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Post by southlondonbus on Apr 4, 2021 22:10:34 GMT
There hasn't actually been anything said about the 148 as normally when that happens its gets announced as part of a tender programme update along the lines of such and such a route has been extended by 1 year or such and such a route has been added to tranche whatever to allow for a review as what happened with the 139 (ultimately terminated) or the S4 (tendered in its current form). The 9 had a delay in announcing and then it turned out it was extended. There are precedents. Unfortunately the 10 bit the dust thou. The 148 could survive with another routes contract taking it on. 414 to get the chop completely and the 148 be handed to TT would be an example. |
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Post by LD71YLO (BE37054) on Apr 5, 2021 8:00:49 GMT
Latest rumour (from a more credible source this time) is that the 388 will be extended to Old Kent Road Tescos. Could this mean the 21 could be on the chopping block? I think that the 21 will just go down to every 12 minutes. I think it could cope south of OKR Tesco and the 141/388 would provide it with assistance in the other areas. Also, I think that passenger numbers have really been in decline north of Moorgate on the 21. |
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Post by southlondonbus on Apr 5, 2021 8:11:07 GMT
Could this mean the 21 could be on the chopping block? I think that the 21 will just go down to every 12 minutes. I think it could cope south of OKR Tesco and the 141/388 would provide it with assistance in the other areas. Also, I think that passenger numbers have really been in decline north of Moorgate on the 21. Extending the 388 does free up a space at LB for something from the South. 47, 133 or 344 could all be possible. |
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Post by snowman on Apr 5, 2021 9:34:00 GMT
Have heard on the grapevine (so not official)
TfL cutting £36m - £50m from bus costs in 2021-22 vs 2020-21
Central area bus routes being cut 11%
Central area bus mileage being cut 16%
But outer London bus services +1%
I don’t know what is defined as central, but I assume fare zone 1 and parts of zone 2 would fall into this category, along with all the congestion charge zone
I presume that some routes are being shortened, and probably a handful axed. Seems likely that some others may be partially extended over the cut sections. The difference between 11% and 16% is going to be due to frequency reductions. Rumoured that at least 25 routes affected.
The grapevine is rumouring there are two versions of the central London cuts report (with same cuts), by giving different reasons in the introduction: one is post pandemic usage levels; and the other is more a political version (which I would guess is going to be like a don’t blame the mayor, blame the Government funding cuts version). My guess is one will appear either after mayoral election, or possibly after any funding discussion to replace funding extension to 18th May.
No doubt it will be presented as a consultation (although presumably will happen in Autumn regardless)
My own feeling is will be 2 phases, one from October, and the West-East cuts taking effect on opening of Elizabeth Line (anything in corridor from Acton to Stratford / Docklands).
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 9:48:17 GMT
Have heard on the grapevine (so not official) TfL cutting £36m - £50m from bus costs in 2021-22 vs 2020-21 Central area bus routes being cut 11% Central area bus mileage being cut 16% But outer London bus services +1% I don’t know what is defined as central, but I assume fare zone 1 and parts of zone 2 would fall into this category, along with all the congestion charge zone I presume that some routes are being shortened, and probably a handful axed. Seems likely that some others may be partially extended over the cut sections. The difference between 11% and 16% is going to be due to frequency reductions. Rumoured that at least 25 routes affected. The grapevine is rumouring there are two versions of the central London cuts report (with same cuts), by giving different reasons in the introduction: one is post pandemic usage levels; and the other is more a political version (which I would guess is going to be like a don’t blame the mayor, blame the Government funding cuts version). My guess is one will appear either after mayoral election, or possibly after any funding discussion to replace funding extension to 18th May. No doubt it will be presented as a consultation (although presumably will happen in Autumn regardless) My own feeling is will be 2 phases, one from October, and the West-East cuts taking effect on opening of Elizabeth Line (anything in corridor from Acton to Stratford / Docklands). Sounds like idle gossip. |
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Post by enviroPB on Apr 5, 2021 9:54:42 GMT
I think that the 21 will just go down to every 12 minutes. I think it could cope south of OKR Tesco and the 141/388 would provide it with assistance in the other areas. Also, I think that passenger numbers have really been in decline north of Moorgate on the 21. Extending the 388 does free up a space at LB for something from the South. 47, 133 or 344 could all be possible. There is no possibility of any route coming from Tooley Street being able to access London Bridge bus station. The 47 and 381 use Borough High Road, Marshalsea Road, Southwark Bridge Road and Southwark Street to turn around as buses can't make the left turn from Tooley Street. |
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Post by TB123 on Apr 5, 2021 10:02:10 GMT
