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Post by Eastlondoner62 on Jul 7, 2023 12:42:26 GMT
Romford has direct trains to Stratford and central London but the areas where the 66 serves do not have any nearby train stations, like around Marks Gate and Little Heath. Whether people from those areas would suddenly jump from catching a bus to Chadwell Heath/Goodmayes then going onto the Elizabeth line, to taking an express route to London is a different matter. Although I'd imagine journey times would not improve but it gives them another option to travel You seem to be forgetting about Newbury Park as another option that people go to as well. Yes, there are a select few who opt for Newbury Park as well with the 296. Not many actually use the 66 as you need to walk out onto the A12 and it's not the most pleasant walk. The 62 tends to be frequent enough for people there who need the bus. |
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Post by MKAY315 on Jul 7, 2023 13:22:30 GMT
You seem to be forgetting about Newbury Park as another option that people go to as well. Yes, there are a select few who opt for Newbury Park as well with the 296. Not many actually use the 66 as you need to walk out onto the A12 and it's not the most pleasant walk. The 62 tends to be frequent enough for people there who need the bus. Ah yes those subways in Eastern Avenue that stinks of Pxss near the Rose Lane Estate. |
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Post by northlondon83 on Jul 7, 2023 13:40:35 GMT
Yes, there are a select few who opt for Newbury Park as well with the 296. Not many actually use the 66 as you need to walk out onto the A12 and it's not the most pleasant walk. The 62 tends to be frequent enough for people there who need the bus. Ah yes those subways in Eastern Avenue that stinks of Pxss near the Rose Lane Estate. Unfortunately a lot of subways smell of pee, like in Cranford on the A4 |
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Post by route53 on Jul 7, 2023 16:46:53 GMT
It’s still a busy route with pinch points, it doesn’t have a direct rail competitor so I think an X53 would still work today. And with South Eastern majorly downgrading their timetable rendering it useless and pointless the 53 has seen an increase of usage recently. As we have seen thou the X version would probably pinch resources from the 53. New X53 but the 53 will drop to every 9 mins let's say. I remember when the 53 was up to every 2-4 mins between Woolwich and TSQ in the peaks. Did it get an increase in 1999 when the X53 was withdrawn? Can’t remember if it did have an increase, in the peaks it was every 4 mins, even with the X53 which was a peak hour only service, but I do recall them reducing the 53 upon the advent of the 453. On the X53 it wasn’t the first express version of the 53, there was another one which ran from 1986 to 1993, this was the 53X, which ran from Plumstead along the same stops as the 53 but obviously skipping every two or three stops. The 53X ran concurrently with the 177E (the 177 express) this ran from Thamesmead to Victoria, with a nonstop section from Woolwich to Waterloo which given how much the 177 parallels with the Greenwich line showed that LT was far more up front about competing with local railway lines at the time than TfL are, especially since all Greenwich line trains at the time went to Waterloo East and Charing Cross In 1993 the 177 was rerouted away from E&C to Peckham, so they axed the express route but this left Thamesmead without a link to Central London in the peaks, so they restructured the 53X and merged it with the 177E to create the X53, this route took the more direct route between Plumstead & Woolwich and between Blackheath & Elephant it stopped only at New Cross and had no stops along the OKR. When it was axed in 1999 there was local outcry, one of my parent’s friends at the time had just bought a house in Thamesmead for the purpose of getting the X53 to and from work, said it was as if Thamesmead had lost its own railway, LT (which would soon become TfL) cited the Jubilee line and heavily promoted the 472 as a result, plus they had reintroduced the 177 back to the area to appease the locals. If I’ve missed out details please add to it :-) |
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Post by WH241 on Jul 7, 2023 16:48:59 GMT
An express route like the X66 would be anything but express! There is far too much congestion along route you propose especially in the Leytonstone area. It is all very well proposing express routes but you have to ask is there demand for such routes especially from Romford to central London which can be done in around 25 mins and even quicker on direct trains from Romford which is 6 mins to Stratford.
Romford has direct trains to Stratford and central London but the areas where the 66 serves do not have any nearby train stations, like around Marks Gate and Little Heath. Whether people from those areas would suddenly jump from catching a bus to Chadwell Heath/Goodmayes then going onto the Elizabeth line, to taking an express route to London is a different matter. Although I'd imagine journey times would not improve but it gives them another option to travel As I said in my previous reply these routes might marketed as express or super but in reality they are still going to hit the same congestion other buses experience. Really couldn't see anyone traveling from places like Marks Gate via Leytonstone and Stratford on a bus into central London.
