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Post by ADH45258 on Mar 18, 2024 21:05:09 GMT
I took the 312 today down to Old Lodge Lane. Bus still only had A4 paper blinds as did some of the 289s i saw. Never been down there before. Pretty long road really with a mix of different housing. Only me and 2 other people and one of them was a baby in arms beyond Purley and 3 of us on the return trip so not really sure the increase in freq was totally needed. The E200s were nice to ride thou with that classic Dart/E200 sounds roaring round on the fast roads around Croydon still. I wondered if the 410 might have been a better route to send there, but that would be even more frequent (just shorter SDs). The 312 proposal seemed an odd choice, since the Old Lodge Lane section isn't that busy if your observations are typical, while the Norwood Junction section is now restricted to 10.2m SDs. I've seen a few comments recently suggesting to split the 463. Could a new route perhaps work replacing part of the 463 and 312/455? Would go from Old Lodge Lane via the former 455 to Beddington, looping round to serve the key part of Beddington away from the tram route, then onwards to Pollards Hill? Operating at every 15-20 minutes with 9.7m SDs (or 10.2m if they can fit). This would perhaps better match the demand at Old Lodge Lane (and Pampisford Road) - plus restoring the 455's links between Croydon and Beddington. The 166 could then revert back to going via Brighton Road. The 410/S4 would probably be sufficient around Beddington/Wallington, so the 463 could be reduced to Wallington-Coulsdon, with the option to extend further from either end. The rest of the 312 could perhaps then extend to Caterham (and convert to DDs), replacing half of the 407. And the 407 maybe to Addington, and the 466 to West Croydon? Also, if you were to split the 463 in any way, would every section still work best at 3bhp, or are some sections busier than others? |
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Post by greenboy on Mar 18, 2024 22:35:13 GMT
I took the 312 today down to Old Lodge Lane. Bus still only had A4 paper blinds as did some of the 289s i saw. Never been down there before. Pretty long road really with a mix of different housing. Only me and 2 other people and one of them was a baby in arms beyond Purley and 3 of us on the return trip so not really sure the increase in freq was totally needed. The E200s were nice to ride thou with that classic Dart/E200 sounds roaring round on the fast roads around Croydon still. I wondered if the 410 might have been a better route to send there, but that would be even more frequent (just shorter SDs). The 312 proposal seemed an odd choice, since the Old Lodge Lane section isn't that busy if your observations are typical, while the Norwood Junction section is now restricted to 10.2m SDs. I've seen a few comments recently suggesting to split the 463. Could a new route perhaps work replacing part of the 463 and 312/455? Would go from Old Lodge Lane via the former 455 to Beddington, looping round to serve the key part of Beddington away from the tram route, then onwards to Pollards Hill? Operating at every 15-20 minutes with 9.7m SDs (or 10.2m if they can fit). This would perhaps better match the demand at Old Lodge Lane (and Pampisford Road) - plus restoring the 455's links between Croydon and Beddington. The 166 could then revert back to going via Brighton Road. The 410/S4 would probably be sufficient around Beddington/Wallington, so the 463 could be reduced to Wallington-Coulsdon, with the option to extend further from either end. The rest of the 312 could perhaps then extend to Caterham (and convert to DDs), replacing half of the 407. And the 407 maybe to Addington, and the 466 to West Croydon? Also, if you were to split the 463 in any way, would every section still work best at 3bhp, or are some sections busier than others? I don't think the increased frequency to Old Lodge Lane is needed, may as well have kept the 455 between OLL and Croydon and then there would have been no need to reroute the 166. With buses still carrying paper in the windscreen and double deckers appearing which can't get down Old Lodge Lane it's all been pretty shambolic. |
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Post by greenboy on Mar 19, 2024 10:46:07 GMT