Have heard on the grapevine (so not official) TfL cutting £36m - £50m from bus costs in 2021-22 vs 2020-21 Central area bus routes being cut 11% Central area bus mileage being cut 16% But outer London bus services +1% I don’t know what is defined as central, but I assume fare zone 1 and parts of zone 2 would fall into this category, along with all the congestion charge zone I presume that some routes are being shortened, and probably a handful axed. Seems likely that some others may be partially extended over the cut sections. The difference between 11% and 16% is going to be due to frequency reductions. Rumoured that at least 25 routes affected. The grapevine is rumouring there are two versions of the central London cuts report (with same cuts), by giving different reasons in the introduction: one is post pandemic usage levels; and the other is more a political version (which I would guess is going to be like a don’t blame the mayor, blame the Government funding cuts version). My guess is one will appear either after mayoral election, or possibly after any funding discussion to replace funding extension to 18th May. No doubt it will be presented as a consultation (although presumably will happen in Autumn regardless) My own feeling is will be 2 phases, one from October, and the West-East cuts taking effect on opening of Elizabeth Line (anything in corridor from Acton to Stratford / Docklands). Sounds like idle gossip. Not gossip at all. This stuff was mentioned in TfLs own financial recovery plan. Unless you know something we don't? |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 10:29:05 GMT
Not gossip at all. This stuff was mentioned in TfLs own financial recovery plan. Unless you know something we don't? That’s fine and I’m not questioning the validity of the financial recovery plan but until there is a consultation or a formally published programme of reductions it is just rumour after rumour. Frankly it’s just getting boring trawling through page after page of I heard this and I heard that. Seriously, you’d have to be stupid not to realise that reductions are inevitable but rumours are just sooooooooooo boring. |
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Post by TB123 on Apr 5, 2021 10:31:06 GMT
Not gossip at all. This stuff was mentioned in TfLs own financial recovery plan. Unless you know something we don't? That’s fine and I’m not questioning the validity of the financial recovery plan but until there is a consultation or a formally published programme of reductions it is just rumour after rumour. Frankly it’s just getting boring trawling through page after page of I heard this and I heard that. Seriously, you’d have to be stupid not to realise that reductions are inevitable but rumours are just sooooooooooo boring. If you think the rumours are bad here you wouldn't wanna know what some industry quarters are like at the moment!! Also apart from the questions about consultation manner (which is a good point) nothing in what snowman posted is rumour - it's officially stated stuff |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 10:32:32 GMT
That’s fine and I’m not questioning the validity of the financial recovery plan but until there is a consultation or a formally published programme of reductions it is just rumour after rumour. Frankly it’s just getting boring trawling through page after page of I heard this and I heard that. Seriously, you’d have to be stupid not to realise that reductions are inevitable but rumours are just sooooooooooo boring. If you think the rumours are bad here you wouldn't wanna know what some industry quarters are like at the moment!! I can only imagine what’s it’s like in a depot at the moment, must be like a bunch of gossiping school children. |
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Post by TB123 on Apr 5, 2021 10:47:59 GMT
A prediction from me - TfL will utilise this consultation (for central & inner area changes) to finally advance previously stated aspirations to split/truncate routes like the 11, 19, 188, 341.
Also wonder if the previously aspired express bus route along the Old Kent Road will progress as a means of cutting the 53 and 453 back as well as providing a sort of X15-esque service in advance of the Bakerloo Line extension (if it ever happens)
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Post by southlondonbus on Apr 5, 2021 10:58:48 GMT
So 16% of mileage is alot more then the 4% initially thought and way beyond a few freq reductions it would seem.
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Post by TB123 on Apr 5, 2021 11:00:27 GMT
So 16% of mileage is alot more then the 4% initially thought as way beyond a few freq reductions it would seem. That's just 16% in Central and Inner London. That was always the intention. London wide it's 4% |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 5, 2021 11:01:18 GMT
Not gossip at all. This stuff was mentioned in TfLs own financial recovery plan. Unless you know something we don't? That’s fine and I’m not questioning the validity of the financial recovery plan but until there is a consultation or a formally published programme of reductions it is just rumour after rumour. Frankly it’s just getting boring trawling through page after page of I heard this and I heard that. Seriously, you’d have to be stupid not to realise that reductions are inevitable but rumours are just sooooooooooo boring. The sheer excitement here as soon as anything is leaked is like a child at Christmas. I do wonder sometimes if some of the leaks are wind ups to get reactions in places like this. |
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Post by TB123 on Apr 5, 2021 11:08:40 GMT
That’s fine and I’m not questioning the validity of the financial recovery plan but until there is a consultation or a formally published programme of reductions it is just rumour after rumour. Frankly it’s just getting boring trawling through page after page of I heard this and I heard that. Seriously, you’d have to be stupid not to realise that reductions are inevitable but rumours are just sooooooooooo boring. The sheer excitement here as soon as anything is leaked is like a child at Christmas. I do wonder sometimes if some of the leaks are wind ups to get reactions in places like this. I can categorically tell you that people working on this have a lot better things to do with their time than to wind up bus spotters!!! |
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