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Post by ADH45258 on Jun 4, 2021 16:30:59 GMT
It has been standing on St George's walk since about November. Not seen one on Katherine Street since then. Will try grab a photo later. The bus stand at Fell Road is obstructed by Tabener house works Oh I believe you, just shocked that yet again, they keep messing with the stands around there, hardly a good advert for public transport either. I think TFL probably should have considered restructuring a few routes rather than increasing the number terminating in Croydon, given the available stand at both West Croydon bus station and various stands at Croydon Town Centre. I previously suggested swapping parts of the 198 & 407, which have similar frequencies. One route would operate between Sutton and Shrublands, creating an east-west link across Croydon, while being more reliable than the current lengthly 407. Then the 443 proposal would continue from West Croydon to Thornton Heath via the 198. I think others suggested extending a route at West Croydon, such as the 403, to replace the 407's section to Sutton. Also, in any case, space could perhaps be further relieved by extending something from Croydon to maintain the 455's link towards Beddington, could terminate at Ikea or Asda.
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Post by greenboy on Jun 4, 2021 17:53:06 GMT
The 405 and 412 stand in St George's Walk. Fell Road stand is not used at present because of construction works. The 109 uses Katherine Street With these current stand arrangements, would any existing stands be able to fit the 407 alongside the existing routes? I would assume the stand near the flyover where the 50 used to stand will be available again at some point? Last time I was there it was out of use because of construction work.
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Post by thekbq14 on Jun 9, 2021 1:58:17 GMT
With these current stand arrangements, would any existing stands be able to fit the 407 alongside the existing routes? I would assume the stand near the flyover where the 50 used to stand will be available again at some point? Last time I was there it was out of use because of construction work. The reconstruction of Taberner House/Queens Gardens should be done soon by the end of this year with the first of them buildings opening in August, from what I've read. Hopefully by then Fell Road could be made available again to stand buses. But agreed the whole proposal of bus routes or the 407/443 being cut does seem short sighted. Especially as stand space in the Croydon area was scarce before. Still we'll see what tfl will do with stand spaces.
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Post by TB123 on Aug 13, 2021 10:45:51 GMT
The results of this consultation are expected to be published in late August/early September. So hopefully, implementation can occur by Easter (2022)
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Post by southlondonbus on Aug 13, 2021 12:56:24 GMT
The results of this consultation are expected to be published in late August/early September. So hopefully, implementation can occur by Easter (2022) Good to know thou I thought the 439 and S2 were going to the tendered till the Sutton routes (80/93 etc) so may make Easter take up a bit rushed.
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Post by MoEnviro on Aug 13, 2021 14:47:19 GMT
The results of this consultation are expected to be published in late August/early September. So hopefully, implementation can occur by Easter (2022) But with new routes 439 and S2 now forming tender tranche 819a they wont be starting until Nov/Dec 2022.
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Post by snowman on Aug 14, 2021 7:18:37 GMT
The results of this consultation are expected to be published in late August/early September. So hopefully, implementation can occur by Easter (2022) But with new routes 439 and S2 now forming tender tranche 819a they wont be starting until Nov/Dec 2022. Tranche 819 already had 80, 164, 470 which were due to be altered as per consultation Re-route the S1 between Wrythe Lane and Middleton Road via Bishopsford Road and Green Wrythe Lane. This re-routeing would be necessary to enable the right turn to be undertaken by longer buses which would be used to operate on route S1. In Belmont, it would be re-routed via Cotswold Road rather than Belmont Station Introduce a new route S2 which would run between Belmont, High Down and Downview, St Helier Station via Belmont Station and the western part of the S4. Both routes S2 and S4 would operate at a frequency of every 20 minutes Monday to Saturday daytimes. Both routes would continue to operate every 30 minutes at evenings, and Sunday services with a frequency of every 30 minutes would be introduced Withdraw route S3 between Sutton Station and Belmont Station, and swap its routeing with the 470 between Sutton High Street and Sutton Common Station to provide a more direct routeing Re-structure route S4 which would now run between Waddon Marsh and Belmont Station via route 455 to Mollison Drive and then via current route S4 Withdraw route 80 between Belmont, High Down and Downview, and Sutton Hospital. It would be converted to double decker buses to provide sufficient capacity for growing demand, particularly at its southern end. The S2 would serve High Down and Downview Extend route 164 from Sutton Station to Sutton Hospital when development in that area requires additional bus capacity Re-number the school-day only journeys on route 405 to 645 running from Waddon Road, Purley Way to Purley in the morning and in the opposite direction in the afternoon. Between Waddon and mid-Croydon, it would run via route 407 and between mid-Croydon and Purley via route 405 Re-structure route 407 so that it terminates at Sutton and Croydon town centres. It would continue to operate at the same frequency Withdraw route 413 between Sutton Garage and Sutton town centre and extend it from there via Benhill Avenue and route S3 to Belmont Station Re-structure route 434 so that it is extended to Caterham and diverted away from Northwood Avenue to serve new developments on