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Post by vjaska on May 29, 2019 1:45:42 GMT
In an ideal world the 53 would be restored to Oxford Street, or Trafalgar Square at the very least, I’d extend the 453 to Camden or Parliament Hill Fields, restoring the old 53 routing and creating a much needed SE-N/NW London link. Extend the 160 to either Forest Hill or to Brockley, the further create cross SE London links an N160 could run from Lewisham at weekends if there is demand. I mentioned in a earlier post about a Woolwich to Docklands bus route via Blackwall Tunnel, how feasible would and extension to the 472 be? I know the Jubilee line sort of serves this purpose and CrossRail from Abbey Wood would also fill the gap, but with buses being cheaper, low income commuters should have alternatives too Extending the 453 to Camden is probably doable but Parliament Hill Fields is a too much plus there isn't any space there for a second high frequency route with the 88 already standing there. You also have the added issue of finding a new home for the 453's LT's as they cannot negotiate the roundabout at Parliament Hill Fields which is why the 88 reverted back to standard buses. Extending the 453 to Camden would also see some people come out and say the corridor is grossly overbussed given the many remarks surrounding the C2. I also wouldn't choose the 472 to cross the river as it would cost more and I feel it's importance this side of the river shouldn't be undone by having to suffer the inevitable delays the Blackwall Tunnel brings. The 422 would be a cheaper option but isn't direct like the 472 & runs into the same traffic congested issue. A new route might be the best way to achieve that particular aim. |
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Post by sid on May 29, 2019 5:38:44 GMT
Route 36 withdrawn between New Cross and Peckham, also between Paddington and Queens Park. Frequency reduced to 10 minutes Mon-Sat daytime, 15 minutes evenings and Sundays. Route 171 withdrawn between Bellingham and Brockley Rise and between Camberwell and Elephant and Castle but rerouted from Camberwell to Victoria Coach Station (via Victoria Station and Buckingham Palace Road, frequency reduced to 10 minutes Mon-Sat 15 minutes Sundays and evenings. Route 172 extended from Brockley Rise to Bellingham, replacing withdrawn section of 171. New route 82 Wilsden Junction Station to Victoria Station via Kensal Green and Queens Park then current route 36. Frequency 7-8 minutes Mon-Sat daytime, 15 minutes evenings and Sundays. The 36 should stay untouched, if anything I’d restore the Paddington section of the 436, aside from that until recently the 36/136/436 group routes worked pretty well together The Queens Park section of the 36 is over bussed and if the 436 was returned to Paddington the 36 would have to be reduced accordingly. |
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Post by cl54 on May 29, 2019 6:07:16 GMT
In an ideal world the 53 would be restored to Oxford Street, or Trafalgar Square at the very least, I’d extend the 453 to Camden or Parliament Hill Fields, restoring the old 53 routing and creating a much needed SE-N/NW London link. Extend the 160 to either Forest Hill or to Brockley, the further create cross SE London links an N160 could run from Lewisham at weekends if there is demand. I mentioned in a earlier post about a Woolwich to Docklands bus route via Blackwall Tunnel, how feasible would and extension to the 472 be? I know the Jubilee line sort of serves this purpose and CrossRail from Abbey Wood would also fill the gap, but with buses being cheaper, low income commuters should have alternatives too Extending the 453 to Camden is probably doable but Parliament Hill Fields is a too much plus there isn't any space there for a second high frequency route with the 88 already standing there. You also have the added issue of finding a new home for the 453's LT's as they cannot negotiate the roundabout at Parliament Hill Fields which is why the 88 reverted back to standard buses. Extending the 453 to Camden would also see some people come out and say the corridor is grossly overbussed given the many remarks surrounding the C2. I also wouldn't choose the 472 to cross the river as it would cost more and I feel it's importance this side of the river shouldn't be undone by having to suffer the inevitable delays the Blackwall Tunnel brings. The 422 would be a cheaper option but isn't direct like the 472 & runs into the same traffic congested issue. A new route might be the best way to achieve that particular aim. The DLR already links Woolwich & Docklands. No traffic congestion to delay your journey. Extending the 422 or 472 through the existing Blackwall Tunnel would present a slight problem. Both are double deck routes and the northbound tunnel can only accommodate single deckers. More routes have been promised once the Silvertown Tunnel opens which will have a lorry/bus lane in each direction and be able to be used by double deckers. |
