funding) then maybe he has got the nod that he will get the funding otherwise I suspect you prioritise electrics over SL phase 2. Cap Ex vs Op Ex though.
Electric buses is arguably cap ex which Khan and TfL have made clear need central govt funding (along with other projects such as new trains for the Bakerloo) whilst Superloop 2 is mostly op ex (and TfL now breaks even on day-to-day operations so that won't be that big an issue).
That's not to say that Superloop 2 doesn't need some cap ex (and I hope it does as that would hopefully mean more thought out bus priority and all done before the routes are launched rather than after now that there isn't an election prematurely rushing things forward).
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Post by SILENCED on Aug 1, 2024 13:20:40 GMT
Do we think the recent cuts to winter fuel, some transport projects reduces the chances that TfL will get the funding for electric buses. I did read that Sadiq Khan said this week that SuperLoop 2 routes will be announced later this year for potential 2025 start and if they are in the same boat (i.e. both rely on funding) then maybe he has got the nod that he will get the funding otherwise I suspect you prioritise electrics over SL phase 2. Cap Ex vs Op Ex though.
Electric buses is arguably cap ex which Khan and TfL have made clear need central govt funding (along with other projects such as new trains for the Bakerloo) whilst Superloop 2 is mostly op ex (and TfL now breaks even on day-to-day operations so that won't be that big an issue).
That's not to say that Superloop 2 doesn't need some cap ex (and I hope it does as that would hopefully mean more thought out bus priority and all done before the routes are launched rather than after now that there isn't an election prematurely rushing things forward). Its not though. This was the same mistake people were making with the SL6 vehilces. Electric buses are CAP Ex for the operators. For TfL they are just increased Op Ex. Other than LTs, TfL has precious little CAPEX to do with the bus network. There would only be CAPEX charges if TfL purchase or subsidize the purchase of vehicles ... and not even 100% sure that would be the case for the latter.
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Post by matthieu1221 on Aug 1, 2024 13:44:39 GMT
Cap Ex vs Op Ex though.
Electric buses is arguably cap ex which Khan and TfL have made clear need central govt funding (along with other projects such as new trains for the Bakerloo) whilst Superloop 2 is mostly op ex (and TfL now breaks even on day-to-day operations so that won't be that big an issue).
That's not to say that Superloop 2 doesn't need some cap ex (and I hope it does as that would hopefully mean more thought out bus priority and all done before the routes are launched rather than after now that there isn't an election prematurely rushing things forward). Its not though. This was the same mistake people were making with the SL6 vehilces. Electric buses are CAP Ex for the operators. For TfL they are just increased Op Ex. Other than LTs, TfL has precious little CAPEX to do with the bus network. There would only be CAPEX charges if TfL purchase or subsidize the purchase of vehicles ... and not even 100% sure that would be the case for the latter. I suppose it depends if TfL considers the increased contract costs (particularly those requiring first-time charger installation) as a one-time cap-ex rather than op-ex. In the long-run, would electric bids on existing infra (charging etc...) + buses go back to the 'regular' level of costs? I'd imagine TfL would want to as the central govt would be less inclined to cover op-ex.
In absolute, you are right that the cap-ex goes to operators... which raises the question as to why TfL needs/wants extra for what should be op-ex when the covid-era op-ex settlements are clearly over. Do they classify electrification costs (even from contract costs) as cap-ex? Perhaps makes for a better argument with ZEBRA funding for the rest of the country.
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Post by yunus on Aug 1, 2024 20:21:14 GMT
Reading recent posts on this thread, what will happen if TFL cannot get funding for EVs?
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