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Post by greg on Jul 30, 2024 21:02:36 GMT
I’ve suggested this previously but breaking the well established links from Kensington to Strand is out of the question here. It never seems to be particularly busy on that stretch to be honest. I think going up via Chinatown to TCR and perhaps beyond would be far more popular. But then you'd subject the 14 to the same issue -- the Aldwych isn't really that big of a passenger source.
I guess one could argue that it would create new links as the 14 currently parallels the Picc, so sending it to Aldwych would give it a new market (though it remains very busy despite following the tube!).
I personally think the 14 to Aldwych would completely kill the route. The amount of people who board at Cambridge Circus could be enough to support a whole academic year group. They come frequently and they are packed. It is only slightly empty in the Russel Square direction, but obviously because well it’s about to terminate. The empty route is the 38. As a local perspective.
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Post by 06transport on Jul 30, 2024 22:17:13 GMT
Brixton Road corridor changes:
45 - Withdrawn between Brixton Hill and Clapham Park. Instead extended via 333 LOR to Tooting Broadway - creating a direct link between Tooting/Streatham and Camberwell. 59 - Rerouted at Brixton Hill to terminate at Clapham Park via current 45 LOR. 333 - Withdrawn between Brixton Bus Garage and Tooting Broadway, and Stockwell to Elephant & Castle. Instead extended from Stockwell to Vauxhall via current 2 LOR - creating a direct link from Streatham to Vauxhall. Frequency reduced to 12mins (Mon-Sun). 159 Night Service - Withdrawn, replaced by changed to N109. N109 - Frequency enhanced to 20mins (Sun/Mon-Thu/Fri Nights) 15mins (Fri/Sat-Sat/Sun Nights to compensate withdrawal of 159's Night Service.
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Post by vjaska on Jul 31, 2024 1:24:52 GMT
Brixton Road corridor changes:
45 - Withdrawn between Brixton Hill and Clapham Park. Instead extended via 333 LOR to Tooting Broadway - creating a direct link between Tooting/Streatham and Camberwell. 59 - Rerouted at Brixton Hill to terminate at Clapham Park via current 45 LOR. 333 - Withdrawn between Brixton Bus Garage and Tooting Broadway, and Stockwell to Elephant & Castle. Instead extended from Stockwell to Vauxhall via current 2 LOR - creating a direct link from Streatham to Vauxhall. Frequency reduced to 12mins (Mon-Sun). 159 Night Service - Withdrawn, replaced by changed to N109. N109 - Frequency enhanced to 20mins (Sun/Mon-Thu/Fri Nights) 15mins (Fri/Sat-Sat/Sun Nights to compensate withdrawal of 159's Night Service. Streatham doesn't require a link to Vauxhall as Vauxhall is merely a interchange hub with limited facilities. Anyone from Streatham is travelling to Brixton to connect to the Victoria Line in any case. The frequency decrease to the 333 is highly unnecessary as the Brixton Hill & Streatham corridor requires a high level of frequency across it's routes for good reasons - it's not one of the most intensively used corridors in London for the fun of it. Just like with your 333 change, I can't see much demand from Tooting to Camberwell - people from Tooting have multiple options to access facilities that either equal or better what Camberwell has to offer. Streatham could have demand to Kings College Hospital but beyond that, can't see much demand to Camberwell itself and in any case, you'd be breaking existing links on the 45 from Clapham Park & Streatham Place Surgery to Kings College Hospital that the 59 will not cover for. So overall, as a local, no to these changes (159/N109 I'm neither here nor there)
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Post by bk10mfe on Jul 31, 2024 7:17:02 GMT
Brixton Road corridor changes:
45 - Withdrawn between Brixton Hill and Clapham Park. Instead extended via 333 LOR to Tooting Broadway - creating a direct link between Tooting/Streatham and Camberwell. 59 - Rerouted at Brixton Hill to terminate at Clapham Park via current 45 LOR. 333 - Withdrawn between Brixton Bus Garage and Tooting Broadway, and Stockwell to Elephant & Castle. Instead extended from Stockwell to Vauxhall via current 2 LOR - creating a direct link from Streatham to Vauxhall. Frequency reduced to 12mins (Mon-Sun). 159 Night Service - Withdrawn, replaced by changed to N109. N109 - Frequency enhanced to 20mins (Sun/Mon-Thu/Fri Nights) 15mins (Fri/Sat-Sat/Sun Nights to compensate withdrawal of 159's Night Service. Don’t really like these ideas either tbh. I do wonder if there is however merit in extending the 45 to Tooting but via the 355’s LOR instead. Stand space would probably be an issue, though the 45 could go to Balham once the 315 gets extended.
