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Post by dashing0ne on Feb 25, 2022 15:08:03 GMT
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Post by WH241 on Feb 26, 2022 20:13:27 GMT
Watching the news more today it suddenly really dawns on you how awful the situation is in Ukraine. It is hard to believe in the year 2022 a European country is under attack.
There are scary similarities to WW2 when you hear things about everyone being forced underground in the Metro or in basements. Yes this happens in other parts of the world but this all feels much closer to home. |
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Post by ServerKing on Feb 26, 2022 20:53:51 GMT
Pardon for thread drift but Chelsea FC have been rocked by news that Russian Oligarch Roman Abramovich has handed over "ownership of Chelsea FC to Charitable Trustees", the BBC report that this might be a way for him to avoid being hit in the wallet by impending sanctions though the fear is that he may ask back a £1.5 bn loan from the Club which may bankrupt them  There is talk that if Kyiv holds out for too long, Russia may not be able to afford to keep fighting as the costs of weapons are very high. There is unrest amongst the middle classes in Russia upset with price hike of goods and electronic sanctions begin to bite. People have not been able to get their money in dollars in case the Rouble crashes, and the risk of being kicked out of the Swift banking system is very real after Germany and other countries now plan to act. Expect the battle to get more desperate as Putin is backed into a corner. |
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Post by SILENCED on Feb 26, 2022 21:05:03 GMT
Pardon for thread drift but Chelsea FC have been rocked by news that Russian Oligarch Roman Abramovich has handed over "ownership of Chelsea FC to Charitable Trustees", the BBC report that this might be a way for him to avoid being hit in the wallet by impending sanctions though the fear is that he may ask back a £1.5 bn loan from the Club which may bankrupt them There is talk that if Kyiv holds out for too long, Russia may not be able to afford to keep fighting as the costs of weapons are very high. There is unrest amongst the middle classes in Russia upset with price hike of goods and electronic sanctions begin to bite. People have not been able to get their money in dollars in case the Rouble crashes, and the risk of being kicked out of the Swift banking system is very real after Germany and other countries now plan to act. Expect the battle to get more desperate as Putin is backed into a corner. The loan will be a Abramovich asset if sanctions are brought in. Not sure what would happen |
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Post by dashing0ne on Feb 27, 2022 9:17:49 GMT
Pardon for thread drift but Chelsea FC have been rocked by news that Russian Oligarch Roman Abramovich has handed over "ownership of Chelsea FC to Charitable Trustees", the BBC report that this might be a way for him to avoid being hit in the wallet by impending sanctions though the fear is that he may ask back a £1.5 bn loan from the Club which may bankrupt them  There is talk that if Kyiv holds out for too long, Russia may not be able to afford to keep fighting as the costs of weapons are very high. There is unrest amongst the middle classes in Russia upset with price hike of goods and electronic sanctions begin to bite. People have not been able to get their money in dollars in case the Rouble crashes, and the risk of being kicked out of the Swift banking system is very real after Germany and other countries now plan to act. Expect the battle to get more desperate as Putin is backed into a corner. It is an open secret Russia is intending on moving to Plan B, leak from Kremlin on oppositionist website. Basically Russia intended to defeat Ukraine with basic weaponry in 48 hours but because they are so resilient Russia is intending to use an awful weapon called the Thermorabic bomb. Used in Chechnya and Syria by Russia and in Afghanistan by the USA, this is what appears to be the second scariest bomb after a nuclear bomb. When used in Grozny in 2001, it completely destroyed the city and killed half its population. Ukrainian Babrytkar drones (from Turkey) saw the 'Father of all Bombs' (a rocket with a thermorabic bomb present) in launching position in Belarus, now reportedly already across the Ukrainian border. Very sadly, I am sure Russia will use it and that means defeat of Ukraine and fall of Kiev. In other news, Kharkiv is under Russian control now. Essentially, Russia hoped to win with simple technology but they will use Plan B now. As much as I wish Ukraine would win it is simply impossible due to logistics. Some Russian banks were banned from SWIFT however only some banks were banned due to opposition from Germany, Italy and France meaning all oil/gas related transactions can continue, so the impact won't be too horrible for Russia.
