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Post by buspete on Dec 1, 2020 18:03:10 GMT
Well it is 34 years since Roundabout was conceived for Orpington, I dare say some of you weren’t even born then. I was only 12 whe; this was introduced so to someone that was about to become a teenager and loved buses, this was excellent for me and I lived in the area at the time.
Well you had the;
R1 Sidcup - Green Street Green - Bromley Common.
Run in 2 sections Sidcup Queen Mary’s Hospital - Green Street Green and St Paul’s Cray - Bromley Common
Each section run every 15 minutes. Giving a 7-8 minute service St Paul Cray to Green St Green.
In the evening and Sunday it run Sidcup Queen Mary’s Hospital - Bromley Common, think it run every 20 minutes?
Served a new area in the St Paul Cray area (Grovelands)
Replaced route 229 between Sidcup and Orpington and 261 between Orpington and Bromley Common.
I think when the 229 got replaced it only run every 30 minutes at the time, so gave a massive frequency boost.
R2 Orpington Station - Biggin Hill Valley
Replaced Tillingbourne Bus 858.
Generally an hourly service Monday to Friday. As was the 858.
R3 Petts Wood Station - Green St Green via Chelsfield Station
Replaced bus route 284 between Petts Wood Station and Orpington and part of 493 between Orpington and and Green St Green via Chelsfield Station. Both 284 and 493 used to run every hour. The R3 run every 20 minutes, so service was trebled.
R4 St Paul’s Cray Hill to Locks Bottom via Farnbourgh.
A whole new service that run every 29 minutes as it does now, serving many roads that were unserved. Must have been a blessing to residents of St Paul Hill as that was a rotten hill to walk up.
R5 Orpington - Knockholt Circular
Replaced London Country bus 471, run every hour, so similar frequency to the the 471.
R6 Orpington - Sevonoaks
Replaced bus 431, run every 2 hour as did the 431.
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Post by Busboy105 on Dec 1, 2020 18:58:44 GMT
Well it is 34 years since Roundabout was conceived for Orpington, I dare say some of you weren’t even born then. I was only 12 whe; this was introduced so to someone that was about to become a teenager and loved buses, this was excellent for me and I lived in the area at the time. Well you had the; R1 Sidcup - Green Street Green - Bromley Common. Run in 2 sections Sidcup Queen Mary’s Hospital - Green Street Green and St Paul’s Cray - Bromley Common Each section run every 15 minutes. Giving a 7-8 minute service St Paul Cray to Green St Green. In the evening and Sunday it run Sidcup Queen Mary’s Hospital - Bromley Common, think it run every 20 minutes? Served a new area in the St Paul Cray area (Grovelands) Replaced route 229 between Sidcup and Orpington and 261 between Orpington and Bromley Common. I think when the 229 got replaced it only run every 30 minutes at the time, so gave a massive frequency boost. R2 Orpington Station - Biggin Hill Valley Replaced Tillingbourne Bus 858. Generally an hourly service Monday to Friday. As was the 858. R3 Petts Wood Station - Green St Green via Chelsfield Station Replaced bus route 284 between Petts Wood Station and Orpington and part of 493 between Orpington and and Green St Green via Chelsfield Station. Both 284 and 493 used to run every hour. The R3 run every 20 minutes, so service was trebled. R4 St Paul’s Cray Hill to Locks Bottom via Farnbourgh. A whole new service that run every 29 minutes as it does now, serving many roads that were unserved. Must have been a blessing to residents of St Paul Hill as that was a rotten hill to walk up. R5 Orpington - Knockholt Circular Replaced London Country bus 471, run every hour, so similar frequency to the the 471. R6 Orpington - Sevonoaks Replaced bus 431, run every 2 hour as did the 431. Why was it known as Roundabout? Surely O or OR for Orpington would be much better? |
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Post by vjaska on Dec 1, 2020 19:04:20 GMT
Well it is 34 years since Roundabout was conceived for Orpington, I dare say some of you weren’t even born then. I was only 12 whe; this was introduced so to someone that was about to become a teenager and loved buses, this was excellent for me and I lived in the area at the time. Well you had the; R1 Sidcup - Green Street Green - Bromley Common. Run in 2 sections Sidcup Queen Mary’s Hospital - Green Street Green and St Paul’s Cray - Bromley Common Each section run every 15 minutes. Giving a 7-8 minute service St Paul Cray to Green St Green. In the evening and Sunday it run Sidcup Queen Mary’s Hospital - Bromley Common, think it run every 20 minutes? Served a new area in the St Paul Cray area (Grovelands) Replaced route 229 between Sidcup and Orpington and 261 between Orpington and Bromley Common. I think when the 229 got replaced it only run every 30 minutes at the time, so gave a massive frequency boost. R2 Orpington Station - Biggin Hill Valley Replaced Tillingbourne Bus 858. Generally an hourly service Monday to Friday. As was the 858. R3 Petts Wood Station - Green St Green via Chelsfield Station Replaced bus route 284 between Petts Wood Station and Orpington and part of 493 between Orpington and and Green St Green via Chelsfield Station. Both 284 and 493 used to run every hour. The R3 run every 20 minutes, so service was trebled. R4 St Paul’s Cray Hill to Locks Bottom via Farnbourgh. A whole new service that run every 29 minutes as it does now, serving many roads that were unserved. Must have been a blessing to residents of St Paul Hill as that was a rotten hill to walk up. R5 Orpington - Knockholt Circular Replaced London Country bus 471, run every hour, so similar frequency to the the 471. R6 Orpington - Sevonoaks Replaced bus 431, run every 2 hour as did the 431. Why was it known as Roundabout? Surely O or OR for Orpington would be much better? O would never be used as it would be confused with a 0. |
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Post by Busboy105 on Dec 1, 2020 19:08:45 GMT
Why was it known as Roundabout? Surely O or OR for Orpington would be much better? O would never be used as it would be confused with a 0. Yeah that makes sense. |
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Post by twobellstogo on Dec 1, 2020 20:45:09 GMT
I think the 229 was every 20 minutes in the mid 80s for the most part - don’t entirely quote me on this though. It was certainly every 20 minutes once it lost the Foots Cray - Green Street Green section.