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Post by southlondonbus on Jul 7, 2023 17:27:28 GMT
As we have seen thou the X version would probably pinch resources from the 53. New X53 but the 53 will drop to every 9 mins let's say. I remember when the 53 was up to every 2-4 mins between Woolwich and TSQ in the peaks. Did it get an increase in 1999 when the X53 was withdrawn? Can’t remember if it did have an increase, in the peaks it was every 4 mins, even with the X53 which was a peak hour only service, but I do recall them reducing the 53 upon the advent of the 453. On the X53 it wasn’t the first express version of the 53, there was another one which ran from 1986 to 1993, this was the 53X, which ran from Plumstead along the same stops as the 53 but obviously skipping every two or three stops. The 53X ran concurrently with the 177E (the 177 express) this ran from Thamesmead to Victoria, with a nonstop section from Woolwich to Waterloo which given how much the 177 parallels with the Greenwich line showed that LT was far more up front about competing with local railway lines at the time than TfL are, especially since all Greenwich line trains at the time went to Waterloo East and Charing Cross In 1993 the 177 was rerouted away from E&C to Peckham, so they axed the express route but this left Thamesmead without a link to Central London in the peaks, so they restructured the 53X and merged it with the 177E to create the X53, this route took the more direct route between Plumstead & Woolwich and between Blackheath & Elephant it stopped only at New Cross and had no stops along the OKR. When it was axed in 1999 there was local outcry, one of my parent’s friends at the time had just bought a house in Thamesmead for the purpose of getting the X53 to and from work, said it was as if Thamesmead had lost its own railway, LT (which would soon become TfL) cited the Jubilee line and heavily promoted the 472 as a result, plus they had reintroduced the 177 back to the area to appease the locals. If I’ve missed out details please add to it :-) I wonder if in 1999 when the X53 was axed whether LT were thinking that changes would be made to the 53 at the same time. As this was pre TFL would a consultation been necessary and did the 53 go out to consultation? |
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Post by redexpress on Jul 7, 2023 20:31:39 GMT
Can’t remember if it did have an increase, in the peaks it was every 4 mins, even with the X53 which was a peak hour only service, but I do recall them reducing the 53 upon the advent of the 453. On the X53 it wasn’t the first express version of the 53, there was another one which ran from 1986 to 1993, this was the 53X, which ran from Plumstead along the same stops as the 53 but obviously skipping every two or three stops. The 53X ran concurrently with the 177E (the 177 express) this ran from Thamesmead to Victoria, with a nonstop section from Woolwich to Waterloo which given how much the 177 parallels with the Greenwich line showed that LT was far more up front about competing with local railway lines at the time than TfL are, especially since all Greenwich line trains at the time went to Waterloo East and Charing Cross In 1993 the 177 was rerouted away from E&C to Peckham, so they axed the express route but this left Thamesmead without a link to Central London in the peaks, so they restructured the 53X and merged it with the 177E to create the X53, this route took the more direct route between Plumstead & Woolwich and between Blackheath & Elephant it stopped only at New Cross and had no stops along the OKR. When it was axed in 1999 there was local outcry, one of my parent’s friends at the time had just bought a house in Thamesmead for the purpose of getting the X53 to and from work, said it was as if Thamesmead had lost its own railway, LT (which would soon become TfL) cited the Jubilee line and heavily promoted the 472 as a result, plus they had reintroduced the 177 back to the area to appease the locals. If I’ve missed out details please add to it :-) I wonder if in 1999 when the X53 was axed whether LT were thinking that changes would be made to the 53 at the same time. As this was pre TFL would a consultation been necessary and did the 53 go out to consultation? Don't know if there was a consultation but there was certainly a plan to split the 53 when it was put out to tender in 1999. The 53 would have been Oxford Circus - New Cross with a new 453 covering Elephant - Plumstead. |
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Post by southlondonbus on Jul 7, 2023 20:44:10 GMT
I wonder if in 1999 when the X53 was axed whether LT were thinking that changes would be made to the 53 at the same time. As this was pre TFL would a consultation been necessary and did the 53 go out to consultation? Don't know if there was a consultation but there was certainly a plan to split the 53 when it was put out to tender in 1999. The 53 would have been Oxford Circus - New Cross with a new 453 covering Elephant - Plumstead. Was quite a drastic change really. |
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Post by MKAY315 on Jul 7, 2023 20:50:46 GMT
I wonder if in 1999 when the X53 was axed whether LT were thinking that changes would be made to the 53 at the same time. As this was pre TFL would a consultation been necessary and did the 53 go out to consultation? Don't know if there was a consultation but there was certainly a plan to split the 53 when it was put out to tender in 1999. The 53 would have been Oxford Circus - New Cross with a new 453 covering Elephant - Plumstead. They're still one cut away from achieving this. |
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Post by southlondonbus on Jul 7, 2023 21:29:58 GMT
Don't know if there was a consultation but there was certainly a plan to split the 53 when it was put out to tender in 1999. The 53 would have been Oxford Circus - New Cross with a new 453 covering Elephant - Plumstead. They're still one cut away from achieving this. Not quite as the 453 does overlap a bit more to Deptford then what was originally planned but yes I'm sure at some point the 53 will only reach Elephant. |
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Post by COBO on Jul 7, 2023 22:14:40 GMT
I wonder what made them change the new and existing routes to SL?
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Post by southlondonbus on Jul 7, 2023 22:21:31 GMT
I wonder what made them change the new and existing routes to SL? Headlines I would say. Will be presented as totally new routes as a way of showing improvements in outer London |
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Post by northlondon83 on Jul 7, 2023 22:54:09 GMT
I wonder what made them change the new and existing routes to SL? I'm assuming you mean letter prefix changes. Probably SuperLoop |
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Post by COBO on Jul 9, 2023 17:07:06 GMT
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Post by WH241 on Jul 9, 2023 17:15:46 GMT
Where was it confirmed the x34 would be SL1? I thought the only confirmed number was SL8 for the 607. |
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