Summary of what is a Thermorabic bomb (although the USA has some and Britain reportedly has a few, Russia is the leader in this technology):
'A thermorabic bomb (also known as an aerosol or vacuum bomb) is a type of explosive that uses special (mostly unknown) chemicals, only second to a nuclear bomb, that uses oxygen from oxygen from the surrounding air to generate a high-temperature explosion. In practice, the blast wave is so significant it kills immediately due to explosion waves immediately killing the organs, and the waves destroy all buildings to rubble. It is especially effective in urban areas.'
They are ready to be used against Kyiv and again if the resilience holds up, Russia may very well use them like it did in Chechnya, they first attempted to take Grozny the same way as currently used in Ukraine but due to civilian opposition that didn't work. With one blast from then-new President Putin Grozny was desimated and Russia won. You would think it unlikely, but I was in absolute awe when Russia attacked Ukraine. You can type 'Thermorabic bomb' lots of articles are already there including from the Telegraph.
I feel for Ukrainians, poor people.
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Post by ronnie on Feb 27, 2022 9:27:23 GMT
Pardon for thread drift but Chelsea FC have been rocked by news that Russian Oligarch Roman Abramovich has handed over "ownership of Chelsea FC to Charitable Trustees", the BBC report that this might be a way for him to avoid being hit in the wallet by impending sanctions though the fear is that he may ask back a £1.5 bn loan from the Club which may bankrupt them There is talk that if Kyiv holds out for too long, Russia may not be able to afford to keep fighting as the costs of weapons are very high. There is unrest amongst the middle classes in Russia upset with price hike of goods and electronic sanctions begin to bite. People have not been able to get their money in dollars in case the Rouble crashes, and the risk of being kicked out of the Swift banking system is very real after Germany and other countries now plan to act. Expect the battle to get more desperate as Putin is backed into a corner. It is an open secret Russia is intending on moving to Plan B, leak from Kremlin on oppositionist website. Basically Russia intended to defeat Ukraine with basic weaponry in 48 hours but because they are so resilient Russia is intending to use an awful weapon called the Thermorabic bomb. Used in Chechnya and Syria by Russia and in Afghanistan by the USA, this is what appears to be the second scariest bomb after a nuclear bomb. When used in Grozny in 2001, it completely destroyed the city and killed half its population. Ukrainian Babrytkar drones (from Turkey) saw the 'Father of all Bombs' (a rocket with a thermorabic bomb present) in launching position in Belarus, now reportedly already across the Ukrainian border. Very sadly, I am sure Russia will use it and that means defeat of Ukraine and fall of Kiev. In other news, Kharkiv is under Russian control now. Essentially, Russia hoped to win with simple technology but they will use Plan B now. As much as I wish Ukraine would win it is simply impossible due to logistics. Some Russian banks were banned from SWIFT however only some banks were banned due to opposition from Germany, Italy and France meaning all oil/gas related transactions can continue, so the impact won't be too horrible for Russia.
Summary of what is a Thermorabic bomb (although the USA has some and Britain reportedly has a few, Russia is the leader in this technology):
'A thermorabic bomb (also known as an aerosol or vacuum bomb) is a type of explosive that uses special (mostly unknown) chemicals, only second to a nuclear bomb, that uses oxygen from oxygen from the surrounding air to generate a high-temperature explosion. In practice, the blast wave is so significant it kills immediately due to explosion waves immediately killing the organs, and the waves destroy all buildings to rubble. It is especially effective in urban areas.'