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Post by vjaska on May 29, 2019 23:57:58 GMT
Extending the 453 to Camden is probably doable but Parliament Hill Fields is a too much plus there isn't any space there for a second high frequency route with the 88 already standing there. You also have the added issue of finding a new home for the 453's LT's as they cannot negotiate the roundabout at Parliament Hill Fields which is why the 88 reverted back to standard buses. Extending the 453 to Camden would also see some people come out and say the corridor is grossly overbussed given the many remarks surrounding the C2. I also wouldn't choose the 472 to cross the river as it would cost more and I feel it's importance this side of the river shouldn't be undone by having to suffer the inevitable delays the Blackwall Tunnel brings. The 422 would be a cheaper option but isn't direct like the 472 & runs into the same traffic congested issue. A new route might be the best way to achieve that particular aim. The DLR already links Woolwich & Docklands. No traffic congestion to delay your journey. Extending the 422 or 472 through the existing Blackwall Tunnel would present a slight problem. Both are double deck routes and the northbound tunnel can only accommodate single deckers. More routes have been promised once the Silvertown Tunnel opens which will have a lorry/bus lane in each direction and be able to be used by double deckers. Thanks but I'm aware of all that and the reason I didn't mention the height restriction in the Blackwall Tunnel is because it's well known among people  |
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Post by cl54 on May 30, 2019 13:03:33 GMT
The DLR already links Woolwich & Docklands. No traffic congestion to delay your journey. Extending the 422 or 472 through the existing Blackwall Tunnel would present a slight problem. Both are double deck routes and the northbound tunnel can only accommodate single deckers. More routes have been promised once the Silvertown Tunnel opens which will have a lorry/bus lane in each direction and be able to be used by double deckers. Thanks but I'm aware of all that and the reason I didn't mention the height restriction in the Blackwall Tunnel is because it's well known among people From today's TfL Press Release The tunnel will also significantly improve cross-river public transport connections, with around 37 buses an hour in each direction using the tunnel, including the current six single-decker buses per hour which run through the Blackwall Tunnel. All of the new double-decker buses that use the Silvertown Tunnel are expected to be zero-emission from launch. These routes will link places such as Stratford and Canary Wharf to Eltham, Grove Park and Charlton for the first time, unlocking new journey options and supporting wider regeneration across the Greenwich Peninsula and Royal Docks. |
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Post by vjaska on May 30, 2019 13:47:03 GMT
Thanks but I'm aware of all that and the reason I didn't mention the height restriction in the Blackwall Tunnel is because it's well known among people From today's TfL Press Release The tunnel will also significantly improve cross-river public transport connections, with around 37 buses an hour in each direction using the tunnel, including the current six single-decker buses per hour which run through the Blackwall Tunnel. All of the new double-decker buses that use the Silvertown Tunnel are expected to be zero-emission from launch. These routes will link places such as Stratford and Canary Wharf to Eltham, Grove Park and Charlton for the first time, unlocking new journey options and supporting wider regeneration across the Greenwich Peninsula and Royal Docks. Sorry but what does this have to do with my post? |
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Post by cl54 on May 30, 2019 16:12:32 GMT
From today's TfL Press Release The tunnel will also significantly improve cross-river public transport connections, with around 37 buses an hour in each direction using the tunnel, including the current six single-decker buses per hour which run through the Blackwall Tunnel. All of the new double-decker buses that use the Silvertown Tunnel are expected to be zero-emission from launch. These routes will link places such as Stratford and Canary Wharf to Eltham, Grove Park and Charlton for the first time, unlocking new journey options and supporting wider regeneration across the Greenwich Peninsula and Royal Docks. Sorry but what does this have to do with my post? The thread is about cross river links. |
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Post by vjaska on May 30, 2019 18:26:05 GMT
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Post by route53 on Jun 7, 2019 17:49:53 GMT
This is month the 53 is finally cut back just south of the river :-( bit of a travesty that such an iconic route is being butchered that way.
