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Post by southlondonbus on Nov 18, 2024 18:12:53 GMT
I am personally hoping that the D8 will get Electroliners, though BZLs would seem like a more logical choice to provide a common fleet with the 58 and W13, plus being able to take the length given the route used Omnicities in the past. Happy about the retain, much happier it didn't go to Go Ahead. In terms of the PVR, 7 buses seems harsh but it also kind of makes sense. A 3 minute wait can't be the worst, so I assume passengers will adapt. That makes the D3, D7 and D8 all electrified. Hoping the D6 is the same too! Also, was it mentioned what buses would be used for the Silvertown Tunnel shuttle? May even be an advantage if it gets a clockface timetable at bus stop as opposed to just every 12 mins.
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Post by yunus on Nov 18, 2024 18:19:37 GMT
Are the Metrocities on the W11 able to operate on the W16/19? In theory yes given they are a similar length to the W16's MMC's & W19's normal allocation of Enviro 200's (when not having to cover for the W12's impending electrics) and the W19 in particular can take anything up to 10.8m Thanks Hopefully one will stray on when I am not out and about in the area š.
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Post by yunus on Nov 18, 2024 19:48:08 GMT
Created a list of Stagecoach London bus routes that are 100% guaranteed to operate with Diesel buses currently & in the foreseeable future with NO Hybrid or Electric strays possible/expected.
This is based on the vehicles at the operating garage + suitable length/width for the individual route/s.
*East London*
Ash Grove (HK): 309, 310 & 394.
Barking (BK): 167, 362 & 462.
Rainham (RM): 346 only.
Romford (NS): 193 only.
*Selkent*
Kangley Bridge (KB): all routes - 181, 284 & 356.
Catford (TL): 124, 225 & 273.
Plumstead (PD): 380 only.
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Post by DE20106 on Nov 18, 2024 19:51:34 GMT
I wouldnāt write off the 393 that quickly, there are a lot of 9.7 routes which then saw 10.2 workings. The 450, W19 and the nearby 234 are good examples. It could always be that a stray is fine, but issues happen if thereās a full allocation, like when two vehicles meet on tight roads. But having said that the Kites are certainly bulky vehicles so I wouldnāt be surprised if they never touch the 393 I guess there are not many routes including SDs that are safe from Hybrid or Electric strays... Depends really if the garage has any buses other than Diesels to start off with. For example, once the 225 moves to TL it will not have strays as the only other SD routes are the 124 & 273 which use Diesel buses. Sorry for being a tad off topic from Metroline Copied from Stagecoach, I think itās likely weāll see strays from the 181 and 284. KB is an outstation of TL so itās likely the 181ās and 284ās vehicles will get blinded up and will interchange with the 225ās buses. I know the 284 is pretty heavily restricted to its 10.5s, so the 284 will likely remain isolated. Iād love to see some TfL interior buses on the 181 though
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Post by yunus on Nov 18, 2024 19:58:54 GMT
I guess there are not many routes including SDs that are safe from Hybrid or Electric strays... Depends really if the garage has any buses other than Diesels to start off with. For example, once the 225 moves to TL it will not have strays as the only other SD routes are the 124 & 273 which use Diesel buses. Sorry for being a tad off topic from Metroline Copied from Stagecoach, I think itās likely weāll see strays from the 181 and 284. KB is an outstation of TL so itās likely the 181ās and 284ās vehicles will get blinded up and will interchange with the 225ās buses. I know the 284 is pretty heavily restricted to its 10.5s, so the 284 will likely remain isolated. Iād love to see some TfL interior buses on the 181 though Yes your correct there but I meant strays of a different type of engined vehicle e.g Hybrid or electric which TL & KB do not & will not have for the foreseeable future thankfully š
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Post by adl on Nov 18, 2024 20:08:01 GMT
Created a list of Stagecoach London bus routes that are 100% guaranteed to operate with Diesel buses currently & in the foreseeable future with NO Hybrid or Electric strays possible/expected. This is based on the vehicles at the operating garage + suitable length/width for the individual route/s. *East London* Ash Grove (HK): 309, 310 & 394. Barking (BK): 167, 362 & 462. Rainham (RM): 346 only. Romford (NS): 193 & 296. *Selkent* Kangley Bridge (KB): all routes - 181, 284 & 356. Catford (TL): 124, 225 & 273. Plumstead (PD): 380 only. Iām going to have to disagree with the 296 whilst yes looking at it from a single deck perspective it has no chance but the route is cleared for double deckers and with route 86/247 going electric and the 128 up for tender next year itās constantly going to reduce the amount of diesels at NS and if NS choose they can put a DD out on the 296 which soon electrics will be in greater numbers than the diesel fleet. Arguably itās not safe to say the 193 is going to be diesel for long as itās dependent on the tender result, whilst I can see a retain using its existing fleet itās not out of the question for it to be awarded with electrics especially since the others in tranche (And also at NS/RM) will alll need new replacements most likely if retained and weāve recently seen the 405/230 as the most recent example where it had complaint buses but had replacements. Iām pretty sure in recent months there was a member of Stagecoach state the 193 had TFL officials on board as well due to capacity issues or looking into the volumes at least but I havenāt heard anything since but the 193 is able to take 10.2/5m buses regularly so could receive a capacity increased SD. I donāt think 10.8m would be suitable for a full allocation.