Would there be any merit in extending the 130 from Thornton Heath Station to Thornton Heath Pond? Just thinking that there are so many interchange opportunities at Thornton Heath Pond and it would create more of an orbital route around the north side of Croydon. That's an excellent idea in my opinion, I'd actually go a step further and extend it to Waddon Marsh via London Road (past Croydon University Hospital), Canterbury Road and Purley Way to the stand currently used by the 439 and S4. Of course both of those routes would then have to stand elsewhere - the 439 could go round to a new stand on Hesterman Way outside IKEA, and the S4 could be extended to West Croydon or Croydon Town Centre (stand space permitting). I think that's a good idea extending the 130 to Waddon Marsh but I don't think the S4 would be extended into Croydon but the 130 could possibly go back to BC to take stand time. |
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Post by greenboy on Mar 20, 2024 8:43:05 GMT
I wondered if the 410 might have been a better route to send there, but that would be even more frequent (just shorter SDs). The 312 proposal seemed an odd choice, since the Old Lodge Lane section isn't that busy if your observations are typical, while the Norwood Junction section is now restricted to 10.2m SDs. I've seen a few comments recently suggesting to split the 463. Could a new route perhaps work replacing part of the 463 and 312/455? Would go from Old Lodge Lane via the former 455 to Beddington, looping round to serve the key part of Beddington away from the tram route, then onwards to Pollards Hill? Operating at every 15-20 minutes with 9.7m SDs (or 10.2m if they can fit). This would perhaps better match the demand at Old Lodge Lane (and Pampisford Road) - plus restoring the 455's links between Croydon and Beddington. The 166 could then revert back to going via Brighton Road. The 410/S4 would probably be sufficient around Beddington/Wallington, so the 463 could be reduced to Wallington-Coulsdon, with the option to extend further from either end. The rest of the 312 could perhaps then extend to Caterham (and convert to DDs), replacing half of the 407. And the 407 maybe to Addington, and the 466 to West Croydon? Also, if you were to split the 463 in any way, would every section still work best at 3bhp, or are some sections busier than others? I don't think the increased frequency to Old Lodge Lane is needed, may as well have kept the 455 between OLL and Croydon and then there would have been no need to reroute the 166. With buses still carrying paper in the windscreen and double deckers appearing which can't get down Old Lodge Lane it's all been pretty shambolic. I think this might have been better... 166... Not rerouted via Pampisford Road 312... Extended from South Croydon Garage to Caterham via the 407 and double decked 403... Extended from West Croydon to Sutton via the 407. 407... Withdrawn, replaced by changes to the 312 and 403. 455... Remains Old Lodge Lane to West Croydon using stand space vacated by the 403. |
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Post by southlondonbus on Mar 20, 2024 9:41:58 GMT
I don't think the increased frequency to Old Lodge Lane is needed, may as well have kept the 455 between OLL and Croydon and then there would have been no need to reroute the 166. With buses still carrying paper in the windscreen and double deckers appearing which can't get down Old Lodge Lane it's all been pretty shambolic. I think this might have been better... 166... Not rerouted via Pampisford Road 312... Extended from South Croydon Garage to Caterham via the 407 and double decked 403... Extended from West Croydon to Sutton via the 407. 407... Withdrawn, replaced by changes to the 312 and 403. 455... Remains Old Lodge Lane to West Croydon using stand space vacated by the 403. That would all probably work pretty well. Would almost create the old 197 route, a route I never really understood why it was split in 1987 as even today it would hardly be a long route. The only reason I can imagine was mis matched freqs on either half of Croydon. |
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Post by ronnie on Mar 20, 2024 11:13:15 GMT
Sorry for a very basic question but is there anywhere I can read (or just maps) summarising the changes? Doing a few end to ends so need to figure out what goes where!
