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Post by DE20106 on Mar 2, 2018 18:31:43 GMT
I've seen many packed 74s in Central London, especially along Baker Street. The Central London section can be busy, although from my observations they're pretty empty by Baker Street, but it was the South Kensington to Putney Bridge section that was being referred to, no need for two routes? Definitely agree no need for the two routes between that section. Problem is if you cut the 430 back to Putney Bridge there would be barely be a route left  |
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Post by snoggle on Mar 2, 2018 18:31:57 GMT
This is a bus forum and if people don't like a particular thread there is no requirement to partake in it. Yes it is a FORUM. Are you now in charge of it? How many times? - do not tell me what to do unless you are in a position of authority on this forum! |
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Post by fg49 on Mar 2, 2018 18:32:37 GMT
I doubt you'll be able to get everyone on the 74 seeing as they normally turn up packed! The 430 provides the necessary capacity along this corridor especially after the latest cuts. Turn up where packed? Even at peak hours there's fresh air on that section. Apologies. From South Kensington. Quite often you're pretty much forced onto the 430 speaking from experience, the 74 would not cope alone. |
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Post by sid on Mar 2, 2018 18:34:21 GMT
This is a bus forum and if people don't like a particular thread there is no requirement to partake in it. Yes it is a FORUM. Are you now in charge of it? How many times? - do not tell me what to do unless you are in a position of authority on this forum! Well pardon me but that's exactly what you're trying to do to everyone else!! |
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Post by sid on Mar 2, 2018 18:37:53 GMT
Turn up where packed? Even at peak hours there's fresh air on that section. Apologies. From South Kensington. Quite often you're pretty much forced onto the 430 speaking from experience, the 74 would not cope alone. Well that's certainly not been my experience, plenty of room on most 74's and the 430 almost empty. |
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Post by ctrh136 on Mar 2, 2018 18:50:58 GMT
215; 357; 20; 330; 363; 403 I'm not sure about the East London routes as I don't get over there much nowadays but I think the 363 needs double deckers, the 403 only gets busy at peak times, but not as busy as it used to in LCBS days when there was a peak hour 403 Express. Citaro's would probably be ideal for the 403 and it wouldn't have to use Sussex Road either. Would need a pretty big frequency increase for single deckers in the peak times, though evenings aren't that busy. Not sure it would justify 24 hour as useful as I would find it! Also the 403 needs double deckers for school loads to Warlingham School. |
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Post by sid on Mar 2, 2018 18:56:51 GMT
I'm not sure about the East London routes as I don't get over there much nowadays but I think the 363 needs double deckers, the 403 only gets busy at peak times, but not as busy as it used to in LCBS days when there was a peak hour 403 Express. Citaro's would probably be ideal for the 403 and it wouldn't have to use Sussex Road either. Would need a pretty big frequency increase for single deckers in the peak times, though evenings aren't that busy. Not sure it would justify 24 hour as useful as I would find it! Also the 403 needs double deckers for school loads to Warlingham School. The route is rarely ever busy off peak, even peak hours aren't as busy as they once were in the days of the 403 Express. |
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Post by Arriva London Explorer on Mar 3, 2018 6:17:12 GMT
215; 357; 20; 330; 363; 403 Oh dear do we have to keep doing this ad nauseum with the same tedious list of routes. The 20 has very considerable school traffic flows at both ends of the route. Whether we like it or not it also acts as back up to the Central Line if it fails. It also has reasonable peak time flows. Yes it can be quiet on some off peak trips but we are back to the never ending debate about what is the optimum operating method - keeping double decks in service all day or playing a merry dance of swapping vehicle types at different times of day. The 357 can have very heavy peak flows and depending on how other performances it can pick up decent numbers of people if there are gaps. The 215 can have very heavy peak loadings and it also has surges of demand during times when the Camp Site is busy with foreign visitors. As I have said before full buses on Sunday mornings or weekday evenings are not unknown. Both the 357 and 215 can get with surges of demand for schools and college traffic. I have seen the 330 completely beseiged with passengers at Canning Town. It's one of those routes where people just turn up out of nowhere or where interchange from the tube ensures a very steady flow of passengers. Can't comment on the S London routes. I do wish we could move on from people making suggestions based on what sometimes looks like 2 or 3 observations of a route at a single point on that route. That is in no way properly representative of how a route performs or is used. You need a large sample size with observations across an entire route. I have over 30 years of seeing and using bus services in Waltham Forest and somewhat less elsewhere in East London. That's why I feel qualified to comment on those routes. I rarely comment on South or West London routes as my use of them is pretty sparse so anything I see is naturally very limited in the wider scheme of things. If I do comment I try to ensure that I qualify any remarks I make. I use the 330 often on weekdays and its one of my local routes when I was living in Upton Park |