They are ready to be used against Kyiv and again if the resilience holds up, Russia may very well use them like it did in Chechnya, they first attempted to take Grozny the same way as currently used in Ukraine but due to civilian opposition that didn't work. With one blast from then-new President Putin Grozny was desimated and Russia won. You would think it unlikely, but I was in absolute awe when Russia attacked Ukraine. You can type 'Thermorabic bomb' lots of articles are already there including from the Telegraph.
I sfeel for Ukrainians, poor people.
I agree and it’s a sad state of affairs. The EU / US have effectively abandoned Ukraine. I am highly sceptical of how much the sanctions will bite - well maybe in a few weeks / months but by that time it may be game over. Energy is left out of the sanctions mix (as that would cripple the west!) so money will keep flowing in anyway given where commodity prices are. There have been sanctions since 2014 and Russia has figured out by now the workarounds etc …. The Ukrainians are putting up a heroic defence (and cities are always easier to defend than the countryside) but the numbers don’t stack up (hope I am proven wrong!) Clearly the Russian invasion is going slower than expected and this may make the guy in Moscow more desperate (which is dreadful to think about). Desperate despots are dangerous. Positive lining is that it doesn’t seem to be a popular war in Russia either so the longer it drags on the more difficult it would get for Putin |
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Post by dashing0ne on Feb 27, 2022 10:09:34 GMT
It is an open secret Russia is intending on moving to Plan B, leak from Kremlin on oppositionist website. Basically Russia intended to defeat Ukraine with basic weaponry in 48 hours but because they are so resilient Russia is intending to use an awful weapon called the Thermorabic bomb. Used in Chechnya and Syria by Russia and in Afghanistan by the USA, this is what appears to be the second scariest bomb after a nuclear bomb. When used in Grozny in 2001, it completely destroyed the city and killed half its population. Ukrainian Babrytkar drones (from Turkey) saw the 'Father of all Bombs' (a rocket with a thermorabic bomb present) in launching position in Belarus, now reportedly already across the Ukrainian border. Very sadly, I am sure Russia will use it and that means defeat of Ukraine and fall of Kiev. In other news, Kharkiv is under Russian control now. Essentially, Russia hoped to win with simple technology but they will use Plan B now. As much as I wish Ukraine would win it is simply impossible due to logistics. Some Russian banks were banned from SWIFT however only some banks were banned due to opposition from Germany, Italy and France meaning all oil/gas related transactions can continue, so the impact won't be too horrible for Russia.
Summary of what is a Thermorabic bomb (although the USA has some and Britain reportedly has a few, Russia is the leader in this technology):
'A thermorabic bomb (also known as an aerosol or vacuum bomb) is a type of explosive that uses special (mostly unknown) chemicals, only second to a nuclear bomb, that uses oxygen from oxygen from the surrounding air to generate a high-temperature explosion. In practice, the blast wave is so significant it kills immediately due to explosion waves immediately killing the organs, and the waves destroy all buildings to rubble. It is especially effective in urban areas.'
They are ready to be used against Kyiv and again if the resilience holds up, Russia may very well use them like it did in Chechnya, they first attempted to take Grozny the same way as currently used in Ukraine but due to civilian opposition that didn't work. With one blast from then-new President Putin Grozny was desimated and Russia won. You would think it unlikely, but I was in absolute awe when Russia attacked Ukraine. You can type 'Thermorabic bomb' lots of articles are already there including from the Telegraph.
I sfeel for Ukrainians, poor people.
