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Post by DT 11 on Oct 21, 2016 19:13:45 GMT
The problem is that the 136 is often quite well loaded by the time it gets to Southampton Way, I thought all along the 136 extension is a cheapskate solution when the North Peckham area really needs a link into the west end. Rerouting the 139 from Trafalgar Square via the 12 to Walworth Road and then via the 343 route to Peckham would have been much better. The 13 could have been extended to Waterloo to compensate. The 21 and 453 can swap southern termini to provide a direct link between Elephant & Castle and Lewisham. It is not really nessassary to extend the 139 to Peckham, personally I think it wouldn't be a well used as the 136 simply because the majority of commuters end up getting on the tube. Areas like North Peckham & Walworth is where "The Hopper" can be made use of if people wish to travel by bus beyond the majority of bus users in that area only ever go a few stops, some of the punters probably don't even know where the heck Grove Park is let alone West Hampstead. I do wonder if people who use the 343 have ever used it to City Hall. That area was mainly crying out for a more frequent service and they got it, 15 Buses per hour then idiots like you just moan about everything.... Additionally buses in Central London are just becoming more useless and slower because of headway and general traffic. These ideas are just meaningless really. You may think the extension is cheap, it certainly isn't, it costs money. The amount of money which is probably being made from it. I imagine when the 136 goes up for tender it will attract quite a few bidders. |
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Post by sid on Oct 21, 2016 19:24:34 GMT
The problem is that the 136 is often quite well loaded by the time it gets to Southampton Way, I thought all along the 136 extension is a cheapskate solution when the North Peckham area really needs a link into the west end. Rerouting the 139 from Trafalgar Square via the 12 to Walworth Road and then via the 343 route to Peckham would have been much better. The 13 could have been extended to Waterloo to compensate. The 21 and 453 can swap southern termini to provide a direct link between Elephant & Castle and Lewisham. It is not really nessassary to extend the 139 to Peckham, personally I think it wouldn't be a well used as the 136 simply because the majority of commuters end up getting on the tube. Areas like North Peckham & Walworth is where "The Hopper" can be made use of if people wish to travel by bus beyond the majority of bus users in that area only ever go a few stops, some of the punters probably don't even know where the heck Grove Park is let alone West Hampstead. I do wonder if people who use the 343 have ever used it to City Hall. That area was mainly crying out for a more frequent service and they got it, 15 Buses per hour then idiots like you just moan about everything.... Additionally buses in Central London are just becoming more useless and slower because of headway and general traffic. These ideas are just meaningless really. You may think the extension is cheap, it certainly isn't, it costs money. The amount of money which is probably being made from it. I imagine when the 136 goes up for tender it will attract quite a few bidders. Well done, another irrelevant load of drivel that I'm not going to waste my time responding too! |
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Post by twobellstogo on Oct 22, 2016 8:59:15 GMT
The problem is that the 136 is often quite well loaded by the time it gets to Southampton Way, I thought all along the 136 extension is a cheapskate solution when the North Peckham area really needs a link into the west end. Rerouting the 139 from Trafalgar Square via the 12 to Walworth Road and then via the 343 route to Peckham would have been much better. The 13 could have been extended to Waterloo to compensate. The 21 and 453 can swap southern termini to provide a direct link between Elephant & Castle and Lewisham. It is not really nessassary to extend the 139 to Peckham, personally I think it wouldn't be a well used as the 136 simply because the majority of commuters end up getting on the tube. Areas like North Peckham & Walworth is where "The Hopper" can be made use of if people wish to travel by bus beyond the majority of bus users in that area only ever go a few stops, some of the punters probably don't even know where the heck Grove Park is let alone West Hampstead. I do wonder if people who use the 343 have ever used it to City Hall. That area was mainly crying out for a more frequent service and they got it, 15 Buses per hour then idiots like you just moan about everything.... Additionally buses in Central London are just becoming more useless and slower because of headway and general traffic. These ideas are just meaningless really. You may think the extension is cheap, it certainly isn't, it costs money. The amount of money which is probably being made from it. I imagine when the 136 goes up for tender it will attract quite a few bidders. I don't think locals knowing where ultimate destinations are should influence route planners : if that were the case, let's cut the 89 back to Bexleyheath because an awful lot of people at the town end of the 89 haven't heard of Slade Green! That said, I'm leaning largely towards TL 1 here. The 136 extension has been popular, and the Lewisham - E&C link is a nice side effect. I don't know, especially with Hopper, that there's anything obvious that would be better than either the 136 or 343. I suppose you could possibly push the 136 on to Waterloo, or the 343 a short way into the City, but no more. I wouldn't cut the 21 back from Lewisham - in a way I think it was disappointing when the 21 was split way back when that the overlap between 21/321 wasn't bigger - Eltham - City would be a good link. Now the 21 goes north of Moorgate though, I'm not sure about extension to the south east, which I think is a great pity. I'd prefer a 21 Eltham - Moorgate and something else north of there, Where I will totally agree with sid is the 453. |