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Post by abellion on Jul 31, 2024 7:39:50 GMT
Brixton Road corridor changes:
45 - Withdrawn between Brixton Hill and Clapham Park. Instead extended via 333 LOR to Tooting Broadway - creating a direct link between Tooting/Streatham and Camberwell. 59 - Rerouted at Brixton Hill to terminate at Clapham Park via current 45 LOR. 333 - Withdrawn between Brixton Bus Garage and Tooting Broadway, and Stockwell to Elephant & Castle. Instead extended from Stockwell to Vauxhall via current 2 LOR - creating a direct link from Streatham to Vauxhall. Frequency reduced to 12mins (Mon-Sun). 159 Night Service - Withdrawn, replaced by changed to N109. N109 - Frequency enhanced to 20mins (Sun/Mon-Thu/Fri Nights) 15mins (Fri/Sat-Sat/Sun Nights to compensate withdrawal of 159's Night Service. Don’t really like these ideas either tbh. I do wonder if there is however merit in extending the 45 to Tooting but via the 355’s LOR instead. Stand space would probably be an issue, though the 45 could go to Balham once the 315 gets extended. The 355 should’ve been double decked, no need for the 45 to go anywhere as that would just be excessive. I don’t think a Balham extension would work particularly well either, the 45’s link to Camberwell is irrelevant to Tooting or Balham and one of the 355’s busiest links to and from Kings Avenue is out of the 45’s way. There is no bus from Brixton Hill to Balham but I don’t think that matters that much anyway
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Post by greenboy on Jul 31, 2024 7:59:41 GMT
Brixton Road corridor changes:
45 - Withdrawn between Brixton Hill and Clapham Park. Instead extended via 333 LOR to Tooting Broadway - creating a direct link between Tooting/Streatham and Camberwell. 59 - Rerouted at Brixton Hill to terminate at Clapham Park via current 45 LOR. 333 - Withdrawn between Brixton Bus Garage and Tooting Broadway, and Stockwell to Elephant & Castle. Instead extended from Stockwell to Vauxhall via current 2 LOR - creating a direct link from Streatham to Vauxhall. Frequency reduced to 12mins (Mon-Sun). 159 Night Service - Withdrawn, replaced by changed to N109. N109 - Frequency enhanced to 20mins (Sun/Mon-Thu/Fri Nights) 15mins (Fri/Sat-Sat/Sun Nights to compensate withdrawal of 159's Night Service. Whilst extending the 45 to Tooting Broadway would give it a bit more purpose and provide more useful links north of Brixton than the 333 currently does the Streatham/Stockwell link would be lost as well as the round the corner link at Stockwell. That said I think Vauxhall would be more useful for the 333 and Kennington to Elephant & Castle is over bussed. I think the N109/159 frequency is probably ok as it is although I think having the whole service as the N159 would be preferable. That said another option would be to keep the N109 and extend the N159 to Croydon via Thornton Heath Clock Tower replacing the night service on the 250.