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Post by southlondonbus on Dec 1, 2020 21:08:14 GMT
It was 20 mins up to 1999 as the new contract then took it to every 12 mins.
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Post by buspete on Dec 1, 2020 22:33:41 GMT
Was it 20 minutes when Roundabout took over?
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Post by danorak on Dec 2, 2020 13:46:41 GMT
Was it 20 minutes when Roundabout took over? A quick delve into the leaflet pile tells me that the 229 was x30mins off peak when the initial plans for Roundabout were conceived, but that it went to x20mins as part of the 2 November 85 revisions. London Bus Magazine 54 has a couple of good articles on the draft plans & initial reaction, while the book Roundabout: Orpington's Little Buses sets out the fuller story of the Roundabout years. |
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Post by buspete on Dec 3, 2020 23:16:52 GMT
Would fellow board members’ say Roundabout was an improvement to the services it replaced?
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Post by danorak on Dec 4, 2020 2:00:28 GMT
Would fellow board members’ say Roundabout was an improvement to the services it replaced? My experience of it was limited but I think you'd say a qualified 'yes'. On the plus side, you had more frequent and regular services, with new roads being served and friendly drivers. The R5 in particular was a great improvement on the motley collection of services it replaced. On the debit side, the R1 struggled with smaller vehicles and the Green St Green - Farnborough - Bromley corridor was a peculiar, unsatisfactory mix of services. The evolution of the 358 solved that one. |
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Post by southlondonbus on Dec 4, 2020 8:42:32 GMT
Whilst the idea of the network was to be local, the original R1 did slightly fall short replacing the 261 only as far as the Crown and not running into Bromley. Whilst it took a few years for the 358 to increase it still left a bit of a missing link. It also would have been good in 1991 to replace a few lost journeys between TB and Bromley as the 208 only provided replacement journeys to the Crown rather then TB when the 1 went.
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Post by stuckonthe486 on Dec 4, 2020 13:43:20 GMT
Would fellow board members’ say Roundabout was an improvement to the services it replaced? My experience of it was limited but I think you'd say a qualified 'yes'. On the plus side, you had more frequent and regular services, with new roads being served and friendly drivers. The R5 in particular was a great improvement on the motley collection of services it replaced. On the debit side, the R1 struggled with smaller vehicles and the Green St Green - Farnborough - Bromley corridor was a peculiar, unsatisfactory mix of services. The evolution of the 358 solved that one. Funny you mention the friendly drivers - I remember the promotional leaflet had a cartoon of a driver asking a mum "how did Johnny get on in his exams?" (or something like that) |
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Post by buspete on Dec 4, 2020 20:27:56 GMT
Was it 20 minutes when Roundabout took over? A quick delve into the leaflet pile tells me that the 229 was x30mins off peak when the initial plans for Roundabout were conceived, but that it went to x20mins as part of the 2 November 85 revisions. London Bus Magazine 54 has a couple of good articles on the draft plans & initial reaction, while the book Roundabout: Orpington's Little Buses sets out the fuller story of the Roundabout years. So as you say the 229 service was every 30 minutes, with the introduction of the R1 with 8 buses an hour, every 7/8 minutes would suggest that a massive upgrade of service happened, however in real terms there was a cut in capacity as the buses were so small, did someone say they are ‘breadvans’, the buses were so small. Today with the much bigger low floor single deckers which are much more suitable and desirable. With additional 4 buses an hour from St Mary’s Cray with the B14 and R6 the different is night and day. R3 was a big win for the residents of both Petts Wood and Chelsfield station as both areas got a big bump in services, with 2bph extra. R4 was also another big win for residents in St Paul Cray Hill and as I did in my original post it is a massive hill up Chalk Pit Avenueand some residents could have been completely isolated from a bus route before the R4, especially if you’re elderly. Around Farnbourgh (Tubbenden Lane) it certainly saved the residents a bit of a walk. |
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Post by southlondonbus on Dec 5, 2020 15:17:46 GMT
Would anyone say the H network in Hounslow was the only other attempt at the Roundabout network in London?
The S routes in Sutton were more about bring buses closer to homes and organically developed over the years and didnt actully replace any parts of existing routes really. Similar to the W series.
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Post by redexpress on Dec 5, 2020 20:44:13 GMT
Would anyone say the H network in Hounslow was the only other attempt at the Roundabout network in London? The S routes in Sutton were more about bring buses closer to homes and organically developed over the years and didnt actully replace any parts of existing routes really. Similar to the W series. I don't think anywhere in London got anything as radical as the Roundabout network. Certainly not Hounslow, where most of the routes just replaced existing (sections of) routes with Darts instead of DDs. The genuine novelties like H20, H24/H25 were separate initiatives funded by the Borough of Hounslow, and were not introduced in one go like the Roundabout network. |
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