Apologies if this is a very basic question, the consultation link on the first page doesn’t work
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Post by southlondonbus on Mar 20, 2024 11:21:27 GMT
Sorry for a very basic question but is there anywhere I can read (or just maps) summarising the changes? Doing a few end to ends so need to figure out what goes where! Apologies if this is a very basic question, the consultation link on the first page doesn’t work 166 Diverted between Swan & Sugar loaf and Purley via Pampisford Road. 312 Extended from TC to Old Lodge Lane 434 Temporarily diverted direct between Purley and Whyteleafe via the 407 then extended to Caterham. 439 New route from Waddon Marsh via the 289 to Purley then the 434 to Whyteleafe South. 455 Withdrawn. Replaced by 312 and 455 S2 New route replacing the S4 between Sutton and St helier Station and the 470 between Sutton Station and Epsom now with a Sunday service. S4 withdrawn between Sutton and St Helier Station and extended to Waddon Marsh via the 455 |
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Post by DE20106 on Mar 20, 2024 12:37:14 GMT
Sorry for a very basic question but is there anywhere I can read (or just maps) summarising the changes? Doing a few end to ends so need to figure out what goes where! Apologies if this is a very basic question, the consultation link on the first page doesn’t work 166 Diverted between Swan & Sugar loaf and Purley via Pampisford Road. 312 Extended from TC to Old Lodge Lane 434 Temporarily diverted direct between Purley and Whyteleafe via the 407 then extended to Caterham. 439 New route from Waddon Marsh via the 289 to Purley then the 434 to Whyteleafe South. 455 Withdrawn. Replaced by 312 and 455 S2 New route replacing the S4 between Sutton and St helier Station and the 470 between Sutton Station and Epsom now with a Sunday service. S4 withdrawn between Sutton and St Helier Station and extended to Waddon Marsh via the 455 What’s temporary about the 434 and what’s meant to be its permanent routing? I somehow missed that bit 😂 |
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Post by vjaska on Mar 20, 2024 12:47:00 GMT
166 Diverted between Swan & Sugar loaf and Purley via Pampisford Road. 312 Extended from TC to Old Lodge Lane 434 Temporarily diverted direct between Purley and Whyteleafe via the 407 then extended to Caterham. 439 New route from Waddon Marsh via the 289 to Purley then the 434 to Whyteleafe South. 455 Withdrawn. Replaced by 312 and 455 S2 New route replacing the S4 between Sutton and St helier Station and the 470 between Sutton Station and Epsom now with a Sunday service. S4 withdrawn between Sutton and St Helier Station and extended to Waddon Marsh via the 455 What’s temporary about the 434 and what’s meant to be its permanent routing? I somehow missed that bit 😂 The 434 is expected to be re-routed via Higher Drive once works with some development located there is finished, that’s my understanding - for now, the 434 shadows the 407 between Purley & Caterham |
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Post by vjaska on Mar 20, 2024 12:50:03 GMT
Sorry for a very basic question but is there anywhere I can read (or just maps) summarising the changes? Doing a few end to ends so need to figure out what goes where! Apologies if this is a very basic question, the consultation link on the first page doesn’t work 166 Diverted between Swan & Sugar loaf and Purley via Pampisford Road. 312 Extended from TC to Old Lodge Lane 434 Temporarily diverted direct between Purley and Whyteleafe via the 407 then extended to Caterham. 439 New route from Waddon Marsh via the 289 to Purley then the 434 to Whyteleafe South. 455 Withdrawn. Replaced by 312 and 455 S2 New route replacing the S4 between Sutton and St helier Station and the 470 between Sutton Station and Epsom now with a Sunday service. S4 withdrawn between Sutton and St Helier Station and extended to Waddon Marsh via the 455 In addition: S3 & 470 swapped routings at Sutton Common Road - S3 now runs full length of Sutton Common Road whilst 470 serves Marlborough Road, Dibdin Road, Stayton Road & Hallmead Road |
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Post by ronnie on Mar 20, 2024 13:28:42 GMT
Thanks all!
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Post by southlondonbus on Mar 20, 2024 13:37:44 GMT
What’s temporary about the 434 and what’s meant to be its permanent routing? I somehow missed that bit 😂 The 434 is expected to be re-routed via Higher Drive once works with some development located there is finished, that’s my understanding - for now, the 434 shadows the 407 between Purley & Caterham Out of interest I wonder if any longer buses have slipped out on the 434 or is it still restricted at the Rickman Hill end? |
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Post by vjaska on Mar 20, 2024 15:22:24 GMT
The 434 is expected to be re-routed via Higher Drive once works with some development located there is finished, that’s my understanding - for now, the 434 shadows the 407 between Purley & Caterham Out of interest I wonder if any longer buses have slipped out on the 434 or is it still restricted at the Rickman Hill end? Still only single door buses so far  |
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Post by southlondonbus on Mar 20, 2024 16:47:34 GMT
Out of interest I wonder if any longer buses have slipped out on the 434 or is it still restricted at the Rickman Hill end? Still only single door buses so far I was going to say blinds could be an issue but then remembered what's allowed on the 289 and 312.... |
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Post by southlondonbus on Mar 20, 2024 16:48:41 GMT
Either way not quite as substantial as the changes in Croydon introduced between 1998 and 2000 with the 50, 60, 130 etc. |
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