I agree and it’s a sad state of affairs. The EU / US have effectively abandoned Ukraine. I am highly sceptical of how much the sanctions will bite - well maybe in a few weeks / months but by that time it may be game over. Energy is left out of the sanctions mix (as that would cripple the west!) so money will keep flowing in anyway given where commodity prices are. There have been sanctions since 2014 and Russia has figured out by now the workarounds etc …. The Ukrainians are putting up a heroic defence (and cities are always easier to defend than the countryside) but the numbers don’t stack up (hope I am proven wrong!) Clearly the Russian invasion is going slower than expected and this may make the guy in Moscow more desperate (which is dreadful to think about). Desperate despots are dangerous. Positive lining is that it doesn’t seem to be a popular war in Russia either so the longer it drags on the more difficult it would get for Putin Russia sees that using basic bombs/rockets and troops are not good enough, so unfortunately Russia will do what it needs to fufill the goal effectively and it appears to be the Thermorabic bomb, as much the Ukrainians will try they have virtually zero chance of defeating Putin. I predict if Putin doesn't defeat Ukraine by Tuesday, he will most likely resort to the horrific plan B. On an other note, Turkey and Hungary are starting to drift away from Putin and even China whilst backing Russia and accusing the West of provocation is encouraging negotiations. |
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Post by ronnie on Feb 27, 2022 10:19:58 GMT
The other thing which comes out of this crisis is how ineffective / anachronistic the UNSC setup is. I had to check as I couldn’t believe as the most recent discussions were being chaired by ….. Russia. It all doesn’t help as Russia has veto power so the UNSC is a toothless paper tiger frankly
Needs a radical overhaul to make it more representative of the world currently. The current setup is an overhang from WW2 and you have 2 dictatorships with veto power which doesn’t make any sense
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Post by dashing0ne on Feb 27, 2022 11:14:41 GMT
The other thing which comes out of this crisis is how ineffective / anachronistic the UNSC setup is. I had to check as I couldn’t believe as the most recent discussions were being chaired by ….. Russia. It all doesn’t help as Russia has veto power so the UNSC is a toothless paper tiger frankly Needs a radical overhaul to make it more representative of the world currently. The current setup is an overhang from WW2 and you have 2 dictatorships with veto power which doesn’t make any sense First of all the overhaul can't happen as both China and Russia would veto it.
The UN is made up of all countries to represent all countries so it is only fair that other superpowers have a stake, as it is a global representation. Whilst Russia may not be economically strong, it has the world's second strongest military and it is alleged it may even have more nukes than the USA as well as a leader in Chemical weapons. China is the world's second largest economy and will likely take over the West in 30 years time. In fact Chinese population and influence is growing so... I had a debate with somebody, clearly not from the West, who said that because Chinese and Indian population growth, and particular economic growth from the Chinese, that they should have 'a turn at ruling the world,' so you see what some people think  . If China takes Taiwan over, it's the end for the West for reasons explained in previous posts on this thread, and America will probably go to war over it due to its importance. |
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Post by dashing0ne on Feb 27, 2022 13:57:22 GMT
Breaking News: Putin ordered Russian Defence Minister, Sergei Shoigu and the Russian Army into nuclear deterrence mode. Last inflicted all the way back in 1962 with nukes transported to Cuba (Cuban Missile Crisis) the Nuclear Deterrence Mode provides for Russian Nuclear Rockets to be placed in launching mode, ready to attack; following what Putin called, 'aggressive statements and actions' by the West. Whilst Russia wanted negotions in Belarusian City Gomel, Zelensky now agreed to negotiations in the Belarusian-Ukrainian border. Oppositionist hacker revealed Russia will demand immediate concessions from Ukraine including neutrality, federalisation among other things otherwise (if Ukraine does not agree) Russia will attack with a Thermorabic bomb on the capital Kiev, which would desimate the city and overthrow the government, the leaks were written by the Russian Ministry of Defence as part of the previously mentioned Plan B and at the meeting with Shoigu today Putin allegedly, according to hacker Putin gave the order to proceed if Zelensky doesn't give in. Whilst I wouldn't take for certain, due to it being from an anonymous hacker, could be a plausible outcome.