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Post by DT 11 on Nov 18, 2024 20:09:50 GMT
I guess there are not many routes including SDs that are safe from Hybrid or Electric strays... Depends really if the garage has any buses other than Diesels to start off with. For example, once the 225 moves to TL it will not have strays as the only other SD routes are the 124 & 273 which use Diesel buses. Sorry for being a tad off topic from Metroline Copied from Stagecoach, I think itās likely weāll see strays from the 181 and 284. KB is an outstation of TL so itās likely the 181ās and 284ās vehicles will get blinded up and will interchange with the 225ās buses. I know the 284 is pretty heavily restricted to its 10.5s, so the 284 will likely remain isolated. Iād love to see some TfL interior buses on the 181 though Most of the 181s buses have received new blinds itās noticeable because Grove Park is Larger and Lewisham Station is not squashed also the 273 batch as well the numbers ā124 & 273 356ā are larger and bolder. No 10.4m bus from Route 284 36665, 36671-36684 bus has received a new blind set from my observations.
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Post by yunus on Nov 18, 2024 20:12:31 GMT
Created a list of Stagecoach London bus routes that are 100% guaranteed to operate with Diesel buses currently & in the foreseeable future with NO Hybrid or Electric strays possible/expected. This is based on the vehicles at the operating garage + suitable length/width for the individual route/s. *East London* Ash Grove (HK): 309, 310 & 394. Barking (BK): 167, 362 & 462. Rainham (RM): 346 only. Romford (NS): 193 & 296. *Selkent* Kangley Bridge (KB): all routes - 181, 284 & 356. Catford (TL): 124, 225 & 273. Plumstead (PD): 380 only. Iām going to have to disagree with the 296 whilst yes looking at it from a single deck perspective it has no chance but the route is cleared for double deckers and with route 86/247 going electric and the 128 up for tender next year itās constantly going to reduce the amount of diesels at NS and if NS choose they can put a DD out on the 296 which soon electrics will be in greater numbers than the diesel fleet. Arguably itās not safe to say the 193 is going to be diesel for long as itās dependent on the tender result, whilst I can see a retain using its existing fleet itās not out of the question for it to be awarded with electrics especially since the others in tranche (And also at NS/RM) will alll need new replacements Ā most likely if retained and weāve recently seen the 405/230 as the most recent example where it had complaint buses but had replacements.Ā What it means is safe for the foreseeable future - not the longer term. Yes the 193 could indeed be retained with MMCs or receive a new fleet of EVs. Tbh I am not sure if the current EVs on the 86 & 247 would be able to fit on the 296? The section from Marks Gate to the A12 may be an issue but happy to be corrected. If so I will remove it but as NS currently have no EV single deckers the 193 remains safe.
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Post by adl on Nov 18, 2024 20:17:04 GMT
TfL will be conducting loading surveys on Route 193 during the AM due to capacity issues Here is post I mentioned in above post, not so recent as I imagined a year ago Nonetheless I do wonder what the outcome was.
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Post by adl on Nov 18, 2024 20:19:42 GMT
Iām going to have to disagree with the 296 whilst yes looking at it from a single deck perspective it has no chance but the route is cleared for double deckers and with route 86/247 going electric and the 128 up for tender next year itās constantly going to reduce the amount of diesels at NS and if NS choose they can put a DD out on the 296 which soon electrics will be in greater numbers than the diesel fleet. Arguably itās not safe to say the 193 is going to be diesel for long as itās dependent on the tender result, whilst I can see a retain using its existing fleet itās not out of the question for it to be awarded with electrics especially since the others in tranche (And also at NS/RM) will alll need new replacements most likely if retained and weāve recently seen the 405/230 as the most recent example where it had complaint buses but had replacements. What it means is safe for the foreseeable future - not the longer term. Yes the 193 could indeed be retained with MMCs or receive a new fleet of EVs. Tbh I am not sure if the current EVs on the 86 & 247 would be able to fit on the 296? The section from Marks Gate to the A12 may be an issue but happy to be corrected. If so I will remove it but as NS currently have no EV single deckers the 193 remains safe. There are no restrictions on the 296, apart from Marks Gate itās a straight line route, deckers run on the 296 without any issue as well and 10.8m single decks to length and height are not issues. EDIT: It just occurred to me as well, the 62 runs along the majority of the section at Marks Gate, AKA double decker route.
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Post by DE20106 on Nov 18, 2024 20:25:19 GMT
TfL will be conducting loading surveys on Route 193 during the AM due to capacity issues Here is post I mentioned in above post, not so recent as I imagined a year agoĀ Ā Nonetheless I do wonder what the outcome was. They need to send some āloading surveyorsā out on the 195 š š how that still runs at every 12 minutes really is beyond me (not stagecoach related I know)
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Post by yunus on Nov 18, 2024 20:25:28 GMT
What it means is safe for the foreseeable future - not the longer term. Yes the 193 could indeed be retained with MMCs or receive a new fleet of EVs. Tbh I am not sure if the current EVs on the 86 & 247 would be able to fit on the 296? The section from Marks Gate to the A12 may be an issue but happy to be corrected. If so I will remove it but as NS currently have no EV single deckers the 193 remains safe. There are no restrictions on the 296, apart from Marks Gate itās a straight line route, deckers run on the 296 without any issue as well and 10.8m single decks to length and height are not issues.Ā EDIT: It just occurred to me as well, the 62 runs along the majority of the section at Marks Gate, AKA double decker route. Thanks I never knew so we could potentially see an EV stray onto the 296, I will edit my post. That leaves the 193 safe but only for now.
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