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bx04myt
Cleaner
RIP 73 Bendy Buses :(
Posts: 13
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Post by bx04myt on Jul 31, 2024 11:18:01 GMT
242/N242:Withdrawn, replaced by routes 67/308 67:Extended from Dalston to Aldgate replacing route 242.Withdrawn between Stamford Hill and Wood Green, and extended to Meridian Water (Glover Drive Tesco) via Tottenham Hale308:Withdrawn between Homerton Hospital and Clapton Pond, extended to Dalston Junction via route 242 and converted to 24 hr service 425: Rerouted via Chatsworth Road instead of Urswick Road 334:New route running between Wood Green and Homerton Hospital replacing 67 to Stamford Hill, and the Clapton Pond - Homerton section of route 425 N67:New Night Route Running between Meridian Water and Tottenham Court Road replacing route N242. (This is a change around of some ideas I had made previously) I saw your ideas and thought they were cool so I thought for the fun of it I'd make a visual route map for them. Hope these look okay! I did make one change though. With the 67, instead of extending to Meridian Water from Stamford Hill, I thought that keeping the 67 terminating at Stamford Hill is fine as you can take either 76 and 341 or 76 and 192 to Meridian Water.
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Post by YX18KVJ (DLE30221) on Jul 31, 2024 19:58:25 GMT
242/N242:Withdrawn, replaced by routes 67/308 67:Extended from Dalston to Aldgate replacing route 242.Withdrawn between Stamford Hill and Wood Green, and extended to Meridian Water (Glover Drive Tesco) via Tottenham Hale308:Withdrawn between Homerton Hospital and Clapton Pond, extended to Dalston Junction via route 242 and converted to 24 hr service 425: Rerouted via Chatsworth Road instead of Urswick Road 334:New route running between Wood Green and Homerton Hospital replacing 67 to Stamford Hill, and the Clapton Pond - Homerton section of route 425 N67:New Night Route Running between Meridian Water and Tottenham Court Road replacing route N242. (This is a change around of some ideas I had made previously) I saw your ideas and thought they were cool so I thought for the fun of it I'd make a visual route map for them. Hope these look okay! I did make one change though. With the 67, instead of extending to Meridian Water from Stamford Hill, I thought that keeping the 67 terminating at Stamford Hill is fine as you can take either 76 and 341 or 76 and 192 to Meridian Water. Wow, thanks for that, the maps look great! If you don't mind, could you do another map with just the original 67/N67 idea?I mean with 67 going all the way to Meridian Water.
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Post by dominic on Jul 31, 2024 20:27:28 GMT
Bus changes to 64 and 159 night services, N68, N109 and N250
64 and 159 night services are withdrawn N250 extended to New Addington Vulcan Way via route 64 N68 withdrawn between South Croydon and Old Coulsdon and re-routed to Warlingham via route 403 N109 re-routed via East Croydon in both directions and re-routed from Park Street and extended to Old Coulsdon via route 60, increased to run every 15 minutes.
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Post by southlondonbus on Jul 31, 2024 20:28:55 GMT
Don’t really like these ideas either tbh. I do wonder if there is however merit in extending the 45 to Tooting but via the 355’s LOR instead. Stand space would probably be an issue, though the 45 could go to Balham once the 315 gets extended. The 355 should’ve been double decked, no need for the 45 to go anywhere as that would just be excessive. I don’t think a Balham extension would work particularly well either, the 45’s link to Camberwell is irrelevant to Tooting or Balham and one of the 355’s busiest links to and from Kings Avenue is out of the 45’s way. There is no bus from Brixton Hill to Balham but I don’t think that matters that much anyway Definitely if the 45 gets withdrawn without replacement then the 355 really should be DD as it will be the only route from Clapham Park to Brixton, the section of the 355 I already find the busiest.
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Post by greg on Jul 31, 2024 21:36:12 GMT
46: rerouted from Rosslyn Hill to Finchley Road, 02 Centre via Belsize Village, College Crescent and Finchley Road. Withdrawn on Lyndhurst Road and Swiss Cottage to Paddington.
210: withdrawn between Golders Green and Brent Cross. Extended to Stamford Hill via Manor House Station and Bethune Road. Converted to SDs. (Could also run via Fonthill Road in both directions with DDs and still serve the bus station in the Stamford Hill direction)
268: new route introduced between Brent Cross and Paddington via the 210 to Jack Straw Castle, the 603 to Swiss Cottage and then 46 to Paddington. SD route but with 268D (DD school journeys). Apart of major restructure of 46/210/268/603.