I hope in the future that a different mayor will restore this route back to the West End, at least to Victoria or Aldwych.
The only good decision regarding the 53 recently was when made to run fast from E&C to OKR via Bricklayer’s Arms flyover, I would say the route and others like it need to be sped up though.
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Post by rif153 on Jun 7, 2019 19:19:33 GMT
This is month the 53 is finally cut back just south of the river :-( bit of a travesty that such an iconic route is being butchered that way. I hope in the future that a different mayor will restore this route back to the West End, at least to Victoria or Aldwych. The only good decision regarding the 53 recently was when made to run fast from E&C to OKR via Bricklayer’s Arms flyover, I would say the route and others like it need to be sped up though. I'm devastated to see the 53 being cutback to Lambeth North but I've ranted about how much it angers me enough. I really wish TFL would create an X53 from Oxford Circus-Plumstead but sadly TFL wouldn't create a new bus route linking Woolwich to Central London when Crossrail is supposed to be coming soon (although we've all heard that one before!) neverthless its a travesty that some of the useful links provided by the 53 are to be lost. TFL would argue that the 53 is superfluous on Whitehall but they fail to realise that 53's have only just begun so cannot be expected to be full yet despite that buses are still healthily loaded before having reached the stop 'Lower Marsh'. Don't even get me started on the frequency cut |
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Post by vjaska on Jun 7, 2019 20:37:06 GMT
This is month the 53 is finally cut back just south of the river :-( bit of a travesty that such an iconic route is being butchered that way. I hope in the future that a different mayor will restore this route back to the West End, at least to Victoria or Aldwych. The only good decision regarding the 53 recently was when made to run fast from E&C to OKR via Bricklayer’s Arms flyover, I would say the route and others like it need to be sped up though. I don't think that will ever happen - personally, after the nonsensical slashing of Central London routes that will soon go ahead, the Central London will be finished and I predict, possibly for good sadly. |
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Post by route53 on Jun 7, 2019 23:41:59 GMT
This is month the 53 is finally cut back just south of the river :-( bit of a travesty that such an iconic route is being butchered that way. I hope in the future that a different mayor will restore this route back to the West End, at least to Victoria or Aldwych. The only good decision regarding the 53 recently was when made to run fast from E&C to OKR via Bricklayer’s Arms flyover, I would say the route and others like it need to be sped up though. I'm devastated to see the 53 being cutback to Lambeth North but I've ranted about how much it angers me enough. I really wish TFL would create an X53 from Oxford Circus-Plumstead but sadly TFL wouldn't create a new bus route linking Woolwich to Central London when Crossrail is supposed to be coming soon (although we've all heard that one before!) neverthless its a travesty that some of the useful links provided by the 53 are to be lost. TFL would argue that the 53 is superfluous on Whitehall but they fail to realise that 53's have only just begun so cannot be expected to be full yet despite that buses are still healthily loaded before having reached the stop 'Lower Marsh'. Don't even get me started on the frequency cut I too would love for the X53 to return, calling from Thamesmead then, Plumstead, Woolwich, Charlton, Blackheath non stop to E&C then on to Oxford Street, however the eastbound fast section between E&C and Old Kent Road is as close as we’re ever going to get in terms of an “express” service. The TfL’s CrossRail reason for me isn’t truly valid, since the 53 doesn’t really parallel the new line at all, they only meet at Woolwich, then literally take different routes into Central London. There is also a matter that buses will always be cheaper than by train or tube, and i rarely see a 53 bus carrying air, so demand for the 53 will never die, TfL thought that the Jubilee line at North Greenwich (which is some miles away from Plumstead & Woolwich) would be enough to kill the route off west of E&C, so much so they killed off the X53 entirely, but twenty years on and the 53 is still busy and bustling They have always had it in for the 53, in fact TfL seems to have it in for SE London as a whole, I remember when the 177 was systematically cut back then finally rerouted to Peckham in the early 1990s, then the 109 was chopped at Brixton with no real replacement northbound. |