Higher Drive in Kenley. Its frequency would remain unchanged Introduce a new route 439 which would operate between Whyteleafe and Waddon Marsh at a frequency of every 30 minutes Monday to Sunday daytimes. It would serve Kenley, Northwood Avenue as the 434 does now. The route would use single decker buses Introduce a new route 443 from Caterham to West Croydon Bus Station. This would replace the existing route 407 between Caterham and South Croydon but would serve Old Town instead of the town centre. This would operate Monday to Saturday daytimes at a frequency of every 15 minutes, and on Sundays and all evenings at a frequency of every 20 minutes. The route would use double decker buses Withdraw route 455. The southern section of the route would be replaced by changes to routes 166 and 312. Route 312 would be extended from South Croydon to Purley Old Lodge Lane via Brighton Road. Route 166 would be re-routed between Purley and Croydon town centre via route 455. The western section would be partially replaced by changes to routes S4 and the school day only journeys on route 405 Re-route the 470 to run two-way via Stayton Road and Oldfields Road, which are judged more suitable for bus operation than Dibden and Marlborough Roads. This would require changes to the junction of Oldfields Road and Stayton Road consultations.tfl.gov.uk/buses/sutton-croydon-bus-changes/I am guessing new 443 is not being tendered as withdrawn 455 will morph into it to avoid paying compensation for cancellation of a contract
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Post by SILENCED on Aug 14, 2021 9:33:03 GMT
But with new routes 439 and S2 now forming tender tranche 819a they wont be starting until Nov/Dec 2022. Tranche 819 already had 80, 164, 470 which were due to be altered as per consultation Re-route the S1 between Wrythe Lane and Middleton Road via Bishopsford Road and Green Wrythe Lane. This re-routeing would be necessary to enable the right turn to be undertaken by longer buses which would be used to operate on route S1. In Belmont, it would be re-routed via Cotswold Road rather than Belmont Station Introduce a new route S2 which would run between Belmont, High Down and Downview, St Helier Station via Belmont Station and the western part of the S4. Both routes S2 and S4 would operate at a frequency of every 20 minutes Monday to Saturday daytimes. Both routes would continue to operate every 30 minutes at evenings, and Sunday services with a frequency of every 30 minutes would be introduced Withdraw route S3 between Sutton Station and Belmont Station, and swap its routeing with the 470 between Sutton High Street and Sutton Common Station to provide a more direct routeing Re-structure route S4 which would now run between Waddon Marsh and Belmont Station via route 455 to Mollison Drive and then via current route S4 Withdraw route 80 between Belmont, High Down and Downview, and Sutton Hospital. It would be converted to double decker buses to provide sufficient capacity for growing demand, particularly at its southern end. The S2 would serve High Down and Downview Extend route 164 from Sutton Station to Sutton Hospital when development in that area requires additional bus capacity Re-number the school-day only journeys on route 405 to 645 running from Waddon Road, Purley Way to Purley in the morning and in the opposite direction in the afternoon. Between Waddon and mid-Croydon, it would run via route 407 and between mid-Croydon and Purley via route 405 Re-structure route 407 so that it terminates at Sutton and Croydon town centres. It would continue to operate at the same frequency Withdraw route 413 between Sutton Garage and Sutton town centre and extend it from there via Benhill Avenue and route S3 to Belmont Station Re-structure route 434 so that it is extended to Caterham and diverted away from Northwood Avenue to serve new developments on Higher Drive in Kenley. Its frequency would remain unchanged Introduce a new route 439 which would operate between Whyteleafe and Waddon Marsh at a frequency of every 30 minutes Monday to Sunday daytimes. It would serve Kenley, Northwood Avenue as the 434 does now. The route would use single decker buses Introduce a new route 443 from Caterham to West Croydon Bus Station. This would replace the existing route 407 between Caterham and South Croydon but would serve Old Town instead of the town centre. This would operate Monday to Saturday daytimes at a frequency of every 15 minutes, and on Sundays and all evenings at a frequency of every 20 minutes. The route would use double decker buses Withdraw route 455. The southern section of the route would be replaced by changes to routes 166 and 312. Route 312 would be extended from South Croydon to Purley Old Lodge Lane via Brighton Road. Route 166 would be re-routed between Purley and Croydon town centre via route 455. The western section would be partially replaced by changes to routes S4 and the school day only journeys on route 405 Re-route the 470 to run two-way via Stayton Road and Oldfields Road, which are judged more suitable for bus operation than Dibden and Marlborough Roads. This would require changes to the junction of Oldfields Road and Stayton Road consultations.tfl.gov.uk/buses/sutton-croydon-bus-changes/I am guessing new 443 is not being tendered as withdrawn 455 will morph into it to avoid paying compensation for cancellation of a contract 443 will be a split of the 407? 455 will have been running so long, little or no compensation will have to be paid
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Post by TB123 on Aug 14, 2021 9:37:54 GMT