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Post by SILENCED on Feb 27, 2022 14:06:48 GMT
Breaking News: Putin ordered Russian Defence Minister, Sergei Shoigu and the Russian Army into nuclear deterrence mode. Last inflicted all the way back in 1962 with nukes transported to Cuba (Cuban Missile Crisis) the Nuclear Deterrence Mode provides for Russian Nuclear Rockets to be placed in launching mode, ready to attack; following what Putin called, 'aggressive statements and actions' by the West. Whilst Russia wanted negotions in Belarusian City Gomel, Zelensky now agreed to negotiations in the Belarusian-Ukrainian border. Oppositionist hacker revealed Russia will demand immediate concessions from Ukraine including neutrality, federalisation among other things otherwise (if Ukraine does not agree) Russia will attack with a Thermorabic bomb on the capital Kiev, which would desimate the city and overthrow the government, the leaks were written by the Russian Ministry of Defence as part of the previously mentioned Plan B and at the meeting with Shoigu today Putin allegedly, according to hacker Putin gave the order to proceed if Zelensky doesn't give in. Whilst I wouldn't take for certain, due to it being from an anonymous hacker, could be a plausible outcome. Someone needs to get in there and assassinate Putin. This will only end badly otherwise. |
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Post by dashing0ne on Feb 27, 2022 14:27:10 GMT
Breaking News: Putin ordered Russian Defence Minister, Sergei Shoigu and the Russian Army into nuclear deterrence mode. Last inflicted all the way back in 1962 with nukes transported to Cuba (Cuban Missile Crisis) the Nuclear Deterrence Mode provides for Russian Nuclear Rockets to be placed in launching mode, ready to attack; following what Putin called, 'aggressive statements and actions' by the West. Whilst Russia wanted negotions in Belarusian City Gomel, Zelensky now agreed to negotiations in the Belarusian-Ukrainian border. Oppositionist hacker revealed Russia will demand immediate concessions from Ukraine including neutrality, federalisation among other things otherwise (if Ukraine does not agree) Russia will attack with a Thermorabic bomb on the capital Kiev, which would desimate the city and overthrow the government, the leaks were written by the Russian Ministry of Defence as part of the previously mentioned Plan B and at the meeting with Shoigu today Putin allegedly, according to hacker Putin gave the order to proceed if Zelensky doesn't give in. Whilst I wouldn't take for certain, due to it being from an anonymous hacker, could be a plausible outcome. Someone needs to get in there and assassinate Putin. This will only end badly otherwise. The problem is its nearly impossible. It's open secret that he is sitting in his (that can withstand a nuclear attack) bunker for 3 years and he moves across Russia perhaps every day for security concerns. Whilst I doubt Putin will launch nuclear weapons, it is still very concerning that this trajectory is being followed. From NATO at the Baltics and the ambient relations of Ukraine with the West, Russia is feeling the same way as the USA felt when there were Soviet nukes in Cuba a mere 30 km from Miami. Essentially, Zelensky is facing a choice, either lose honourably in a war to Russia as Kyiv will be destroyed by these perplexing scary hypersonic bombs or surrender and probably save lives of Ukrainians.
How awful.
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Post by SILENCED on Feb 27, 2022 14:31:20 GMT
Someone needs to get in there and assassinate Putin. This will only end badly otherwise. The problem is its nearly impossible. It's open secret that he is sitting in his (that can withstand a nuclear attack) bunker for 3 years and he moves across Russia perhaps every day for security concerns. Whilst I doubt Putin will launch nuclear weapons, it is still very concerning that this trajectory is being followed. From NATO at the Baltics and the ambient relations of Ukraine with the West, Russia is feeling the same way as the USA felt when there were Soviet nukes in Cuba a mere 30 km from Miami. Essentially, Zelensky is facing a choice, either lose honourably in a war to Russia as Kyiv will be destroyed by these perplexing scary hypersonic bombs or surrender and probably save lives of Ukrainians.
How awful.