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Post by Arriva London Explorer on Mar 3, 2018 6:18:45 GMT
Oh dear do we have to keep doing this ad nauseum with the same tedious list of routes. The 20 has very considerable school traffic flows at both ends of the route. Whether we like it or not it also acts as back up to the Central Line if it fails. It also has reasonable peak time flows. Yes it can be quiet on some off peak trips but we are back to the never ending debate about what is the optimum operating method - keeping double decks in service all day or playing a merry dance of swapping vehicle types at different times of day. The 357 can have very heavy peak flows and depending on how other performances it can pick up decent numbers of people if there are gaps. The 215 can have very heavy peak loadings and it also has surges of demand during times when the Camp Site is busy with foreign visitors. As I have said before full buses on Sunday mornings or weekday evenings are not unknown. Both the 357 and 215 can get with surges of demand for schools and college traffic. I have seen the 330 completely beseiged with passengers at Canning Town. It's one of those routes where people just turn up out of nowhere or where interchange from the tube ensures a very steady flow of passengers. Can't comment on the S London routes. I do wish we could move on from people making suggestions based on what sometimes looks like 2 or 3 observations of a route at a single point on that route. That is in no way properly representative of how a route performs or is used. You need a large sample size with observations across an entire route. I have over 30 years of seeing and using bus services in Waltham Forest and somewhat less elsewhere in East London. That's why I feel qualified to comment on those routes. I rarely comment on South or West London routes as my use of them is pretty sparse so anything I see is naturally very limited in the wider scheme of things. If I do comment I try to ensure that I qualify any remarks I make. I use the 330 often on weekdays and its one of my local routes when I was living in Upton Park Faor enough of appricicate your opinion |
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Post by MetrolineGA1511 on Mar 3, 2018 12:28:11 GMT
The 430 is a weird one because although I only ever see it carry fresh air, it’s PVR, length and usage figures are very similar to that of the 196, a route which double deckers are definitely justified (about 4.1 million a year) so what’s the 430 doing differently? The 430 isn't really needed at all between Putney Bridge and South Kensington, the 74 is more than adequate. The difference is that route 430 goes direct from South Kensington to West Brompton avoiding Earl's Court. If route 430 were to be be withdrawn, route 345 could be extended to West Brompton and route 74 to Roehampton. |
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Post by sid on Mar 3, 2018 13:01:39 GMT
The 430 isn't really needed at all between Putney Bridge and South Kensington, the 74 is more than adequate. The difference is that route 430 goes direct from South Kensington to West Brompton avoiding Earl's Court. If route 430 were to be be withdrawn, route 345 could be extended to West Brompton and route 74 to Roehampton. Or extend the 190 from West Brompton to South Kensington. |
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Post by MetrolineGA1511 on Mar 3, 2018 13:08:13 GMT
The difference is that route 430 goes direct from South Kensington to West Brompton avoiding Earl's Court. If route 430 were to be be withdrawn, route 345 could be extended to West Brompton and route 74 to Roehampton. Or extend the 190 from West Brompton to South Kensington. This would actually be better than route 345. It would provide replacement direct buses from Lillie Bridge Road to South Kensington, and intriguingly a through bus from South Kensington to Richmond. |
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Post by VWH1414 on Mar 3, 2018 16:53:43 GMT
215; 357; 20; 330; 363; 403 292 Erm really? Have you used the 292 during rush hour? I agree with @cobo this should stay DD, it needs it |
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Post by Arriva London Explorer on Mar 3, 2018 16:55:11 GMT
Erm really? Have you used the 292 during rush hour? I agree with @cobo this should stay DD, it needs it Yes I have and it's not packed |
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Post by VWH1414 on Mar 3, 2018 17:20:31 GMT
Erm really? Have you used the 292 during rush hour? I agree with @cobo this should stay DD, it needs it Yes I have and it's not packed I've seen it in rush hour and it needs double decks, a bus doesn't have to be packed to the doors to be double deck Even in off peak it can see a fair bit of patronage |
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