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Post by buspete on Jun 22, 2024 16:14:08 GMT
The current 2 go on to Brighton.
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Post by greenboy on Jun 22, 2024 17:41:40 GMT
I am just about to travel on the Arun Valley Line, to catch some theatre in Chichester. Anyway it was me who introduced the subject of Gatwick Exprees and it provoked many thoughtful and considered replies. The board seems to agree that Gatwick Express trains should call additionally at Clapham Junction, but not East Croydon. There is no value in terminating the London Bridge - East Croydon train at East Croydon. The Arun Line should continue as it does now, with trains splitting at Horsham. So when the 2 extra trains per hour on the Gatwick Express gets re-introduced should they just run the Victoria - Gatwick shuttle and terminate at Gatwick? I'm not sure it's possible to stop all trains at Clapham Junction because of track capacity, ie holding up following trains. I don't understand your point about no value in terminating London Bridge via Norbury trains at East Croydon, where else could they go?
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Post by SILENCED on Jun 22, 2024 17:48:20 GMT
I am just about to travel on the Arun Valley Line, to catch some theatre in Chichester. Anyway it was me who introduced the subject of Gatwick Exprees and it provoked many thoughtful and considered replies. The board seems to agree that Gatwick Express trains should call additionally at Clapham Junction, but not East Croydon. There is no value in terminating the London Bridge - East Croydon train at East Croydon. The Arun Line should continue as it does now, with trains splitting at Horsham. So when the 2 extra trains per hour on the Gatwick Express gets re-introduced should they just run the Victoria - Gatwick shuttle and terminate at Gatwick? I'm not sure it's possible to stop all trains at Clapham Junction because of track capacity, ie holding up following trains. I don't understand your point about no value in terminating London Bridge via Norbury trains at East Croydon, where else could they go? Such a shame there is not longer Selhurst - Norwood Junction passenger services, used to love seeing all the different parts of the depot that you could not otherwise see, otherwise you could have a London Bridge - London Bridge service via Norbury and Forest Hill.
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Post by PGAT on Jun 22, 2024 18:15:11 GMT
I am just about to travel on the Arun Valley Line, to catch some theatre in Chichester. Anyway it was me who introduced the subject of Gatwick Exprees and it provoked many thoughtful and considered replies. The board seems to agree that Gatwick Express trains should call additionally at Clapham Junction, but not East Croydon. There is no value in terminating the London Bridge - East Croydon train at East Croydon. The Arun Line should continue as it does now, with trains splitting at Horsham. So when the 2 extra trains per hour on the Gatwick Express gets re-introduced should they just run the Victoria - Gatwick shuttle and terminate at Gatwick? I'm not sure it's possible to stop all trains at Clapham Junction because of track capacity, ie holding up following trains. I don't understand your point about no value in terminating London Bridge via Norbury trains at East Croydon, where else could they go? I'm sure I have said this before but 4tph worth of capacity are no longer on the fasts (the GX shuttle and peak Victoria-Caterham/Tattenham Corner) so a stop at Clapham can definitely be fitted in. The reason is almost certainly that the primary purpose of Gatwick Express would be shattered with an extra stop
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Post by vjaska on Jun 22, 2024 18:22:22 GMT
I'm not sure it's possible to stop all trains at Clapham Junction because of track capacity, ie holding up following trains. I don't understand your point about no value in terminating London Bridge via Norbury trains at East Croydon, where else could they go? Such a shame there is not longer Selhurst - Norwood Junction passenger services, used to love seeing all the different parts of the depot that you could not otherwise see, otherwise you could have a London Bridge - London Bridge service via Norbury and Forest Hill. So everyone who values the service via Norbury should lose their link to East Croydon so you can ride a train through a depot? As if the via Norbury service hasn’t been kicked in the teeth enough in recent years
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Post by SILENCED on Jun 22, 2024 18:29:05 GMT
Such a shame there is not longer Selhurst - Norwood Junction passenger services, used to love seeing all the different parts of the depot that you could not otherwise see, otherwise you could have a London Bridge - London Bridge service via Norbury and Forest Hill. So everyone who values the service via Norbury should lose their link to East Croydon so you can ride a train through a depot? As if the via Norbury service hasn’t been kicked in the teeth enough in recent years People been moaning about terminating service at East Croydon .... As solution to free the path, and probably open others up! Just saying what happened to the service in the old days .... it's not something that can happen now, the line has been altered.