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Post by sid on Oct 22, 2016 11:44:51 GMT
It is not really nessassary to extend the 139 to Peckham, personally I think it wouldn't be a well used as the 136 simply because the majority of commuters end up getting on the tube. Areas like North Peckham & Walworth is where "The Hopper" can be made use of if people wish to travel by bus beyond the majority of bus users in that area only ever go a few stops, some of the punters probably don't even know where the heck Grove Park is let alone West Hampstead. I do wonder if people who use the 343 have ever used it to City Hall. That area was mainly crying out for a more frequent service and they got it, 15 Buses per hour then idiots like you just moan about everything.... Additionally buses in Central London are just becoming more useless and slower because of headway and general traffic. These ideas are just meaningless really. You may think the extension is cheap, it certainly isn't, it costs money. The amount of money which is probably being made from it. I imagine when the 136 goes up for tender it will attract quite a few bidders. I don't think locals knowing where ultimate destinations are should influence route planners : if that were the case, let's cut the 89 back to Bexleyheath because an awful lot of people at the town end of the 89 haven't heard of Slade Green! That said, I'm leaning largely towards TL 1 here. The 136 extension has been popular, and the Lewisham - E&C link is a nice side effect. I don't know, especially with Hopper, that there's anything obvious that would be better than either the 136 or 343. I suppose you could possibly push the 136 on to Waterloo, or the 343 a short way into the City, but no more. I wouldn't cut the 21 back from Lewisham - in a way I think it was disappointing when the 21 was split way back when that the overlap between 21/321 wasn't bigger - Eltham - City would be a good link. Now the 21 goes north of Moorgate though, I'm not sure about extension to the south east, which I think is a great pity. I'd prefer a 21 Eltham - Moorgate and something else north of there, Where I will totally agree with sid is the 453. Well exactly and on that basis the 21 would never go to Newington Green as many people in SE London won't know where it is. The 136 hasn't been a disaster by any means but people are still being left behind in the morning peak and no doubt many want to go further than E&C. Rerouting the 453 to Lewisham would be the easiest way to provide a direct link from Lewisham to E&C and indeed the west end but I think something else would have to be removed to avoid overbusing. I've often thought there is a case for an X21 peak hour express between Sidcup and Moorgate but as it competes directly with Southeastern it probably wouldn't be considered. |
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Post by londontravel on Oct 22, 2016 16:40:17 GMT
With the 436 being withdrawn between Vauxhall and Paddington, Lewisham will lose a link to the west end, which considering it is in zone 2 is pretty poor, however the hopper ticket makes up for that (if you can change buses in under an hour). I think the 36 or 453 should be extended to Lewisham, as not everyone wants to change buses when a link has been removed. In terms of North Peckham, maybe extend the 177 to Waterloo?
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Post by 700101 on Oct 22, 2016 18:11:13 GMT
Extending the 177 would cause the route problems, especially with traffic in Greenwich at times. I agree with the 453 extension with it extended via 47/225 to Lewisham as this would be the best option which could in turn allow 1 or 2 routes from Lewisham extend to Deptford Bridge to use the vacant bus stand
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Post by snoggle on Oct 23, 2016 21:57:20 GMT
With the 436 being withdrawn between Vauxhall and Paddington, Lewisham will lose a link to the west end, which considering it is in zone 2 is pretty poor, however the hopper ticket makes up for that (if you can change buses in under an hour). I think the 36 or 453 should be extended to Lewisham, as not everyone wants to change buses when a link has been removed. In terms of North Peckham, maybe extend the 177 to Waterloo? The problem, though, is that the 36 is very frequent meaning a shed load of extra buses just to extend to Lewisham. TfL are clearly convinced that demand out of Lewisham has fallen given they are happy to reduce the 436's frequency. The other suggestion from Gerard of extending other routes from Lewisham if the 453 was extended is what do you extend. All of the double deck routes terminating in Lewisham from the south or east are already very long. This leaves single deck routes which would be grossly overloaded if extended towards E&C via Peckham or the Old Kent Road corridor. Looking at the bus map there are not many options to create genuinely sensible new routes or links. There are two major areas coming up for development which will generate some funding - Convoys Wharf and New Bermondsey (near Millwall). The only three double deck routes that could probably tolerate some tweaking / extending are the 1, 199 and 415. I'd be quite tempted to extend the 1 on via Convoys Wharf, Deptford, Blackheath Rd, Lewisham Rd into Lewisham or even out towards Lee Green to give a new cross Lewisham service. The 1 is not chronically overloaded based on the stats so could cope with being extended and the frequency is not too high as to give TfL nightmares. We already know the 415 is tentatively pencilled in to reach Canada Water via New Bermondsey. |
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