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Post by route53 on Jun 7, 2019 23:45:29 GMT
This is month the 53 is finally cut back just south of the river :-( bit of a travesty that such an iconic route is being butchered that way. I hope in the future that a different mayor will restore this route back to the West End, at least to Victoria or Aldwych. The only good decision regarding the 53 recently was when made to run fast from E&C to OKR via Bricklayer’s Arms flyover, I would say the route and others like it need to be sped up though. I don't think that will ever happen - personally, after the nonsensical slashing of Central London routes that will soon go ahead, the Central London will be finished and I predict, possibly for good sadly. Your spot on in your point regarding Central London, people’s habits have changed for a number of reasons in London, more people staying local because it’s cheaper, also there are new hubs popping up all over London now, The Docklands, the new creative hub at Greenwich Peninsula which is going to develop throughout the 2020s, Stratford City, gentrification of areas like Brixton, Peckham & Hackney, have all largely replaced Central London, and the bus cuts don’t help |
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Post by vjaska on Jun 8, 2019 0:58:02 GMT
I'm devastated to see the 53 being cutback to Lambeth North but I've ranted about how much it angers me enough. I really wish TFL would create an X53 from Oxford Circus-Plumstead but sadly TFL wouldn't create a new bus route linking Woolwich to Central London when Crossrail is supposed to be coming soon (although we've all heard that one before!) neverthless its a travesty that some of the useful links provided by the 53 are to be lost. TFL would argue that the 53 is superfluous on Whitehall but they fail to realise that 53's have only just begun so cannot be expected to be full yet despite that buses are still healthily loaded before having reached the stop 'Lower Marsh'. Don't even get me started on the frequency cut then the 109 was chopped at Brixton with no real replacement northbound. The 109 north of Brixton was replaced as part of the scheme of South London routes that were all restructured at the same time - the 159 was re-routed via Westminster Bridge and given a Sunday service matching the routing the 109 took whilst also being diverted to Marble Arch and then the N159 replacing the N109 running from Marble Arch to New Addington with the new N68 taking over the Coulsdon section a year after the N159 was born and then running further on to Old Coulsdon (the old N109 alternated south of Croydon with journeys split between running to New Addington or to Coulsdon). The current 59 was created at the same time as the 159's re-routing and finally gave a Waterloo to Brixton link that I've appreciated over the years. The 60 was also restructured from a Clapham Common to South Croydon Garage route to the present routing, Streatham to Old Coulsdon with the 255 being born and running from Pollards Hill to Clapham Common and the 50 cut back from Old Coulsdon to South Croydon. If the 109 was retained in it's overlapping form, it's northern leg would of become quite unreliable (the overlapping sections were Trafalgar Square to Croydon, Park Street & Brixton to Purley) as doing a 109 now can take an eternity due to the A23 and heading in & out of Central London nowadays is awful at times. |
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Post by londonboy71 on Jun 8, 2019 6:46:30 GMT
53 used to go Plumstead to Camden Town
109 to Victoria Embankment
108 Crystal Palce to Bromley By Bow( Seven Stars)
54 Woolwich to Croydon
12 Park Royal/ Harlesden to South Croydon London's longest Route
726 ( now X26) Heathrow to Gravesend
88 Acton Green to Banstead
Happy Days
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