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Post by vjaska on Jun 22, 2024 19:01:16 GMT
So everyone who values the service via Norbury should lose their link to East Croydon so you can ride a train through a depot? As if the via Norbury service hasn’t been kicked in the teeth enough in recent years People been moaning about terminating service at East Croydon .... As solution to free the path, and probably open others up! Just saying what happened to the service in the old days .... it's not something that can happen now, the line has been altered. The service should go beyond East Croydon as it did prior to the cuts and should go back to a 8 car service as it did prior to the cuts, not shoved through a depot.
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Post by southlondonbus on Jun 23, 2024 16:03:36 GMT
People been moaning about terminating service at East Croydon .... As solution to free the path, and probably open others up! Just saying what happened to the service in the old days .... it's not something that can happen now, the line has been altered. The service should go beyond East Croydon as it did prior to the cuts and should go back to a 8 car service as it did prior to the cuts, not shoved through a depot. I remember when Norbury was on the stopping Caterham to Victoria service along with I think 1 from Epsom Downs, 1 from Epsom and 2 starting at Sutton I think. I think Caterham one was all day everyday from memory.
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Post by PGAT on Jun 23, 2024 16:10:28 GMT
The service should go beyond East Croydon as it did prior to the cuts and should go back to a 8 car service as it did prior to the cuts, not shoved through a depot. I remember when Norbury was on the stopping Caterham to Victoria service along with I think 1 from Epsom Downs, 1 from Epsom and 2 starting at Sutton I think. I think Caterham one was all day everyday from memory. Yes from May 2018 the Caterham service went to London Bridge instead and in September 2022 it was cut back to East Croydon
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Post by southlondonbus on Jun 23, 2024 16:35:54 GMT
I remember when Norbury was on the stopping Caterham to Victoria service along with I think 1 from Epsom Downs, 1 from Epsom and 2 starting at Sutton I think. I think Caterham one was all day everyday from memory. Yes from May 2018 the Caterham service went to London Bridge instead and in September 2022 it was cut back to East Croydon I think that was when the Coulsdon Town to LB via Penge West started aswell. That's gone aswell now I think.
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Post by gwiwer on Jun 25, 2024 22:32:33 GMT
Terminating and reversing trains at East Croydon is not an option these days. It requires a platform to be occupied for at least ten minutes for practical purposes in giving a train a decent turnback time to allow for late running. With all the white worms requiring platform and track space that would cause significant upheaval. For this reason the WLL service is restricted to once an hour. Coulsdon Town has been used in the past as a handy turnback to relive East Croydon as much as to offer improved local services there. Traffic barely supports them.
Two-an-hour GatEx is plenty for the traffic offering on that service as it stands. That is because of the premium fares charged and the absence of connectivity. You pay extra for a red train instead of a green one, which has seats that may be harder than those on the green ones (some green seats are the same, some better) and you are scheduled to get to or from Victoria as little as 3 minutes faster than the cheaper trains. If you don't want Victoria you have to use the Southern or Thameslink services anyway. Which is why the green ones overload so badly - and in the process are also delayed - as a large number of airport users require the change at Clapham Junction. All journeys can also be made via Victoria but for many that is at a time and fares penalty.
I hope to see railway managers in charge of the railways once again rather than the desk-jockeys of Whitehall who might not even know what a train looks like. I'm not holding my breath on that.
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Post by PGAT on Jun 25, 2024 22:42:45 GMT
I don’t actually think the WLL is restricted to 1tph for that reason. Pre-covid they had 2tph in the peaks but they had 1 off-peak and it remains like this today presumably because the demand isn’t high enough. Even if times have changed then the limiting factor for 2tph would be fitting it alongside freight paths instead of Platform 5 at East Croydon
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Post by buspete on Jun 28, 2024 21:56:34 GMT
Just out of interest how do Southern get away with charging for first class? It is the same table, with the same seat but with a head cover.
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Post by Busboy105 on Jun 28, 2024 22:19:32 GMT
Just out of interest how do Southern get away with charging for first class? It is the same table, with the same seat but with a head cover. Isn't it the same with most first classes at train companies?
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