299: extended from Muswell Hill to Hampstead Heath, Lawn Road via 603 to Hampstead Station, and 46 to Mansfield Road. Then stand implemented on current 24 alighting point for journeys back towards Cockfosters.
Current 268/603: Withdrawn
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Post by VMH2537 on Jul 31, 2024 22:41:44 GMT
46: rerouted from Rosslyn Hill to Finchley Road, 02 Centre via Belsize Village, College Crescent and Finchley Road. Withdrawn on Lyndhurst Road and Swiss Cottage to Paddington. 210: withdrawn between Golders Green and Brent Cross. Extended to Stamford Hill via Manor House Station and Bethune Road. Converted to SDs. (Could also run via Fonthill Road in both directions with DDs and still serve the bus station in the Stamford Hill direction) 268: new route introduced between Brent Cross and Paddington via the 210 to Jack Straw Castle, the 603 to Swiss Cottage and then 46 to Paddington. SD route but with 268D (DD school journeys). Apart of major restructure of 46/210/268/603. 299: extended from Muswell Hill to Hampstead Heath, Lawn Road via 603 to Hampstead Station, and 46 to Mansfield Road. Then stand implemented on current 24 alighting point for journeys back towards Cockfosters. Current 268/603: Withdrawn There are some merits on these proposals however there are some fair points I'd like to make at the same time. The 210 in it's current form could theoretically extend by itself to Stamford Hill due to the short running time within. However from of course the low bridge will mean the route may have to single deck itself which I and many don't think will do down well at all. Though there is an option, but requires restructuring to the overall service and will likely require another service involved. The idea is to re-route the 210 from Archway via Holloway Road before joining Seven Sisters road where it will continue to Stamford Hill. Many new round the corner links can be established and still ultimately archives the goel of linking Stamford Hill to Golders Green. At the same time there's the question if a peak 10 minute service is justified east of Finsbury Park, you may be better off operating short workings by taking 3bph only operating eastwards, but still coordinating with the 210 at Finsbury Park to maintain service levels. Would be much better than this current idea which duplicates most the route wasting a huge ton of resources, though again I'm sure everyone's aware of TfL's allergie to short workings. What would replace the current 210 east of Archway, whom may ask? The 143 or the C11 seem to be the only candidates that could potentially perform the role. Though both routes run on single decks making it back to the question on how well will it go? If I had to choose, I'd probably pick the C11 over it's unique links to Hampstead and beyond linking areas of Crouch End for the first time. Now I'd also like to touch on your idea regarding what to do with the 603. The route everyone's been screaming for years and years to only been recently insulted an additional service will operate alongside the 210. Replacing the 603 with the 299 has been suggested on here many times brings more drawbacks than benefits. For a starter the route already struggles in its current form, from all the congestions around Bounds Green, Palmers Green and Southgate does nothing but hampered the service. It doesn't help Haringey and Enfield installed all LTN'S effectively grid locking the area during the peaks. I of course don't want to start on the 'clown like' service Sullivan provides, though this will soon change once NP takes over (Hopefully). If I had to be in charge on what to do with the 603? I'll do the following. I will divert the 268 via the current 603 to East Finchley with a replacement by extending the 240 to Swiss Cottage. East Finchley would be a logical place to terminate service with interchange access to other services as well has existing stand space outside the station. In an ideal world, I'd extend it to Muswell Hill, but due to current limited standing space, I'll have to leave it at East Finchley for now. With all of this, I just hope TfL can finally acknowledge 'properly' where investment goes without every being crazy on introducing a service that duplicates most of the route where no additional capacity was required. Just for the sake of appealing to a small minority group who has no significant economic benefits to the wide network or whatsoever. I get maybe Sadiq Khan and the Labour party are trying to win over the Jewish people from the Corbyn case a few years back, though it just proves as I said before, a route doesn't need to have a 'good business case', but only they invest 'if they want to'.