Would you readily accept your loss of freedoms for a totalitarian state in the UK? If not, why should the Ukrainians? Surely he should be looking at why his neighbours are choosing to side with NATO and the EU rather than Russia. His current actions are just proving that those already in NATO, made the right choice. If it escalates the way you were stating, it will be very hard for the west to sit back and do nothing. |
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Post by dashing0ne on Feb 27, 2022 14:56:15 GMT
The problem is its nearly impossible. It's open secret that he is sitting in his (that can withstand a nuclear attack) bunker for 3 years and he moves across Russia perhaps every day for security concerns. Whilst I doubt Putin will launch nuclear weapons, it is still very concerning that this trajectory is being followed. From NATO at the Baltics and the ambient relations of Ukraine with the West, Russia is feeling the same way as the USA felt when there were Soviet nukes in Cuba a mere 30 km from Miami. Essentially, Zelensky is facing a choice, either lose honourably in a war to Russia as Kyiv will be destroyed by these perplexing scary hypersonic bombs or surrender and probably save lives of Ukrainians.
How awful.
Would you readily accept your loss of freedoms for a totalitarian state in the UK? If not, why should the Ukrainians? Surely he should be looking at why his neighbours are choosing to side with NATO and the EU rather than Russia. His current actions are just proving that those already in NATO, made the right choice. If it escalates the way you were stating, it will be very hard for the west to sit back and do nothing. The problem is that it is not in the West's strategic interests to go to war with a military superpower as there would be much more loss than gains for the West. Ukraine is important for Russia as a buffer of flat land. I am very grateful for living in the UK a land of freedom both economically and politically, but living in a totalitarian state is bad but not as bad when your entire family is wiped out, in a Russian-style authoritarian state everybody lives their lives but should keep quiet politically, and whilst Western democracy is definitely a privilege that should be a universal right I would not want perhaps a million people to die of an attack like this. Mentality does vary between people especially of different backgrounds and what may seem rational to others may not to different peoples. What I can say that Ukrainians are a good people, brotherly to Russians, and it is something to be admired, their determination to live in a free state, and in such an attack every Ukrainian who died on that attack especially those fighting, will be smiled in history. The reason I think at this stage, an escalation is likely, as it would make Russia look weak in front of the West (more to governments than people), surrendering to such a smaller power like Ukraine and Russia will most likely procceed because it can. |
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Post by SILENCED on Feb 27, 2022 15:03:02 GMT
Would you readily accept your loss of freedoms for a totalitarian state in the UK? If not, why should the Ukrainians? Surely he should be looking at why his neighbours are choosing to side with NATO and the EU rather than Russia. His current actions are just proving that those already in NATO, made the right choice. If it escalates the way you were stating, it will be very hard for the west to sit back and do nothing. The problem is that it is not in the West's strategic interests to go to war with a military superpower as there would be much more loss than gains for the West. Ukraine is important for Russia as a buffer of flat land. I am very grateful for living in the UK a land of freedom both economically and politically, but living in a totalitarian state is bad but not as bad when your entire family is wiped out, in a Russian-style authoritarian state everybody lives their lives but should keep quiet politically, and whilst Western democracy is definitely a privilege that should be a universal right I would not want perhaps a million people to die of an attack like this. Mentality does vary between people especially of different backgrounds and what may seem rational to others may not to different peoples. What I can say that Ukrainians are a good people, brotherly to Russians, and it is something to be admired, their determination to live in a free state, and in such an attack every Ukrainian who died on that attack especially those fighting, will be smiled in history. The reason I think at this stage, an escalation is likely, as it would make Russia look weak in front of the West (more to governments than people), surrendering to such a smaller power like Ukraine and Russia will most likely procceed because it can. If Putin uses any kind of Nuclear weapons, it will be worse than the actions of Hitler in the build up to WWW2. Are you saying we should have just left Hitler to carry out the atrocities of the 30s and 40s ... that seems to be the modern day view you are taking. If Russia were to ever get to our shores, we will have already lost, in your view, when should the west step in? I fully support the Ukrainian nations and people's right to self determination, not have it imposed on them by an out of control despot dictator. |
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. If China takes Taiwan over, it's the end for the West for reasons explained in previous posts on this thread, and America will probably go to war over it due to its importance.