Tranche 819 already had 80, 164, 470 which were due to be altered as per consultation Re-route the S1 between Wrythe Lane and Middleton Road via Bishopsford Road and Green Wrythe Lane. This re-routeing would be necessary to enable the right turn to be undertaken by longer buses which would be used to operate on route S1. In Belmont, it would be re-routed via Cotswold Road rather than Belmont Station Introduce a new route S2 which would run between Belmont, High Down and Downview, St Helier Station via Belmont Station and the western part of the S4. Both routes S2 and S4 would operate at a frequency of every 20 minutes Monday to Saturday daytimes. Both routes would continue to operate every 30 minutes at evenings, and Sunday services with a frequency of every 30 minutes would be introduced Withdraw route S3 between Sutton Station and Belmont Station, and swap its routeing with the 470 between Sutton High Street and Sutton Common Station to provide a more direct routeing Re-structure route S4 which would now run between Waddon Marsh and Belmont Station via route 455 to Mollison Drive and then via current route S4 Withdraw route 80 between Belmont, High Down and Downview, and Sutton Hospital. It would be converted to double decker buses to provide sufficient capacity for growing demand, particularly at its southern end. The S2 would serve High Down and Downview Extend route 164 from Sutton Station to Sutton Hospital when development in that area requires additional bus capacity Re-number the school-day only journeys on route 405 to 645 running from Waddon Road, Purley Way to Purley in the morning and in the opposite direction in the afternoon. Between Waddon and mid-Croydon, it would run via route 407 and between mid-Croydon and Purley via route 405 Re-structure route 407 so that it terminates at Sutton and Croydon town centres. It would continue to operate at the same frequency Withdraw route 413 between Sutton Garage and Sutton town centre and extend it from there via Benhill Avenue and route S3 to Belmont Station Re-structure route 434 so that it is extended to Caterham and diverted away from Northwood Avenue to serve new developments on Higher Drive in Kenley. Its frequency would remain unchanged Introduce a new route 439 which would operate between Whyteleafe and Waddon Marsh at a frequency of every 30 minutes Monday to Sunday daytimes. It would serve Kenley, Northwood Avenue as the 434 does now. The route would use single decker buses Introduce a new route 443 from Caterham to West Croydon Bus Station. This would replace the existing route 407 between Caterham and South Croydon but would serve Old Town instead of the town centre. This would operate Monday to Saturday daytimes at a frequency of every 15 minutes, and on Sundays and all evenings at a frequency of every 20 minutes. The route would use double decker buses Withdraw route 455. The southern section of the route would be replaced by changes to routes 166 and 312. Route 312 would be extended from South Croydon to Purley Old Lodge Lane via Brighton Road. Route 166 would be re-routed between Purley and Croydon town centre via route 455. The western section would be partially replaced by changes to routes S4 and the school day only journeys on route 405 Re-route the 470 to run two-way via Stayton Road and Oldfields Road, which are judged more suitable for bus operation than Dibden and Marlborough Roads. This would require changes to the junction of Oldfields Road and Stayton Road consultations.tfl.gov.uk/buses/sutton-croydon-bus-changes/I am guessing new 443 is not being tendered as withdrawn 455 will morph into it to avoid paying compensation for cancellation of a contract 443 will be a split of the 407? 455 will have been running so long, little or no compensation will have to be paid 455 contract however does not expire until 2024. The extension was awarded after the consultation came out - something will have to be done there. 443 going onto the 455 contract, a la 48/335, would be logical.
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Post by SILENCED on Aug 14, 2021 10:07:45 GMT
443 will be a split of the 407? 455 will have been running so long, little or no compensation will have to be paid 455 contract however does not expire until 2024. The extension was awarded after the consultation came out - something will have to be done there. 443 going onto the 455 contract, a la 48/335, would be logical. Then you would need to pay Abellio compensation for downgrading a newer contract. Will be shocked if 407/443 does not end up at Abellio. Might have been negotiated as part of the agreement for them to take the QL routes on.
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Post by southlondonbus on Aug 14, 2021 10:14:49 GMT
443 will be a split of the 407? 455 will have been running so long, little or no compensation will have to be paid 455 contract however does not expire until 2024. The extension was awarded after the consultation came out - something will have to be done there. 443 going onto the 455 contract, a la 48/335, would be logical. More logical would be the 455 takes on either the S2 or 439. Or the new S4 and Abellio assume the more frequent S2.
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Post by SILENCED on Aug 31, 2021 16:43:03 GMT
Does anyone know whether the results for this consultation are likely to appear on the old consultation site or the new haveyoursay site?
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Post by southlondon413 on Sept 3, 2021 10:12:23 GMT
Does anyone know whether the results for this consultation are likely to appear on the old consultation site or the new haveyoursay site? Great news, the consultation page is being updated, god knows for how long though.
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Post by SILENCED on Sept 3, 2021 10:51:46 GMT
Does anyone know whether the results for this consultation are likely to appear on the old consultation site or the new haveyoursay site? Great news, the consultation page is being updated, god knows for how long though. Good news, although will be interested to see how many responses they had and how they were grouped, given it has taken them approx 260 days to reach this point
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Post by vjaska on Sept 3, 2021 11:45:16 GMT
Great news, the consultation page is being updated, god knows for how long though. Good news, although will be interested to see how many responses they had and how they were grouped, given it has taken them approx 260 days to reach this point It’s possible there might have been some pushback on certain parts of the consultation depending on if the right people see it
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