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Post by sdaniel on Aug 1, 2024 0:00:50 GMT
46: rerouted from Rosslyn Hill to Finchley Road, 02 Centre via Belsize Village, College Crescent and Finchley Road. Withdrawn on Lyndhurst Road and Swiss Cottage to Paddington. 210: withdrawn between Golders Green and Brent Cross. Extended to Stamford Hill via Manor House Station and Bethune Road. Converted to SDs. (Could also run via Fonthill Road in both directions with DDs and still serve the bus station in the Stamford Hill direction) 268: new route introduced between Brent Cross and Paddington via the 210 to Jack Straw Castle, the 603 to Swiss Cottage and then 46 to Paddington. SD route but with 268D (DD school journeys). Apart of major restructure of 46/210/268/603. 299: extended from Muswell Hill to Hampstead Heath, Lawn Road via 603 to Hampstead Station, and 46 to Mansfield Road. Then stand implemented on current 24 alighting point for journeys back towards Cockfosters. Current 268/603: Withdrawn You should’ve put this in the 603 folder I created. But anyway, I’m in support of your 46 change but not the others. Leave the 210 and 299 as it is then make the 268 run between Paddington and Muswell Hill and extend the 240 down to Hampstead Heath Station. If there is no space or not enough space at Muswell Hill then I would presumably extend the 268 to Southgate and extend the W9 to Cockfosters, thereby withdrawing the 299.
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Post by mrhk on Aug 1, 2024 0:33:48 GMT
A few changes in Ruislip
E7: Extend E7 from Ruislip Station to Ruislip, Hume Way either via Ruislip High Street and Eastcote Road OR via Ruislip Manor Stationa and Windmill Hill. This will sort out the problem with stands being filled up at Ruislip and will enable new connections if the route via Ruislip Mnr is chosen. At the same time, its shopping hour route should be withdrawn to decrease journey times
U10: Minor diversion from West Ruislip to Ruislip via Wood Lane and West End Road, to make up for the lost link if the E7's shopping hour route is to be diverted. There are already very little services along that part of the E7 and diverting the U10 is the most appropriate as it will retain the connection to the High Street and passengers can still ride the E7.
398: Extension from Ruislip Station to West Ruislip Station. This too will help free up stand space at Ruislip Station and provide a new link to West Ruislip from areas such as Eastcote, Rayners Lane and Ruislip Manor itself.
278: Very minor change however it should be extended 1 stop from Brickwall Lane to Ruislip Station itself IN BOTH DIRECTIONS. TfL made the weird decision to switch its terminus and pick up stops not too long ago and it has confused both passengers and drivers as some drivers still set down and stand at the wrong stand however extending it into the little bus station will eliminate that confusion. Another change I propose is that 278 should be a 24 hour route, considering it finishes and starts very early anyway
114: Introduce a new night service from Mill Hill Broadway to Uxbridge via the U1 from Ruislip until Uxbridge. This will allow passengers to essentially have a night service along MOST (I know Rayners Lane and Eastcote wont be served) of the Metrolpolitan and Piccadilly lines to Harrow and with the 24hr 278, those wanting Hillingdon Station can transfer onto that instead as I'm not sure DDs can run via the U2's route past Hillingdon Station.
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bx04myt
Cleaner
RIP 73 Bendy Buses :(
Posts: 13
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Post by bx04myt on Aug 1, 2024 11:40:04 GMT
I saw your ideas and thought they were cool so I thought for the fun of it I'd make a visual route map for them. Hope these look okay! I did make one change though. With the 67, instead of extending to Meridian Water from Stamford Hill, I thought that keeping the 67 terminating at Stamford Hill is fine as you can take either 76 and 341 or 76 and 192 to Meridian Water. Wow, thanks for that, the maps look great! If you don't mind, could you do another map with just the original 67/N67 idea?I mean with 67 going all the way to Meridian Water.
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